Why is Ron Paul still only at 5%????

[Bossobass]

There is a plethora of information out there on voter fraud and diebold etc.. you just have to break the grip that controls you. Do it.

No question the NH vote was tampered with to deflate the momentum we and the campaign had built...against all odds. 10% in Iowa. Had Ron registered the actual 15-20% we really got in NH, and had the press reported the stunning miracle that would have been, then we would have been unstoppable.

For those who actually believe that McCain, whose campaign had fallen to 15% throughout the year into December, was broke and had to borrow $3 million just to get through the month, had no support, fired over 150 staff with McCain sucking donkey shit in every debate, putting both of his deformed little feet in his mouth at every town hall meeting...suddenly shot up over 20 points in the polls and won NH, including the anti-war vote, gay vote and youth vote, well...

I really don't know what to say to that.

Stop pissing on RP, the campaign, the supporters and this forum. It not only pisses me off, it's monumentally stupid.

We were cheated out of our momentum by the machines and the press blacked us out in unprecedented fashion...period. And, sorry, but Neil Boortz??? Glenn Beck??? you have to be shittin' me. Who the hell are they? I've never heard of them and their shows are irrelevant.

I'm talking about Time, Newsweek, USA Today, Wall Street Journal, LA Times, NY Times, Washington Post, AP, UPI, ABC, NBC, CBS, 60 minutes, 20/20, McNeil/Lehrer news hour, Today Show, Good Morning America and the Early Show.

You'd need 500 million dollars to compete with that using 30 and 60 second TV ads. (Wendy's red pigtail campaign cost $300 million for 8 months.) $20 million is like spitting into the ocean to try to raise sea level.

Bosso

 

[Badger for Paul]

I live in Milwaukee, and I can tell you that all of the other candidates campaigned hard here, both in person and with large numbers of radio and TV ads. I didn't hear or see a single ad for Paul and he has been in Texas. Therefore, he just hasn't been present in the media here either because he isn't here and the other candidates are. My experience would suggest that the campaign chose not to devote resources here, possibly because they thought ad money might be wasted given Paul's absence over the past week.

 

[BrettCates]

Troll or sheep?

Stop screaming voter fraud. If the majority of America decided that Ron Paul should be the nominee, there's no way that Diebold could even edit that large number of votes down to 5%. It pisses me off how voter fraud, something so serious of a claim, be thrown around like fact. It isn't fact. There's no evidence other than a few counties that counted votes wrong. Remember NH recounts? Did our percentage point jump 20 points? No.

1. Go to blackboxvoting.com

2. Read this or you are a sheep troll in denial:


http://www.bbvforums.org/forums/messages/1954/71572.html?1201791545


http://www.bbvforums.org/forums/messages/1954/71572.html?1201791545


Posted on Friday, January 25, 2008 - 12:31 am:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We have collected over 20 hours of video taken by six different people. It will tell much of the story of the New Hampshire recount.

After some thought, I think the best way to do this is with as little editing as possible, to allow viewers to reach their own conclusions based on what they see. I will organize clips into uniform topics and will keep them short, with a few captions to provide context.

Links will appear on the Black Box Voting home page. For those of you who receive automatic e-mails, I'll post an announcement with a link when each new video goes up.

While Sec. State Bill Gardner may win the prize for the most circuitous and nonresponsive answers, ballot guy David Scanlan will win the award for belligerence.

THE NEW HAMPSHIRE CHAIN OF CUSTODY SHAM

I posted this one first because I was so haunted by New Hampshire Secretary of State Bill Gardner's demeanor and the expression on his face on the night he chose not to put the ballots in the vault. This 6-minute video contains three related clips: Frank Mevers, who holds a key to the ballot vaults, describing that the white tape seals the boxes; Sec. State Bill Gardner along with Frank Mevers, Brian Burford and Karen Ladd, as he is questioned about the decision not to use the vault; and a demonstration of the sham seal.

Here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKQEQ7qHvgM

PARTICIPANTS

The first voice you hear, questioning Mevers about the seal, is that of Paddy Shaffer of the Ohio Election Justice Project.

The voice questioning Bill Gardner over the decision not to use the vault is mine. The voice telling him he did not answer the question is Sally Castleman of Election Defense Alliance.

