Why Did God Issue A Stronger Penalty For Eating Meat Than For Murder?

[Suzanimal]

No, I didn't think you were trolling because we disagree. It honestly sounded like you were trolling because of the way you said it. Like you were pulling my leg.

But since you're serious, I'll ask... why even state that? What is your point? It sounded like you were justifying eating animals by implying that it's no different than eating fruit.

There are many problems with that. Number one, it's flatly false. Fruits and veggies do not have a brain or a central nervous system. A banana is not crying out, "Do not eat me, please don't kill me, I want to live a long life and die of old age!!!" Animals, on the other hand, DO feel pain, DO have a will to live and not be eaten.

From a Christian (or just about any) perspective, fruits and veggies exist to be our food, it's the way God (or mother nature, for the non-Christians) designed it. Are you Christian, if you don't mind me asking?

Also... if you honestly believe that vegetation feels pain and has a will to live, like animals do.... why do you eat them? Why eat animals too, for that matter? I used to think differently, but I've learned that the whole "humane killing" thing is a misnomer. But that's a topic for another day. The bottom line is, animals do not want to be killed and eaten. So if you genuinely respect all living beings and think all life is sacred, why disregard their will by eating them?

Actually, plants do react when threatened. Just because they can't squeal doesn't mean they don't want to live.

New research on plant intelligence may forever change how you think about plants

...

But can a plant be intelligent? Some plant scientists insist they are — since they can sense, learn, remember and even react in ways that would be familiar to humans.

Michael Pollan, author of such books as "The Omnivore's Dilemma" and "The Botany of Desire," wrote the New Yorker piece about the developments in plant science. He says for the longest time, even mentioning the idea that plants could be intelligent was a quick way to being labeled "a whacko." But no more, which might be comforting to people who have long talked to their plants or played music for them.

The new research, he says, is in a field called plant neurobiology — which is something of a misnomer, because even scientists in the field don't argue that plants have neurons or brains.

"They have analagous structures," Pollan explains. "They have ways of taking all the sensory data they gather in their everyday lives ... integrate it and then behave in an appropriate way in response. And they do this without brains, which, in a way, is what's incredible about it, because we automatically assume you need a brain to process information."

And we assume you need ears to hear. But researchers, says Pollan, have played a recording of a caterpillar munching on a leaf to plants — and the plants react. They begin to secrete defensive chemicals — even though the plant isn't really threatened, Pollan says. "It is somehow hearing what is, to it, a terrifying sound of a caterpillar munching on its leaves."

Pollan says plants have all the same senses as humans, and then some. In addition to hearing, taste, for example, they can sense gravity, the presence of water, or even feel that an obstruction is in the way of its roots, before coming into contact with it. Plant roots will shift direction, he says, to avoid obstacles.

So what about pain? Do plants feel? Pollan says they do respond to anesthetics. "You can put a plant out with a human anesthetic. ... And not only that, plants produce their own compounds that are anesthetic to us." But scientists are reluctant to go as far as to say they are responding to pain.

How plants sense and react is still somewhat unknown. They don't have nerve cells like humans, but they do have a system for sending electrical signals and even produce neurotransmitters, like dopamine, serotonin and other chemicals the human brain uses to send signals.

"We don't know why they have them, whether this was just conserved through evolution or if it performs some sort of information processing function. We don't know. There's a lot we don't know," Pollan says.

And chalk up another human-like ability — memory.

..

http://www.pri.org/stories/2014-01-...may-forever-change-how-you-think-about-plants

 

[heavenlyboy34]

I don't even believe in evolution, as taught in government universities. Do you?

No. So you shouldn't cite this source, agreed?

And what she is saying is visibly true. You don't need to consult with a university professor to see that we have flat teeth, or a small mouth, or a long digestive tract, unlike carnivores.

No, that isn't visibly true. Other qualified people look at the same evidence and say "omnivore". I can plainly see that I have teeth well designed for ripping and tearing flesh as well as some suitable for grinding plant matter.

 

[lilymc]

So god's design now is suffering and death?

No, it's cause and effect. I think it break God's heart to see what a mess we've made of this world, in so many ways. I would say more about this, but I don't want to get too off topic.

And as Ender put it, I also am of the mind that plants possess sentience and the will to live as well and suffer when they die.

I can't watch videos where I am right now, so I'll wait until I can, unless you want to thumbnail it for me.

