2nd Planned Parenthood Video: Senior Executive Haggles Over Baby Parts Prices, Changes methods

[Brian4Liberty]

What prices are involved with adult organ donation? Is there a price for a heart or lungs?

Can a person sell a kidney?

 

[fisharmor]

What prices are involved with adult organ donation? Is there a price for a heart or lungs?

Can a person sell a kidney?

I think the insidious thing (which I haven't heard discussed yet) is that these aren't considered human organs. Selling human organs for transplant (specifically) is prohibited by federal law.
But the underlying ethics that led to the law is that the poor and disenfranchised would be compelled to consider "donating" if they were being compensated, which would lead to them as a class being dehumanized.

But the unborn have already been dehumanized: the underlying apology of abortion relies on the idea that the unborn are fundamentally not human beings.
nobody's_hero is doubly right - nothing will be done because nothing can be done, as we've pointed out - but also, nothing will be done for the reason that the pro-life crowd have already lost that argument.
These revelations are offensive only because they rub this fact - that fetuses are not legally humans - in our faces.

 

[timosman]

What prices are involved with adult organ donation? Is there a price for a heart or lungs?

Can a person sell a kidney?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_trade

 

[limequat]

To those arguing that the price is too small to prove a profit motive...consider that the grocery store makes a profit off of 49 cent bananas. It's all about volume.

How many abortions is PP performing each year? How many organs are sold?
It appears to me that the true market value of fetal tissue is probably in the thousands, but PP has to sell for these small prices that could reasonable be covered by "shipping and handling".
Everyone here knows what happens when government sets prices: corruption and black markets. I bet if someone was to dig deeper, they'd find some nice paid vacations and lavish gifts to high-level PP staff.

 

[donnay]

H/T: TahoeBlue

Dr. Mary Gatter: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know
http://heavy.com/news/2015/07/mary-gatter-planned-parenthood-video-center-for-medical-progress/

 

[limequat]

Here's an interesting article...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...d-parenthood-wont-stop-donating-fetal-organs/

So the biotech firms act like middle men between PP and drug companies. The tech firm buys fetal tissue for under $100 and then sells it to drug companies for close to $2000. The tissue suddenly becomes "human" at this point, as it is used to test human reaction to new drugs.

This reminds me of the experiments that Nazis performed on Jews.

 

[juleswin]

Then why in the video was she haggling for the best price she could get?

You can clearly see that she wasn't sure about the price. Any person examining this with an unbiased eye can clearly see that this is not something that they do all the time. Nobody is still touching my question, Is your belief that planned parenthood is risking it all for $75 per human tissue specimen?

I have thought so too, as in—this would be really hard to prosecute and prove wrong-doing. But after watching the first video again there is a part where Dr. Nucatola states that there are ways doctors can basically circumvent the law by saying that they 'accidentally' preserved a particular piece of the fetus and just happened to sell it. . . . I believe it was something along the lines of doctors claiming 'it wasn't my intent.' I don't really care to watch that video any more than I have to, but if I recall correctly that's what was said. You all can watch it again and tell me.

Meh. "Oops I accidentally completely preserved the tissue you requested while performing an abortion." You don't have to be a medical expert to know what such 'accidents' take a bit of effort and concentration to make them happen.

If they're not acting illegally, they're definitely taking steps to cover their actions, and you usually don't have to cover up something you did unless you know it is wrong.

It's a valid point though. Can it be proven? Aside from someone in the medical staff at an abortion clinic coming out and testifying under oath that PP doctors are intentionally targeting specific tissues or organs to meet a demand, I don't know how any outsider could prove it.

I think the price alone tell you that it is not a money making operation. Having the doctors and medical staff preserve your bio material for use in medical research costs money, packaging costs more, if it requires any kind of processing, it would cost money and shipping companies charge more for shipping bio material. Also, from my research days, the whole lab was constantly working around to be in compliance with govt regulation. If you think business are over regulated, wait until you enter medical research. Being conscious of govt regulations and trying to work within it is not evidence of a crime.

Watch and see, no charges would ever stick on them cos they weren't selling any human tissue.

I was unaware that shipping and handling costs (with no profit motive) were competitively haggled over.