Susan Pynchon (Florida Fair Elections Coalition) and I chased the ballot van on Jan. 17; on Jan. 22, Vickie Karp (Vote Rescue) and I chased the van, and on Jan. 23, due to speeding and evasive maneuvers by the ballot van, two teams followed the van with video cameras: Team one, Vickie Karp and Jeannie Dean (Sarasota, Florida); Team Two, me and Kathy Greenwell (Bullitt County, Kentucky.)

HOW WE CAME TO FIND BALLOT BOXES AND A SUPPLY BOX"

We returned to the archive building to wait for Butch and Hoppy to return the ballots they'd picked up. We were shocked to see that the building appeared to be deserted, but was unlocked, and the counting room was unlocked, and contained empty ballot boxes and a supply box with seals, tape etc.

When we left, a small car literally ran us out of the parking lot all the way to the road. It was not a security professional, but one of the workers in the archive building. About 15 minutes after we left, Butch and Hoppy arrived to deliver the ballots. No citizen witnesses were present, nor was the candidate notified so he could have his own witnesses.

FOR THE BENEFIT OF THE POLICE

In order to determine whether there were ballots in the boxes or not, I gently nudged the boxes with my shoe. The light weight indicated the ballot boxes were empty. At least one ballot box, for the town of Plaistow, contained the original sham seal signed by the moderator and selectmen. It was empty.

It was my decision to demonstrate the sham seals on videotape. I will be happy to reimburse the state of New Hampshire for the $1 or so cost for the sham "seal", since I used a blank seal on an empty box. Of course, as you will see in the video above, these seals are reusable, worthless, and fraudulent.

I would not have performed the demonstration had the state of New Hampshire complied with my requests to show me whether the seals adhere. I requested this of Deputy Sec. State Anthony Stevens, of Assistant Sec. State Dave Scanlan, and of Sec. State Bill Gardner. They each declined to demonstrate the removability of the seal, but did claim that the removable paper "sealed" the ballot boxes and amazingly, used the fraudulent "seal" to secure the DOOR TO THE ROOM WHERE BALLOTS WERE STORED OVERNIGHT. My demonstration was the only way to achieve the exposure of their lies, and clearly in the public interest.

The police interrogated Vickie Karp and Jeannie Dean today about this. They were present, at least for part of the demo. They were not involved in the decision or the act of testing the seal. The decision to demonstrate the "seal" fraud was mine and only mine.

I have so far been unable to find out who ordered these seals, since not a soul at the New Hampshire secretary of state's office claims to know who's responsible for the fraudulent seals.

UPCOMING VIDEO CLIPS

As I say, stay tuned for the video clips. They show employees for the state of New Hampshire breaking the law, and also will show you tips for how to investigate chain of custody yourselves.

 

[Shaun]

Here come the Tin Foil hat under 30 guys.
God help Ron Paul with fanatics like this.
SURE WE WON NEW HAMPSHIRE....That's right.....
Good GOD.

 

[Bossobass]

Here come the Tin Foil hat under 30 guys.
God help Ron Paul with fanatics like this.
SURE WE WON NEW HAMPSHIRE....That's right.....
Good GOD.

I'm 54 and the only thing fanatical about me is my distaste for lame posts like this.

Show me a single post in this thread that says Ron won NH (CAUTION: This will require actual reading).

Bosso.

 

[Thanehand]

You people are fucking crazy. Its all about the MEDIA. The media never portrayed him as a serious candidate, never acted like he had a chance, never acted like he could get any votes, never talked about him.

There is no conspiracy to single out Paul for derailment. This is the same media that sank Giuliani's campaign, Thompson's campaign, and created the Mike Huckabee campaign. They are not "afraid" of him, or "scared" of him. They simply didnt notice him. He wasnt part of the establishment and didnt fit the mold. According to popular opinion, Liberals are pro-entitlement, pro-civil liberties, and anti-war; Conservatives are pro-war, pro-government managed "capitalism", and anti-gay. If you dont fit one in with one of those, the guys in the CNN directing room have no idea what to do with you. Anti-war Republican just doesnt make sense to these guys. Republicans are the war party, Democrats are the anti-war party.

There is no conspiracy.

