Why I've changed my mind.

[nodope0695]

For everybody's information:

Fascism:

Fascism is an especially virulent form of far-right populism. Fascism glorifies national, racial, or cultural unity and collective rebirth while seeking to purge imagined enemies, and attacks both revolutionary movements and liberal pluralism in favor of militarized, totalitarian mass politics.

Fascism first crystallized in Europe in response to the Bolshevik Revolution and the devastation of World War I, and then spread to other parts of the world.

If it is a post-WWII occurrence it should be called neofascist or neofascism unless it solely involves participants in older movements. Neofascists reinterpret fascist ideology and strategy in various ways to fit new circumstances.

(Definition fount at: http://www.publiceye.org/glossary/glossary_big.html)

Socialism:

1. Any of various political philosophies that support social and economic equality, collective decision-making, and public control of productive capital and natural resources, as advocated by socialists.

2. The socialist political philosophies as a group, including Marxism, libertarian socialism, democratic socialism, and social democracy.

3. (Leninism) The intermediate phase of social development between capitalism and full communism. This is a strategy whereby the State has control of all key resource-producing industries and manages most aspects of the market, in contrast to laissez faire capitalism.

4. (Classical Marxism) The international communist society where classes and the state no longer exist.

(Deninition found at http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/socialism)

 

[ClockwiseSpark]

For everybody's information:

Fascism:

Fascism is an especially virulent form of far-right populism. Fascism glorifies national, racial, or cultural unity and collective rebirth while seeking to purge imagined enemies, and attacks both revolutionary movements and liberal pluralism in favor of militarized, totalitarian mass politics.

Fascism first crystallized in Europe in response to the Bolshevik Revolution and the devastation of World War I, and then spread to other parts of the world.

If it is a post-WWII occurrence it should be called neofascist or neofascism unless it solely involves participants in older movements. Neofascists reinterpret fascist ideology and strategy in various ways to fit new circumstances.

(Definition fount at: http://www.publiceye.org/glossary/glossary_big.html)

Socialism:

1. Any of various political philosophies that support social and economic equality, collective decision-making, and public control of productive capital and natural resources, as advocated by socialists.

2. The socialist political philosophies as a group, including Marxism, libertarian socialism, democratic socialism, and social democracy.

3. (Leninism) The intermediate phase of social development between capitalism and full communism. This is a strategy whereby the State has control of all key resource-producing industries and manages most aspects of the market, in contrast to laissez faire capitalism.

4. (Classical Marxism) The international communist society where classes and the state no longer exist.

(Deninition found at http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/socialism)

John McCain:
Fascism is an especially virulent form of far-right populism. Fascism glorifies national, racial, or cultural unity and collective rebirth while seeking to purge imagined enemies, and attacks both revolutionary movements and liberal pluralism in favor of militarized, totalitarian mass politics.

Barrack Obama:
Any of various political philosophies that support social and economic equality, collective decision-making, and public control of productive capital and natural resources, as advocated by

 

[nodope0695]

John McCain:
Fascism is an especially virulent form of far-right populism. Fascism glorifies national, racial, or cultural unity and collective rebirth while seeking to purge imagined enemies, and attacks both revolutionary movements and liberal pluralism in favor of militarized, totalitarian mass politics.

Barrack Obama:
Any of various political philosophies that support social and economic equality, collective decision-making, and public control of productive capital and natural resources, as advocated by

LOL...exactly what I was thinking as I produced my reply....you beat me to it.

 

[ClockwiseSpark]

LOL...exactly what I was thinking as I produced my reply....you beat me to it.

Great minds think alike.

 

[BlueCalico]

Oh Im not a victim

it is true i have been treated like shit but I will move on and respond as I should

Not true.... But I will be able to post the truth on

http://wethepeoplespace.com

OK - buh bye now. Sleep well while the rest of us work our asses off.

 

[qh4dotcom]

But face it, cska80 lives in reality.

What do you mean by "cska80 lives in reality"

 

[BlueCalico]

Are you having trouble with reality?

Yes voting for Baldwin or Barr is a good idea if they have a chance of winning; otherwise, the votes given to them (in this election cycle) move away from the closest thing we have to a conservative movement.
I’d vote for Baldwin in a heartbeat if the media had not marginalized his campaign just like they did RP’s.
NOBODY has heard of Barr or Baldwin when I speak with them…so what’s the point?
A warm fuzzy feeling of “Doing the right thing”, “Voting my conscience”, “Voting on principle”
Those only factor if each party has an equal chance of victory…and thanks to the media run amok, they do not have a snowball’s chance of getting a majority of votes…popular or electoral.

