Why such little support for Whole Foods?

[jclay2]

I don't care about their food and have not shopped there due to the price barrier. However, it is good if he is indeed on the same page as Ron for healthcare.

 

[brandon]

Water = Organic


Brando = Synthetic

Not to derail the thread with a semantics argument, but I personally have never really understood these two terms. Natural and Synthetic.

Isn't everything natural, unless it comes from like mars? And if synthetic just means something that humans had to make using raw ingredients, then wouldn't stuff like iced tea be synthetic? Obviously if that's the case then something isn't bad simply because it is synthetic.

 

[CCTelander]

I don't get it. The CEO of Whole Foods basically lays out Ron Paul's health plan in an op ed piece, the left calls for a boycott, and there's only one thread at RPF with 4 posts in it (2 from me).

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=205530

Glenn Beck makes a purposefully provocative (and questionable) statement, the left calls for a boycott and that spawns multiple threads with hundreds of posts and a "defend Beck" website.

Why is that? Do we care more about antics than thoughtful political debate that's actually helpful to our movement? Whole Foods needs your help. If we want companies to continue to go out on a limb and take on positions that are clearly right, but might not sit well with some of their less savvy customers, we need to show them some love. Just my thoughts.

Regards,

John M. Drake

My opinion? Because the majority here (although it IS, thankfully, a shrinking majority) are basically paleo-conservatives. They may call themselves libertarians, or libertarian leaning, but basically they pretty much toe the traditional conservative party line.

Most conservatives, at least in my experience, associate the organic food and natural health movements with the left and with new agers. As a result they seem to display a knee-jerk antipathy toward anything even remotely related to organic farming and gardening or natural health, usually without ever having done even the most basic research to learn anything about the subjects.

On top of that, again based upon my own experience and observations, conservatives have always had a strong tendency to accept arguments from authority. You see this in the near deification of the Founding Fathers, etc. As a result, since the medical establishment is constantly disparging anything to do with organic food and natural health, conservatives tend to take that kind of thing at face value. If a doctor says "all you get from suppliments is expensive urine," they tend to believe it, yet again based upon my personal experience and observations.

In the interests of full disclosure, I should probably mention that for most of my life I WAS a traditional conservative, and have been guilty myself, over the years, of some of these very same mistakes.

 

[Bucjason]

Let me break it down for you..


Water = Organic


Brando = Synthetic


YOU are supporting the synthetic "conventional" farming methods that is promoted by the establishment.


Ok, you OBVIOUSLY don't know what organic food is, and it is your attitude that is leading to the idiocracy society portrayed in the film.

Organic just means that you don't use dangerous, toxic, synthetic chemicals to feed your food and kill bugs. It means farming the way we've been doing for the last 5,000 years. How you compare organic farming to Brando is fucking mind blowing.

So you are saying we should just put water on the plants?? Like out of the toilet bowl ???

Relax , I'm just joking about Brando, because that is what this thread reminded me of....

 

[BenIsForRon]

What the hell are you talking about??? Do you even know what organic food is?!?!? As I said before, it's the food we've been eating for the last 5,000 years!! The ignorance here astounds me.

I have been eating organic for years, I assure you that the taste of organic food is generally better than the watery, stale, tasteless grocery store food grown with toxic chemicals.

Yeah, Michael Pollan said when you buy a tomato at the grocery store, you're not really buying a tomato, you're buying the image, or impression, of a tomato.

By the way Danno, make sure you read that story I linked on the first page, not all organic food is made in an environmentally sound way.

While I disagree with your assessment of Whole Foods what difference does it make? Their CEO practically endorsed the Ron Paul health care plan word for word! If we can't stand up honest debate on healthcare than what good are we? If you don't want to buy at Whole Foods the write letters to the editor, oppose the Obamanuts on their message boards, do SOMETHING!

And I personally think the whole "sustainability" ploy is what is BS. I like organic food because I don't want to eat pesticides and drink hormones. Global warming is utter nonsense.

Don't get me wrong, I'd much rather shop at whole foods than a normal grocery store, I just said that to explain why I'm not super excited to talk about them.

As for your second point, you should stop lumping all environmental concerns in with global warming. Global warming is the least of our problems when you think about the loss of farmland and degrading soil. And the topic of sustainability is just as much about economics as it is the environment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sustainable_development

I don't know the exact reasons, but I assume it has something to do with a higher overhead cost of growing food organically combined with a lower demand. Are you sure that organic farmers aren't federally subsidized?

