BAFTE Has decided pistol grip shotguns are not shotguns

[Uriel999]

http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-...on-on-pistol-grip-shotguns-creates-new-danger

Read the article, this is dangerous. Yes I realize this technically belongs in the bearing arms section, but mods please let this stay in general politics for a bit as this is a huge problem. I bet many people who come to this forum may own a pistol grip shotgun and never even visit the bearing arms section.

Certain commercially produced firearms do not fall within the definition of shotgun under the GCA even though they utilize a shotgun shell for ammunition. For example, firearms that come equipped with a pistol grip in place of the buttstock are not shotguns as defined by the GCA.

An October 27, 2010, letter from the Firearms Technology Branch ruled that such a firearm, with a 17" barrel and 26-1/4" overall length, was not subject to the National Firearms Act.

The BATFE is apparently trying to make millions upon millions of unregistered NFA destructive devices. Could this be a another way they plan to extort money from the people in short time?

 

[ChickenHawk]

These people (BATFE) are total clowns. They say a pistol grip "shotgun" is not a shotgun and an example with a 17" barrel is not subject to NFA regulations therefore it can't be a destructive device so it must be a rifle or a pistol. But it can't be a pistol because the fore grip would make it subject to NFA regulations so I guess it's a rifle? but then the bore size would make it a destructive device but it can't be a destructive device because then it would be subject to NFA regulations which it is not. Am I missing something?

 

[oyarde]

Could it be because of the 17" barrel length ? I think the assholes require all shotgun barrels to be 18" or more ?

 

[GunnyFreedom]

 

[oyarde]

Bump

 

[RideTheDirt]

what if I have this

 

[ChickenHawk]

Could it be because of the 17" barrel length ? I think the assholes require all shotgun barrels to be 18" or more ?

According to the article the BATFE stated that a shotgun with a pistol grip that had a 17" barrel was not subject to the NFA because it was not considered a shotgun. The implication is that it is considered a rifle which are allowed to have 16" barrels. But because of the bore size it would be a destructive device and subject to the NFA so what they are saying makes no sense.

 

[Pericles]

The situation is a conflict in ATF rulings. They have ruled that a devise that fires shotgun shells without a shoulder stock is not a shotgun. Weapons with bores in excess of a half inch that are not shotguns are destructive devices and subject to the NFA (thus $200 tax and LEO approval or trust). But the ATF has not enforce the destructive device ruling on shotgun shell weapons, which leaves the owners of such weapons subject to prosecution for violating the NFA at any time.

That is the controversy - if you have a rifle that misfires, you can be in the situation of Olafson, and spend time in prison. But if you have a pistol grip shotgun, nothing happens.

 

[Texan4Life]

As it stands right now a shotgun with a 17" barrel is illegal unless you have registered it with tax stamp.

 

[tangent4ronpaul]

According to the article the BATFE stated that a shotgun with a pistol grip that had a 17" barrel was not subject to the NFA because it was not considered a shotgun. The implication is that it is considered a rifle which are allowed to have 16" barrels. But because of the bore size it would be a destructive device and subject to the NFA so what they are saying makes no sense.

I thought a 16" barrel on a rifle make it a "short barreled rifle" so requiring the $200 tax stamp and background check or trust.

-t

 

[pmbug]

what if I have this ...

The ATF letter talks about shotguns that have a pistol grip in place of a buttstock. If you have a pistol grip *with* a buttstock, this doesn't apply to you. Knoxx recoil reducing stocks with pistol grips should be all good as I read it.

 

[fisharmor]

The BATFE is apparently trying to make millions upon millions of unregistered NFA destructive devices. Could this be a another way they plan to extort money from the people in short time?

I think it's much more likely that they're simply too busy smelling their own kidneys to make this make any sense.

Despite their colon spelunking, I'm sure someone at the top realizes that without millions of gun owners in this country, BATFE has 20% of its business gone. It's in their interest to keep millions of gun owners in the country - I think they realize that having the children of relatively peaceful religious nutjobs locked in a building and burned alive isn't exactly a sustainable mission statement, so they kind of need the gun owners.

They'll always do crap like this regulatory snafu - they have to in order to justify their existence. But I seriously doubt they'll ever go door-to-door looking for the latest "illegal" firearm.

Of course, they'll be more than happy to put people in PMITA prison whenever they find one incidentally. But they'll get away with doing it one at a time.

 

[Koz]

what if I have this

Looks like a good Turkey stick to me.

 

[Esor]

what if I have this

We call that 'sexy'

 

[ChickenHawk]

I thought a 16" barrel on a rifle make it a "short barreled rifle" so requiring the $200 tax stamp and background check or trust.

-t

Minimum for a rifle is 16 and minimum for a shotgun is 18.

 

[puppetmaster]

http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-...on-on-pistol-grip-shotguns-creates-new-danger

Read the article, this is dangerous. Yes I realize this technically belongs in the bearing arms section, but mods please let this stay in general politics for a bit as this is a huge problem. I bet many people who come to this forum may own a pistol grip shotgun and never even visit the bearing arms section.





The BATFE is apparently trying to make millions upon millions of unregistered NFA destructive devices. Could this be a another way they plan to extort money from the people in short time?

Certain commercially produced firearms do not fall within the definition of shotgun under the GCA even though they utilize a shotgun shell for ammunition. For example, firearms that come equipped with a pistol grip in place of the buttstock are not shotguns as defined by the GCA.

if you have a buttstock and a grip then your good......right

 

[Toureg89]

These people (BATFE) are total clowns. They say a pistol grip "shotgun" is not a shotgun and an example with a 17" barrel is not subject to NFA regulations therefore it can't be a destructive device so it must be a rifle or a pistol. But it can't be a pistol because the fore grip would make it subject to NFA regulations so I guess it's a rifle? but then the bore size would make it a destructive device but it can't be a destructive device because then it would be subject to NFA regulations which it is not. Am I missing something?

they do this shit all the time. why else do you think we have rifles that are known as pistols as long as they dont have stocks?

 

[Toureg89]

Could it be because of the 17" barrel length ? I think the assholes require all shotgun barrels to be 18" or more ?

that's what i'm thinking. i'm pretty sure the SBS category regulates shotguns with barrel lengths under 18"

 

[smithtg]

These people (BATFE) are total clowns. They say a pistol grip "shotgun" is not a shotgun and an example with a 17" barrel is not subject to NFA regulations therefore it can't be a destructive device so it must be a rifle or a pistol. But it can't be a pistol because the fore grip would make it subject to NFA regulations so I guess it's a rifle? but then the bore size would make it a destructive device but it can't be a destructive device because then it would be subject to NFA regulations which it is not. Am I missing something?

another government entity that needs to go to reduce the deficit. They spent years and much $$ fighting hobby model rocket citizens over what a "high power" rocket motor was. Guess what - they lost too

 

[oyarde]

another government entity that needs to go to reduce the deficit. They spent years and much $$ fighting hobby model rocket citizens over what a "high power" rocket motor was. Guess what - they lost too

It should be the first to go .