When the votes move away from the GOP who benefits?
Barr and Baldwin don't win...the Liberals benefit.

You MUST recognize that...right?
Did you even look at the way the primaries went?
I participated in it: working my ass off, only to see a diluted field of mediocre candidates marginalize the RP movement (with the assistance of the corporate media scum).
Look what it got us...John McCain.
Same thing here.

So you'd rather vote yourself a tremendous tax increase, continued assault on the constitution (publicly advertised by the current liberal socialist party candidate) and additional wasteful spending from the government?

How is that even partially logical thinking?

To me it seems that this is the mechanism of the disinformation machine working toward the continued division of the parties that would push the GOP to a win over the socialist agenda.

Good work…enjoy that “Spreading of the wealth” there buddy…you deserve it.

Again, with the horse race mentality. If you had a choice to vote for the electric chair (45% in the polls) or getting your head chopped off (45% in the polls), but there was also a chance to vote to escape (5%), which would you vote for???

Fear-mongering makes me sick.

 

[BlueCalico]

Do you even read what I post?
I am not schilling for McCain...I am making the case against obama.
The man who has the most potential for the most damage to our freedoms.

As far as labeling me as one of your local GOP assholes, well, do what makes you feel good...
But know that you will not change the gop if you do not work within the gop.
That means you need to get to know these people, earn their trust and correct their wayward thinking.
Standing on the corner with a "Fuck the GOP" sign is not going to work no matter how classic or funny it is.

You have to teach them to think.

Think about that for a few seconds and understand that It will NOT be easy, it is work, and needs to be done...by US.

You can work within the GOP and still vote for whoever you want. IT DOESN'T MATTER if McCain or Obama wins! THEY ARE ONE IN THE SAME! What part of that don't you understand?

 

[Time for Change]

You make grand assumptions that I stand on the corner with a "Fuck the GOP" sign. I have been working with them and they are the most dishonest, unprincipled people I have ever met. They will not be taught a new way to think, they will do what the party leadership tells them. If McCain wins he will be the one doing the telling, you know the guy who refused Ron Paul a speaking spot at the RNC because it conflicted with McCain's policies.

Do what you feel is right but the moment you feel the need to run your mouth off about it here be prepared for blow back.

Dear GOD...you are impossible.

I am not, nor did I ever say that you were personally standing on the fucking corner with a "Fuck the GOP" sign.
That was an example of a counterproductive action.

I am not here to "Run my mouth" as you so eloquently put it.
I am stating fact.
Allowing Osama to win this election will be a significant milestone in our history and a potentially devastating one at that.

I am sorry that you are unable to make headway with the people you have encountered. Truly unfortunate.
Evaluate the situation and develop a new approach.

I have run into many that oppose new ways of thinking... initialy, but once you gain their trust / respect changes can happen.

Maybe I just have a knack for it.
Maybe they are starving for direction or enlightenment.
Who knows.

If I can make headway with these people anyone can...that is certain.

(Do not answer the following, think about it alone and come to a solution / develop a game plan for yourself)

So, what I am gathering here tells me that you have already voted and having been ostracized by the local GOP you have given up.

What is your plan of action to advance the restoration of liberty now?

Whatever you do, never give up, just find a new angle.
Have you joined the Campaign for Liberty?
Are you campaigning for local responsible candidates?

Are you going to preach to the choir or recruit more people to fight for liberty?



Lastly...let's say you are running an event in favor of "X"
A person comes along that says you are dead wrong wants to address your audience...
Do you let them?

Of course not.
Why on earth would anyone expect McCain to do so?

That's where we come in.
Our goal is to make certain that the future leaders-elect are responsible principled individuals with the best interest of the nation at heart.
We hopefully won’t have this problem in the future if we are effective and reasonable in our dealings with the locals.
We have to teach these people...
Most of them have become accustomed to meeting at the GOP events as a social club...
We need to change that thinking and teach them that the GOP is not simply a social event; it is a place where the influential people decide which candidates are good for our nation.

We work to correct their behavior and instill an understanding of what is acceptable and what is not.

This is not a brainwashing operation; it is a process that will take time, and probably lots of it too.
Frustrating, beat-your-head-against-the-wall time, but we HAVE to do it.
It is ok to let somebody else be right for the time being...even if they are wrong...it is part of the process of gaining that person's respect.
Being combative will NOT work at all.