Organic farming is hardly subsidized, if at all. Iowa and California industrial farmers get over 90% of subsidies, and just about all of those subsidies go to corn and soybeans. It's a fucking ponzi scheme by Monsanto and Coca-Cola.

Either way, it doesn't change the bottom line. The food costs more then I personally will pay for it. So I don't buy it.

Stop reading Ayn Rand and realize that this world about more than just you. Everytime you go to McDonalds instead of the farmers market you are making a vote to keep this current system going.

 

[specsaregood]

Why does it cost more to grow organically? The answer is that it doesn't really cost more. Food costs about the same to grow either way..

Depends on how you define "organic" IIRC the hybrid and GMO foods can still be listed as organic (I could be wrong though). And if you exclude those your statement isn't true. Because those hybrids have been bred to produce a LOT more than the non-hybrids, also they are usually more resistant to disease, insects, etc...

 

[LittleLightShining]

A little moral support would be nice. Get the word out to friends who live near Whole Foods and support freedom. Write letters to the editor in support of honest debate on healthcare. Talk about the issue. We don't have to put all of our energy into GB.

I haven't done anything for Glenn Beck. The market will work itself out-- just like it will with WF. I did, though, feature Mackey's editorial on my fb page which is disproportionately frequented by libs. I know it's not much but it's something.

Your assumption (bolded) is wrong. Even Ron Paul says that large factory farms end up with the food subsidies, and organic farms are usually smaller family farms.

Why does it cost more to grow organically? The answer is that it doesn't really cost more. Food costs about the same to grow either way.. but it is easier to grow on a large scale using "conventional" methods. Maybe save you a few %. That's all corporations care about. You pay substantially more because of the subsidies, not the cost of growing.

And I would bet you would pay for organic food if conventional food wasn't available, otherwise you would starve. If property rights were in place, you wouldn't have those foods available to you because they pollute other people's private property.

Either way, you are supporting the establishment food companies and you are directly giving more money to lobbyists to keep legislation in place that goes against individual abilities to make healthy food choices. It goes against the free market. And you are supporting it with your dollars. There are a million reasons not to buy conventionally grown food. It doesn't pollute, it's better for your body, you aren't supporting the establishment.. and I've found lots of reasonably priced organic food, you just have to look to your local growers!! But your'e too lazy, you'd rather support the establishment and play video games or some crap.

You're forgetting the astronomical cost of dealing with bureaucracy to be certified in the first place. I know more than a handful of farmers here who are organic in practice but not certified because of the red tape.

 

[dannno]

So you are the King of Taste ?? ...sorry your majesty , I didn't realize you control my taste buds , and not myself....

All I know is this : I odered a sandwich at Whole Foods , and it tasted like a shoe. I haven't been back since.
I reserve my right as an American to eat all the shitty food I damn well please , and I pay for my own health care . So a big F*ck You is in order to all you food nazi's.

Dude, seriously, you need to use some LOGIC. Do you really think that sandwich was bad because it was "organic"?? Most of the shit they sell at Whole Foods is in fact NOT organic, do you know for a fact that the sandwich you ate was even organic?? Sounds to me like the sandwich was stale. Guess what?? All food goes stale!

I spent YEARS eating conventional food and I've spent years eating organic food. You get ONE organic sandwich and SUDDENLY you are an expert on how organic food tastes and I don't know shit??? You have to be kidding me!

Not all organic food is going to taste good. Not all conventionally grown food is going to taste good. It depends on how it's grown, with proper nutrients, sunlight, harvesting methods, food preparation, storage, etc.. There are a million things that go into a sandwich that have nothing to do with whether it was grown organically or not.

 

[pacelli]

What the hell are you talking about??? Do you even know what organic food is?!?!? As I said before, it's the food we've been eating for the last 5,000 years!! The ignorance here astounds me.

I have been eating organic for years, I assure you that the taste of organic food is generally better than the watery, stale, tasteless grocery store food grown with toxic chemicals.

People who believe organic food 'tastes like crap' have conditioned their palates to a really wide range of interesting flavors. How DARE you lecture anyone about the merits of an organic diet? I mean, this stuff tastes a hell of a lot better than that organic garbage: High fructose corn syrup, partially hydrogenated oils, pesticides (like round-up), seed & plant fungicides, carbon monoxide, organocholines, DDT, dieldrin, and chlordane (to name a few off the top of my head).

That stuff tastes so good that its no wonder people think organic food tastes like crap.

Give me a steady diet of chemicals any day of the week--- but stay away from the mercury in the vaccines!!!