You be surprised what cost can be involved in the whole operation. But I bet you that $75 is not even worth the risk for them.

inability of government prosecutors......they chose not to prosecute criminals all the time.

Can't tell me there isn't any conservative federal court judge that can hear this case. The problem is that even though it sounds really really bad, they are not violating any laws. The ridiculously low price per specimen that she offers is something you get selling legal blood plasma. Why use your doctors and highly specialized staff to harvest aborted human tissue when they could be doing just as well selling blood plasma.

There is no way they are making any kind of money selling human tissue at $75 a pop. I wouldn't be surprised if the disposal fees alone are half the price they are selling it.

 

[juleswin]

Here's an interesting article...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...d-parenthood-wont-stop-donating-fetal-organs/

So the biotech firms act like middle men between PP and drug companies. The tech firm buys fetal tissue for under $100 and then sells it to drug companies for close to $2000. The tissue suddenly becomes "human" at this point, as it is used to test human reaction to new drugs.

This reminds me of the experiments that Nazis performed on Jews.

So then go after the biotech companies. It seems like in your scenario it is the biotech companies selling the body parts not planned parenthood. Also what Nazi experiment on Jews does this remind you of? try to be specific please.

 

[donnay]

Here's an interesting article...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...d-parenthood-wont-stop-donating-fetal-organs/

So the biotech firms act like middle men between PP and drug companies. The tech firm buys fetal tissue for under $100 and then sells it to drug companies for close to $2000. The tissue suddenly becomes "human" at this point, as it is used to test human reaction to new drugs.

This reminds me of the experiments that Nazis performed on Jews.

That's because PP founder was a Nazi Sympathizer.

 

[timosman]

That's because PP founder was a Nazi Sympathizer.

A Nazi Sympathizer ? http://www.nyu.edu/projects/sanger/articles/sanger-hitler_equation.php

 

[donnay]

A Nazi Sympathizer ? http://www.nyu.edu/projects/sanger/articles/sanger-hitler_equation.php

Who were the unfit? Sanger laid it all out in 1938, when she praised Nazi Germany’s sterilization policies. The unfit (Hat tip: The Federalist) included those suffering from, “gongenital feeble-mindedness; schizophrenia, circular insanity; heredity epilepsy; hereditary chorea (Huntington’s)’ hereditary blindness or deafness; grave hereditary bodily deformity and chronic alcoholism.”

Reports in medical journals state that the indications laid down in the German law are being carefully observed. These are gongenital feeble-mindedness; schizophrenia, circular insanity; heredity epilepsy; hereditary chorea (Huntington’s)’ hereditary blindness or deafness; grave hereditary bodily deformity and chronic alcoholism.

Surely everyone will agree that the children of parents so afflicted are no contribution to the nation for even if they do not inherit these defects they are children of parents so handicapped that life will give them little, owing to their necessarily bad environment.

There are 1,700 special courts and 27 higher courts in Germany to review the cases certified for sterilization there. The rights of the individual could be equally well safeguarded here, but in no case should the rights of society, or which he or she is a member, be disregarded.

Source

 

[limequat]

So then go after the biotech companies.

Right, I'm surprised that nobody's mentioned this yet. It seems clear-cut that they are breaking the law, where it's fuzzy with PP.

It seems like in your scenario it is the biotech companies selling the body parts not planned parenthood. Also what Nazi experiment on Jews does this remind you of? try to be specific please.

This comes off incredibly condescending. Not sure what you're trying to prove, Nazi experimentation is well documented.
The connection in my mind is dehumanization. Nazis dehumanized jews, performed experiments on them. Americans dehumanized fetuses, performed experiments on them.
Here's the wiki page if you're interested in reading more:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_human_experimentation
and an excerpt

"From about September 1942 to about December 1943 experiments were conducted at the Ravensbrück concentration camp, for the benefit of the German Armed Forces, to study bone, muscle, and nerve regeneration, and bone transplantation from one person to another.[citation needed] Sections of bones, muscles, and nerves were removed from the subjects without use of anesthesia. As a result of these operations, many victims suffered intense agony, mutilation, and permanent disability."

 

[staerker]

You be surprised what cost can be involved in the whole operation. But I bet you that $75 is not even worth the risk for them.

You are missing the point altogether.

What is the cost for "shipping and handling?"

That price should be fixed (independent of what the buyer believes it should be.)