So flame me, call it blow back, Do what you gotta do, but ask yourself...(alone and privately)...

What are you contributing to restoring freedom today?
Can your current course achieve your goal?
Is it productive?
If not, how can you revise your tactic to achieve a desirable outcome in the long run?

 

[nodope0695]

Again, with the horse race mentality. If you had a choice to vote for the electric chair (45% in the polls) or getting your head chopped off (45% in the polls), but there was also a chance to vote to escape (5%), which would you vote for???

Fear-mongering makes me sick.

I like your comparison with the chair, decapitation, or escape...but in this case it doesn't work. Your political choice for a third party candidate is based purely on emotion (something the liberals love to do), and completey ignores the real issues at hand (again, something liberals love to do, hence their support for Obama).

Your vote for a third party is a vote for Obama. So Balwin or Barr could get 5%, if they were lucky...even so, what difference would it make? In this case there is no escape. You're still getting the chair or your head lopped off...and personally, given a choice, I'll take the the guillotine any day.

A vote for third party, while it might make you feel better, might give you your moment of revenge toward the GOP, will essentially be a vote for Obama.

 

[Time for Change]

You can work within the GOP and still vote for whoever you want. IT DOESN'T MATTER if McCain or Obama wins! THEY ARE ONE IN THE SAME! What part of that don't you understand?

They are NOT the same, not even close.
If you are truly involved with this election cycle and paying attention to current events and heard only half of the osama quotes of the past 10 years you should easily recognize that.

I don't like McCain...but the alternative...well...I don't think so.

I am not trying to scare anyone...just the facts.

45% vote for Obama [changed spelling from Osama because it offends ClockwiseSpark to speak against the messiah]
35% vote for McCain
5% Write in a candidate that's not running
5% vote for Barr
5% vote for Baldwin
5% stay home

Osama wins...welcome to the united socialist states of america.

That is the way this one plays out.

I have busted my ass to get "a candidate nobody has ever heard of" heard of.
It was relatively effective too, considering the lack of media, etc.
His name and signs all over the place. People were receptive and the media killed it.
He was even in the debates, which lends name recognition and quickly mocked by the media.
I used the exact same "he can't win if nobody votes for him, but if we all DO" line.

A lot of good that did me.

Now I am expected to go through the same thing all over again when the libertarian party will not do anything to advance themselves, the constitution party fails to get on all the state ballots, neither will fight for media coverage nor spend money to spread the information themselves?
Neither party has the grass roots following that Ron did and never will without Ron.

All this for parties that stand absolutely no chance of being elected because they failed to forge out the necessary publicity?

Now here I am getting attacked by the people calling themselves supporters because I simply stated that we need to reduce the impact of two less than desirable candidates by selecting the one that will not usher in socialism...and I am the bad guy...

Give me a break.

I can hear it now...(and I am not saying that any one of the individuals that are attacking me now are the person in this simple example)
"If only they had counted all the votes we would have had a chance"
"We would have had 6% and that would have made all the difference"

 

[ClockwiseSpark]

Dear GOD...you are impossible.

I am not, nor did I ever say that you were personally standing on the fucking corner with a "Fuck the GOP" sign.
That was an example of a counterproductive action.

I am not here to "Run my mouth" as you so eloquently put it.
I am stating fact.
Allowing Osama to win this election will be a significant milestone in our history and a potentially devastating one at that.

I am sorry that you are unable to make headway with the people you have encountered. Truly unfortunate.
Evaluate the situation and develop a new approach.

I have run into many that oppose new ways of thinking... initialy, but once you gain their trust / respect changes can happen.

Maybe I just have a knack for it.
Maybe they are starving for direction or enlightenment.
Who knows.

If I can make headway with these people anyone can...that is certain.

(Do not answer the following, think about it alone and come to a solution / develop a game plan for yourself)

So, what I am gathering here tells me that you have already voted and having been ostracized by the local GOP you have given up.

What is your plan of action to advance the restoration of liberty now?

Whatever you do, never give up, just find a new angle.
Have you joined the Campaign for Liberty?
Are you campaigning for local responsible candidates?

Are you going to preach to the choir or recruit more people to fight for liberty?



Lastly...let's say you are running an event in favor of "X"
A person comes along that says you are dead wrong wants to address your audience...
Do you let them?

Of course not.
Why on earth would anyone expect McCain to do so?