To stay on topic-- my only issue with Whole Foods is that most of their locally-grown vegetables are priced much much higher than buying it from their local source. I don't buy vegetables at the food store anymore since I grow my own, but even outside of veggies, at WF you can easily ring up a $200 bill on a single plastic bag of merchandise.

 

[BenIsForRon]

People instinctively look for three kinds of flavors: salt, sugar, and fat. These are the tastes that we looked for during our nomad days so we could know we were eating enough to survive. Of course, we missed out on many other important nutrients, and died around 30.

McDonalds understands this instinctive desire though, and they formulate their food to be borderline addictive by embracing those three properties to the max. Burger=fat. Soda=sugar. Fries=salt.

 

[brandon]

Stop reading Ayn Rand and realize that this world about more than just you. Everytime you go to McDonalds instead of the farmers market you are making a vote to keep this current system going.

SO you're telling me you avoid all products and services that the government has anything to do with? You don't send your kids to public school. You don't buy cars from companies that are subsidized. You don't drive on public roads. You don't use gasoline from companies that receive subsidies. You don't use any banks that have FDIC insurance. Etc...

If you can really afford to do all that, than more power to you. But for most of us it's simply impossible.

 

[ravedown]

i like food...food tastes good.

 

[dannno]

Not to derail the thread with a semantics argument, but I personally have never really understood these two terms. Natural and Synthetic.

Isn't everything natural, unless it comes from like mars? And if synthetic just means something that humans had to make using raw ingredients, then wouldn't stuff like iced tea be synthetic? Obviously if that's the case then something isn't bad simply because it is synthetic.

Synthetic means that it doesn't occur naturally in nature.. Ice occurs naturally in nature.

 

[brandon]

Synthetic means that it doesn't occur naturally in nature.. Ice occurs naturally in nature.

But Iced tea doesn't. Neither does bread, beer, or butter. So these things are synthetic?

 

[BenIsForRon]

SO you're telling me you avoid all products and services that the government has anything to do with? You don't send your kids to public school. You don't buy cars from companies that are subsidized. You don't drive on public roads. You don't use gasoline from companies that receive subsidies. You don't use any banks that have FDIC insurance. Etc...

If you can really afford to do all that, than more power to you. But for most of us it's simply impossible.

Of course, but you can modify your behavior in the margins. Buy more from farmers markets when they're open. You can't tell me buying 3 pounds of zucchini for $5 is a worse deal than a fucking nasty ass burger for $5.

 

[dannno]

By the way Danno, make sure you read that story I linked on the first page, not all organic food is made in an environmentally sound way.

That depends on your definition of organic. I certainly don't hold the government's definition of organic as the true definition.

There are large companies who are attempting to capitalize on the organic movement and have tried to have the definition changed, so again it is better to buy from small, local organic farmers than to shop at the grocery store and pay a premium on organics there.

 

[Flash]

Honestly I didn't know what Whole Foods was about. All I saw a few random posts saying "SUpport WHOLE FOODS." And I didn't realize.

and that spawns multiple threads with hundreds of posts and a "defend Beck" website.

 

[CCTelander]

Of course, but you can modify your behavior in the margins. Buy more from farmers markets when they're open. You can't tell me buying 3 pounds of zucchini for $5 is a worse deal than a fucking nasty ass burger for $5.

Or just grow some of your own. Doesn't even have to be a lot, even with almost no space you can grow a few things in containers.

If you've ever eaten a tomato that you grew yourself, organically, you'll probably never buy one of those watery, tasteless things masquerading as tomatoes in the supermarket again.

 

[LittleLightShining]

If you've ever eaten a tomato that you grew yourself, organically, you'll probably never buy one of those watery, tasteless things masquerading as tomatoes in the supermarket again.

I actually broke down and bought my first store tomato in 5 years because this season has been so bad Makes me want to cry. It was bland bland bland. I usually spend the latter half of August and beyond stuffing myself with tomato sandwiches. The weather hear has been terrible and Vermont has seen a lot of late blight

 

[specsaregood]

I actually broke down and bought my first store tomato in 5 years because this season has been so bad Makes me want to cry. It was bland bland bland. I usually spend the latter half of August and beyond stuffing myself with tomato sandwiches. The weather hear has been terrible and Vermont has seen a lot of late blight

You are not alone. Same thing here in NJ. I swear we had like 2 months straight of overcast, no-sun days early in the season. Stunted all my tomato and pepper plants, they are just now really starting to produce.