You had me until you said there's no conspiracy to single out Paul for derailment, and that's where I got annoyed.

conspiracy: noun

1: the act of conspiring together
2 a: an agreement among conspirators b: a group of conspirators

conspire: verb

1 a: to join in a secret agreement to do an unlawful or wrongful act or an act which becomes unlawful as a result of the secret agreement <accused of conspiring to overthrow the government> b: scheme
2: to act in harmony toward a common end <circumstances conspired to defeat his efforts>

How you can go from "it's all about the media" to saying "there is no conspiracy" is beyond me. If the media as a whole has chosen to exclude him (whether directly or indirectly), thus harming the campaign and our election process, doesn't that make it a conspiracy by definition?

From all accounts (and I should know having researched more than I'd like to admit), the media's exclusion has been a CONCERTED effort from the BEGINNING to single out Ron Paul. It began happening right after that second debate, where Guiliani was schooled by Ron on "blowback." It went from there to Ron being excluded from the Iowa Tax Relief Forum to FOX News excluding him completely in their polls and George Stephanopoulos telling Ron he won't win to his face. I've lost track of how many times the candidates have been mentioned without Ron being included since then.

I'm sorry, but when results from commissioned polls that exclude Ron Paul are later cited as reasoning for exclusion, you cannot tell me that it's not a conspiracy. OF COURSE someone who gets little to no media coverage is going to poll lousy.

All they had to do was mention his name and show his picture whenever they talked about the other candidates. As I said, they even refuse to do that to this day (FOX and MSNBC being the worst).

What little coverage Ron has gotten has been mostly negative and/or laced with negative adjectives. Positive coverage has almost always been on the internet and not in print, radio and television where it has the most impact.

Further, despite my bias, Ron's campaign is historical and the media has purposely ignored it:

• Where was the coverage of the Boston Tea Party reenactments?
  
• Where was the coverage of "Roe v Wade" Roe endorsement?
  
• Where was the coverage of the blimp launch?
  
• Where was the coverage of the Goldwater endorsement?
  
• Where's the coverage of the letter writing campaign?
  
• Where's the coverage of the upcoming racing deal?
  
• Where's the coverage of all the songs made for Ron (the media sure did talk about Obama's grassroots songs)?
  
• Where is the coverage about the first candidate radio station?
  
• Where is the coverage about the individual spending $85k of his own money on ads?
  
• Where's the coverage about the $85k grassroots ad that the New Hampshire paper "forgot" to run?

I could go on and on, but instead, I'll just direct you to the Ron Paul Timeline.

 

[Shaun]

You claimed we got 15-20% in New Hampshire?
That is TOTAL AND UTTER BS. And if you are 54 I can only think that your critical thinking skills and your frontal cortex area are underdeveloped.
Why is EVERYTHING a conspiracy against Ron, EVEN WHEN RON HIMSELF SAY'S IT ISN'T!!!
Which he did regarding NH and other states.
Oh, that's right, he's "rigged" as well huh?
Everything is fixed or a conspiracy.
I have had enough.
We lost because RON WAS NOT PREPARED TO FIRE THE LOSERS AT HQ and bring in a world class PR and executive team. Even then we may not have won, but we would have had more chance...

 

[Shaun]

LOSERS ALWAYS CRY " CONSPIRACY"
And that's what WE ARE, we are losers. We set out to win the GOP nomination.
We lost. Period.
We lost because Ron Paul is a TERRIBLE politician and I don't believe ever thought seriously that he could win, he was just curious about it.
Great politicians are great diplomats and to be a diplomat you have to play the middle ground. RP is far too truthful to be an effective politician.
This more than anything sunk us. Ron, never moves an inch from his positions and is truthfull to a fault. You can't do that if you want to be President. You just can't.

 

[syborius]

Stop screaming voter fraud. If the majority of America decided that Ron Paul should be the nominee, there's no way that Diebold could even edit that large number of votes down to 5%. It pisses me off how voter fraud, something so serious of a claim, be thrown around like fact. It isn't fact. There's no evidence other than a few counties that counted votes wrong. Remember NH recounts? Did our percentage point jump 20 points? No.

put your head back in the sand.

 

[spunkel]

exit polling

Please, to stop this vote fraud discussions once and for all, do me and yourselves the favour and hire some independent exit pollers for some precincts in the next state primaries so we will know at least once in this election what the REAL numbers are. Please!!!!

 

[syborius]

That would be a yes...I did say the top.