That's where we come in.
Our goal is to make certain that the future leaders-elect are responsible principled individuals with the best interest of the nation at heart.
We hopefully won’t have this problem in the future if we are effective and reasonable in our dealings with the locals.
We have to teach these people...
Most of them have become accustomed to meeting at the GOP events as a social club...
We need to change that thinking and teach them that the GOP is not simply a social event; it is a place where the influential people decide which candidates are good for our nation.

We work to correct their behavior and instill an understanding of what is acceptable and what is not.

This is not a brainwashing operation; it is a process that will take time, and probably lots of it too.
Frustrating, beat-your-head-against-the-wall time, but we HAVE to do it.
It is ok to let somebody else be right for the time being...even if they are wrong...it is part of the process of gaining that person's respect.
Being combative will NOT work at all.

So flame me, call it blow back, Do what you gotta do, but ask yourself...(alone and privately)...

What are you contributing to restoring freedom today?
Can your current course achieve your goal?
Is it productive?
If not, how can you revise your tactic to achieve a desirable outcome in the long run?

Your arrogance is astounding. The assumptions you continue to make are so outrageous it is hardly worth speaking to you.

I have and continue to make headway without selling out my principles so I can some how convince people who have no principles, that principles are a good thing.

My job not to help the immoral find morality. I'm here to succeed even if that means pushing people out of the party.

You support illegal war? GTFO

You feel the Constitution is an outdated and irrelevant document? GTFO

I could go on and on but I have spent over a year doing this as a full time job and I'll not take direction from some shill on the interwebs.

Support McWar if you must, shill for him if you feel the need (as you obviously do) but don't be surprised when we tell you to F*** off.

 

[ClockwiseSpark]

They are NOT the same, not even close.
If you are truly involved with this election cycle and paying attention to current events and heard only half of the osama quotes of the past 10 years you should easily recognize that.

I don't like McCain...but the alternative...well...I don't think so.

I am not trying to scare anyone...just the facts.

45% vote for Osama
35% vote for McCain
5% Write in a candidate that's not running
5% vote for Barr
5% vote for Baldwin
5% stay home

Osama wins...welcome to the united socialist states of america.

That is the way this one plays out.

I have busted my ass to get "a candidate nobody has ever heard of" heard of.
It was relatively effective too, considering the lack of media, etc.
His name and signs all over the place. People were receptive and the media killed it.
He was even in the debates, which lends name recognition and quickly mocked by the media.
I used the exact same "he can't win if nobody votes for him, but if we all DO" line.

A lot of good that did me.

Now I am expected to go through the same thing all over again when the libertarian party will not do anything to advance themselves, the constitution party fails to get on all the state ballots, neither will fight for media coverage nor spend money to spread the information themselves?
Neither party has the grass roots following that Ron did and never will without Ron.

All this for parties that stand absolutely no chance of being elected because they failed to forge out the necessary publicity?

Now here I am getting attacked by the people calling themselves supporters because I simply stated that we need to reduce the impact of two less than desirable candidates by selecting the one that will not usher in socialism...and I am the bad guy...

Give me a break.

I can hear it now...(and I am not saying that any one of the individuals that are attacking me now are the person in this simple example)
"If only they had counted all the votes we would have had a chance"
"We would have had 6% and that would have made all the difference"

lol!

"I'm not trying to scare anyone I just happen to misspell Obama's name everytime I post. I'm not saying he's a terrorist, or am I."

 

[Join The Paul Side]

Changing our court system forever, a whole new crop of welfare programs, an endorsement of the victim society across the country, an endorsement of much greater tax increases across the country, the end of net neutrality, the fairness doctrine, the rise to power of 60's radical thought, Marxism, and many other things are not what I stand for. The election of Obama would be the election of the most anti-American president in history. His administration, along with no check on our radical Congress, will do more irreparable damage to our Constitution that John McCain would ever do.

I feel that this election is really the decision of ending America as we know it. No matter who we elect to offices from dog catcher to Congress in the years after an Obama administration will not matter. The message of freedom will be damaged beyond repair as an Obama election would be the endorsement of the idea of the failure of capitalism, freedom. I do not want my daughter to grow up in the America that Obama has in store for us. John McCain is not a great choice by any means, but he is no radical. He has not grown up around Marxists and Communists. He has not grown up in America hating churches. He has not spoken openly about using courts to distribute wealth to voters. He has not spoken openly about the need of using the courts to go around the Constitution to achieve Marxist agendas and how our founding fathers were so flawed to not give the GOVERNMENT it's own rights in the Constitution.