Anything above that fixed "shipping and handling" is profit.

So why is haggling taking place, when the "shipping and handling" is fixed?

Profit. $$$

Gotta sell murdered human parts to make ends meet.

 

[juleswin]

You are missing the point altogether.

What is the cost for "shipping and handling?"

That price should be fixed (independent of what the buyer believes it should be.)

Anything above that fixed "shipping and handling" is profit.

So why is haggling taking place, when the "shipping and handling" is fixed?

Profit. $$$

Gotta sell murdered human parts to make ends meet.

There are fixed cost and there are variable costs involved. Shipping costs maybe fixed but processing the bio material would likely be different for every fetus produced. I guess at the end they may be a little money left over from some parts sold and they lose money on others. The point is that it is highly unlikely that they are risking it all for a give or take $10 ish on every shipment.

I think this is not something they do a lot of so that why she was a little unsure about the price. Maybe Rand can help the justice dept sue PP if he is able to find a criminal offense in what was caught on tape.

 

[staerker]

There are fixed cost and there are variable costs involved. Shipping costs maybe fixed but processing the bio material would likely be different for every fetus produced. I guess at the end they may be a little money left over from some parts sold and they lose money on others. The point is that it is highly unlikely that they are risking it all for a give or take $10 ish on every shipment.

I think this is not something they do a lot of so that why she was a little unsure about the price. Maybe Rand can help the justice dept sue PP if he is able to find a criminal offense in what was caught on tape.

I can understand that some costs are "variable," but my usage of the term "fixed" meant "independent of the buyer."

If the "shipping and handling" = $50, and "processing" ranges between $2 and $9, then the cost upfront should have been $59. No pokerfaced haggling, as seen here.

I'm sure she hasn't been doing this for long, the market is new, and she still doesn't know her competitor's pricing.

Why would she consider competitor's pricing in her calculation? Because it doesn't just matter what your equipment is capable of, you have to undercut the market to break into it.

 

[juleswin]

I can understand that some costs are "variable," but my usage of the term "fixed" meant "independent of the buyer."

If the "shipping and handling" = $50, and "processing" ranges between $2 and $9, then the cost upfront should have been $59. No pokerfaced haggling, as seen here.

I'm sure she hasn't been doing this for long, the market is new, and she still doesn't know her competitor's pricing.

Why would she consider competitor's pricing in her calculation? Because it doesn't just matter what your equipment is capable of, you have to undercut the market to break into it.

Also you ask competitors price so you can go back and say to your workers, X competitor were able to do it for $50, you guys figure it out and get the price down within $50 price. I just think its a bit odd that this organization that uses doctors that are paid hundreds of thousands of dollars a year and other medical professional who are paid loads of money will try and make couple of dollars per human tissue. How many years, doctors clinics and abortions do you think it would take to make a 100k using this scheme? And at the risk of jail time and losing it all? It just doesn't add up

In the extensive world of health care industry, anyone selling you something this regulated, very limited and unique is not making any profit off it.

 

[Slave Mentality]

Also you ask competitors price so you can go back and say to your workers, X competitor were able to do it for $50, you guys figure it out and get the price down within $50 price. I just think its a bit odd that this organization that uses doctors that are paid hundreds of thousands of dollars a year and other medical professional who are paid loads of money will try and make couple of dollars per human tissue. How many years, doctors clinics and abortions do you think it would take to make a 100k using this scheme? And at the risk of jail time and losing it all? It just doesn't add up

In the extensive world of health care industry, anyone selling you something this regulated, very limited and unique is not making any profit off it.

They are making a hell of a lot more money now than they were making in the good old days of throwing fetuses in the trash can. I wonder what kind of cut the "mom" or "dad" get?

Its fucked up even thinking about this shit like we are talking about widgets being sold.

 

[JK/SEA]

just for the record, this revelation left me physically nauseated...

these fuckers are the bottom of the septic tank.

 

[brandon]

They already are doing the abortions anyway so whats wrong with selling the tissue to researchers?

 

[wizardwatson]

They already are doing the abortions anyway so whats wrong with selling the tissue to researchers?

Because it creates an additional profit incentive for an already immoral and anti-liberty enterprise. Plus it is vile and desecrates the remains of the murdered innocent.