I'd say you're on KRAQ

 

[syborius]

The Washington state election is stolen. The experience on the ground does not match these statistics.

I hope you all have rifles.

thank you. These trolls, detractors, assholes, and other paid for treasonous bastards that want to convince people that vote fraud does not exist should be....________ fill in the blank.

 

[syborius]

I think it has to do with the feeling that the primaries are pretty much over and the states from here on out really don't matter. Whether that's true or not is another thing, but that's what people are feeling I think. One thing I find interesting is the difference between voter turnout of republicans vs democrats. Go to politico.com and check out the numbers. For example, in Wisconsin (91% reporting atm) the total # of votes for the democrats is 1,002,058 and the republican turnout is 373,696. That's a pretty significant difference and seems pretty consistent across the states.

Yes, now think about this. If the voting turn-out is so low because of the failed policies of GWB, why is Mccain, who could actually be more hardcore, and worse than GWB be the front-runner by such a large margin. It defies logic really. I understand wins by a small margin, 1-5%, but not wins by a margin of 60%. Sorry trolls, also, when precincts report, why is Ron Paul always at 4-5%, and when it is only at 1% of the precincts reporting, and then when 85% of the precincts are reporting his overall percentage rarely changes. Do you mean to tell me that the voting consistency stays exactly the same throughout a state from precinct to precinct. As the vote totals come in they don't vary at all? What a load of fucking horse-shit. That if anything should be a red flag to anyone that actually does some deductive reasoning.

 

[syborius]

Please, to stop this vote fraud discussions once and for all, do me and yourselves the favour and hire some independent exit pollers for some precincts in the next state primaries so we will know at least once in this election what the REAL numbers are. Please!!!!

One state needs to have a RP booth at each voting precinct. Simple. And a big banner..Certify your RP vote here....

 

[freelance]

Why this question still comes up is beyond me.

Because by the time we "educate" each new influx of establishment shills right out the door, a fresh crop of replacements crashes the gate. Note the Feb. date of the OP.

Lather, rinse, repeat...

 

[spunkel]

One state needs to have a RP booth at each voting precinct. Simple. And a big banner..Certify your RP vote here....

that will do it for our own satisfaction, but don't think we can use this data to challenge the results in case they are off.

 

[LibertyEagle]

But then, you are not allowed on the forums to discuss problems with the campaign - so in a very real way, the RPF has done more damage to Ron Paul than they will ever know with their insistence on discussing only happy thoughts and throwing anyone out that wants to talk about real problems, and you can't get to the solutions without discussing the problems.

You can "discuss problems" with the campaign to your heart's desire in The Vent or Hot Topics on the Forums. I am personally unclear as to how this is going to benefit anything, but knock your socks off, if you have the desire.

 

[Mopsus]

One state needs to have a RP booth at each voting precinct. Simple. And a big banner..Certify your RP vote here....

I like this. Let's put this voter fraud issue to bed and determine the truth.

 

[deedles]

Go turn on the tv, and read your daily newspaper. Do this for a week. Ask ALL your friends and relatives to do the same thing. Tell them to look for every positive mention of Ron Paul.

then you will understand WHY he is polling low.

If anyone one of them comes back with just one mention, I will be surprised.

Candidates are elected by the Main Stream Media.

Why this question still comes up is beyond me. Its right before you eyes, or more apt, NOT before your eyes. THAT IS THE REASON!

DITTO. The MSM totally drives this thing. And they drove DRP out of it long ago.

 

[Highstreet]

I think it has to do with the feeling that the primaries are pretty much over and the states from here on out really don't matter. Whether that's true or not is another thing, but that's what people are feeling I think. One thing I find interesting is the difference between voter turnout of republicans vs democrats. Go to politico.com and check out the numbers. For example, in Wisconsin (91% reporting atm) the total # of votes for the democrats is 1,002,058 and the republican turnout is 373,696. That's a pretty significant difference and seems pretty consistent across the states.

Yes. Many are just voting "for the winner" or "against the winner".

It is not any one thing that HQ did or didn't do. It is many things that the Media did and didn't do. We have been shown the power of the Propaganda machine this year. HQ didn't do better or worse than any other campaign.

The good news is that we are still winning many delegates. We need to keep working on turning the Romney and McCain delegates. Especially those in the states that are unbound.