No, ladies and gentlemen. I am not going to vote my principles in order to send a message that so few will hear. This is not voting for Bush over Kerry or Gore. This is voting for McCain over our future Castro, Chavez, Stalin or Hitler. I am as much a freedom loving individual as any of you so the flames that will come in this thread are not needed. I just felt I needed to speak my peace in order to possibly save this country by persuading my fellow patriots that this is not the year to send some sort of a message to the republican party.

This is the year to save America. This is the year to keep our pulse out of cardiac arrest for a few more years so we can keep our fight on the foward path. A leftist controlled America has no room or tolerance for a patriot movement. I'm saddened that John McCain is the only option, but that is the fact and I choose to live in reality.

Obama cannot claim the White House. Thanks!

Yep. That's the way to do it. I'm sure you're one measly vote will turn this whole election.

Try pissing in the ocean to raise the sea level. You'll have about as much success doing that as you would winning this election for McCain with your one vote.

Go ahead and abandon the R3volution and sell out your principles. The GOP feeds off of whores that think like you.

If McCain wins the Neocons will regroup and we will have uphill battles with Establishment GOP elitists that will stop at nothing to make sure they don't lose power.

If Obama wins the Establishment GOP elitists will be fighting themselves leaving the party open for the C4L, the Message, and Ron Paul Republicans.

I've already voted. I wrote in Ron Paul. But I hope Obama wins. Sue me.

 

[Time for Change]

Your arrogance is astounding. The assumptions you continue to make are so outrageous it is hardly worth speaking to you.

I have and continue to make headway without selling out my principles so I can some how convince people who have no principles, that principles are a good thing.

My job not to help the immoral find morality. I'm here to succeed even if that means pushing people out of the party.

You support illegal war? GTFO

You feel the Constitution is an outdated and irrelevant document? GTFO

I could go on and on but I have spent over a year doing this as a full time job and I'll not take direction from some shill on the interwebs.

Support McWar if you must, shill for him if you feel the need (as you obviously do) but don't be surprised when we tell you to F*** off.

Keep calling me a shill...twist and grind and try to berate me...that's effective.
Anyone who knows me knows that I am as far from arrogant as one can be.
Please analyze me some more. Assassinate my character while you’re at it ... very good demonstration of your social skills.

You cannot even get in the party yet you plan to kick people out?

YES it is OUR job to change thinking and do it in an effective way. Our meaning all of us...and if you are a Ron Paul supporter, that means YOU too.
Being a combative asshole in the GOP and fighting within ranks is NOT effective by the way.

That's what we are doing...We are changing the old way of thinking for the good of our nation.

Just click my name and review all my past posts and see if I am a Ron Paul supporter or not.
95% of my posts are positive and rallying the troops.
The other 5% is dealing with this piece of shit thread and the attacks from my so called fellow supporters.

You telling Me to fuck off is absolutely classic.
Thank you, but no, I think I'll pass.


I am a tried and true Ron Paul supporter with the balls to face adversity, making difficult decisions along the way, to advance the restoration of liberty to our nation by whatever means necessary. It is going to take time and will likely be a rough road but it'll work out with hard work and hopefully some support from a few fellow Ron Paul Supporters.

You go ahead and rally with the people on the sidelines and moan about how it wasn't supposed to work out this way when osama begins his socialist process...I'll be front and center fighting it all the way.

If you want to get in the fight for our freedom, you are welcome to join, otherwise stay the hell out of the way.

 

[Time for Change]

lol!

"I'm not trying to scare anyone I just happen to misspell Obama's name everytime I post. I'm not saying he's a terrorist, or am I."

Does it offend you when I misspell the messiah's name?

 

[ClockwiseSpark]

Keep calling me a shill...twist and grind and try to berate me...that's effective.
Anyone who knows me knows that I am as far from arrogant as one can be.
Please analyze me some more. Assassinate my character while you’re at it ... very good demonstration of your social skills.

You cannot even get in the party yet you plan to kick people out?

YES it is OUR job to change thinking and do it in an effective way. Our meaning all of us...and if you are a Ron Paul supporter, that means YOU too.
Being a combative asshole in the GOP and fighting within ranks is NOT effective by the way.

That's what we are doing...We are changing the old way of thinking for the good of our nation.

Just click my name and review all my past posts and see if I am a Ron Paul supporter or not.
95% of my posts are positive and rallying the troops.
The other 5% is dealing with this piece of shit thread and the attacks from my so called fellow supporters.

You telling Me to fuck off is absolutely classic.
Thank you, but no, I think I'll pass.


I am a tried and true Ron Paul supporter with the balls to face adversity, making difficult decisions along the way, to advance the restoration of liberty to our nation by whatever means necessary. It is going to take time and will likely be a rough road but it'll work out with hard work and hopefully some support from a few fellow Ron Paul Supporters.

You go ahead and rally with the people on the sidelines and moan about how it wasn't supposed to work out this way when osama begins his socialist process...I'll be front and center fighting it all the way.

If you want to get in the fight for our freedom, you are welcome to join, otherwise stay the hell out of the way.

If you were as active and aware on this forum as you claim to be, you might have noticed where I mentioned that our numbers in the GOP locally were close to 50/50 and that we were winning people to our side. We have managed to do this without selling out our principles and selling out to McCain, nor will you find me or anyone else from my Meetup trying to convince anyone else who to vote for in this election.

We lost. It doesn't matter who wins the presidential election. If you hadn't noticed McCain's policies blow with the wind. Look at his voting record and ask yourself if you can really trust that he will be conservative in any way.

After everything that the Ron Paul supporters in general and specifically the people on this forum have gone through during the primaries, I cannot even fathom why a Ron Paul supporter could possibly find it in themselves to support McCain.

Maybe he was right, maybe America's isolationism is responsible for the rise of Hitler.

You almost have me convinced, Obama, oops I mean "Osama", could very well be the devil himself.

 

[nodope0695]

I'm swallowing my pride, holding my nose, and hoping that Obama loses by pulling the lever for McCain....or rather, touching the Diebold screen for McCain...not for party, not for the GOP, but so that Obama doesn't get me vote. I will NOT cast a futile vote for a third party, and I will NOT abstain - both of which are a a vote for Obama.

I've never supported the idea of voting third party, nor have I entertained the idea...just look at my past posts about the issue...

Either way it goes, we're fucked...but if Obama wins, we'll be really, really, really, really, really, FUCKED.

Y'all Baldwin and Barr folks go ahead and make your tolken votes, stick it to the GOP, and give Obama his win. Your logic is like that of a man who tries to cure his headache by hitting himself in the head with a hammer; or a child who gets angry cuz his mom didn't give him a cookie, so he punches his mom, and breaks the cookie jar.

 

[ClockwiseSpark]

I'm swallowing my pride, holding my nose, and hoping that Obama loses by pulling the lever for McCain....or rather, touching the Diebold screen for McCain...not for party, not for the GOP, but so that Obama doesn't get me vote. I will NOT cast a futile vote for a third party, and I will NOT abstain - both of which are a a vote for Obama.

I've never supported the idea of voting third party, nor have I entertained the idea...just look at my past posts about the issue...

Either way it goes, we're fucked...but if Obama wins, we'll be really, really, really, really, really, FUCKED.

Y'all Baldwin and Barr folks go ahead and make your tolken votes, stick it to the GOP, and give Obama his win. Your logic is like that of a man who tries to cure his headache by hitting himself in the head with a hammer; or a child who gets angry cuz his mom didn't give him a cookie, so he punches his mom, and breaks the cookie jar.

No, it's strategy. We apparently disagree on that and I think you're in the minority, at least I hope you are because I have no intention of going through the exact same thing in 4 years. This was a hard fight and we have almost won (locally), if McCain wins and reenergizes the party we will lose all the power that we have gained.

 

[nodope0695]

No, it's strategy. We apparently disagree on that and I think you're in the minority, at least I hope you are because I have no intention of going through the exact same thing in 4 years. This was a hard fight and we have almost won (locally), if McCain wins and reenergizes the party we will lose all the power that we have gained.

McCain couldn't re-energize the GOP if he tried....Palin has done a better job of that.

We have a better chance of gaining ground with McCain than we do with Obama, thats a fact. Conservatives, while they don't like McCain, will vote with him becasue a vote for Obama is out of the question. Obama would have a super majority in the house...and we could NOT counter that. At least McCain would bring SOME balance....

Again, I'm no troll, I'm no shill...I'm just looking at the dire consequences should Obama win.

BTW: We do disagree on this point, but we're still on the same team...if we agreed on EVERYTHING, then this forum would be boring, wouldn't it?