That said, of course you're free to do and believa as you wish, but I for one, remain unconvinced.

I don't think you really believe that a banana feels pain and suffers when we eat it. And I'm sorry, but I've got to be honest... of all the arguments against not eating meat, I think that's definitely the worst one by far. I even thought it was bad when I was a meat eater.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Well, here's what God said upon creation.

Genesis 1:29-30

[SUP]29 [/SUP]And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

[SUP]30 [/SUP]And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so.

Y'all gonna tell God you're right and He's wrong about His own creations or what?

 

[lilymc]

Actually, plants do react when threatened. Just because they can't squeal doesn't mean they don't want to live.

 

[Suzanimal]

I do.

Frankly, I don't care what other people eat or don't eat and I don't care what the Bible says about food. I'm a proud omnivore. I only commented because there are studies about plant feelings but mostly because you called Ender a troll. Ya may disagree with him but he's not a troll.

 

[lilymc]

I do.

Frankly, I don't care what other people eat or don't eat and I don't care what the Bible says about food. I'm a proud omnivore. I only commented because there are studies about plant feelings but mostly because you called Ender a troll. Ya may disagree with him but he's not a troll.

No, no, no. I know that Ender is not a troll, and I didn't say "you are a troll"... I said "you must be trolling" (which even some non-trolls do, every once in awhile.) Probably a bad choice of words... but I wondered if he was joking/mocking... I couldn't tell if he was serious or not in that post.

 

[RicoCabeza]

(We know that animals who experience distress during slaughter produce poorer quality meat) Please review Leviticus 11. It is extremely explicit here that *certain* animals are for consumption.

Christian Scholar David Vose proved that these old testament laws for the Israelites did not come from God the father, but rather from Enki, who was evil like the devil. David Vose rocked the Christian world by producing the following 53 minute video: - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLY-kREGwno

 

[Anti Federalist]

Christian Scholar David Vose proved that these old testament laws for the Israelites did not come from God the father, but rather from Enki, who was evil like the devil. David Vose rocked the Christian world by producing the following 53 minute video: - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLY-kREGwno

Oh, so the Holy Word Of God only applies to parts of the Bible.

When we don't agree, it was in fact written by man.

Good to know I can disregard Paul's ramblings now.

To argue this from a religious perspective is beyond ridiculous.

The system God supposedly created favors apex predators and omnivores with highest order of brain development and intelligence.

Dolphins, generally regarded as the second most intelligent species on the planet, are pure carnivores.

 

[RicoCabeza]

To argue this from a religious perspective is beyond ridiculous. The system God supposedly created favors apex predators and omnivores with highest order of brain development and intelligence.

What is beyond ridiculous is to assert that a God who creates a planet of sentient creatures that would eat each other, is somehow noble, righteous and loving. What a load of B.S. We live on a prison planet of pure EVIL, and souls are recycled back to here, oftentimes against their will. Mainstream Christianity's description of Hell is spot on in describing our current reality. Clearly we are already living in hell. Eating meat is just par for the course here, as is all evil. Justice would be for all beef eaters to return back as a cow, and all chicken eaters to return back as a chicken, etc., for as many times as they have eaten. This forum is titled "Peace Through Religion", yet most of the participants on this thread argue in favor of "Violence Through Religion".

 

[pcosmar]

What is beyond ridiculous is to assert that a God who creates a planet of sentient creatures that would eat each other, is somehow noble, righteous and loving. What a load of B.S. We live on a prison planet of pure EVIL, and souls are recycled back to here, oftentimes against their will. Mainstream Christianity's description of Hell is spot on in describing our current reality. Clearly we are already living in hell. Eating meat is just par for the course here, as is all evil.

Well,
That is one opinion.

You are welcome to it. I want no part of it.

 

[Anti Federalist]

We live on a prison planet of pure EVIL, and souls are recycled back to here, oftentimes against their will. Mainstream Christianity's description of Hell is spot on in describing our current reality.

Nonsense.

There is sublime beauty, joy and passion in this world as well as evil.

You want that to be the case because you see evil in somebody eating a hamburger.

Check yourself bud.

 

[heavenlyboy34]

What is beyond ridiculous is to assert that a God who creates a planet of sentient creatures that would eat each other, is somehow noble, righteous and loving. What a load of B.S. We live on a prison planet of pure EVIL, and souls are recycled back to here, oftentimes against their will. Mainstream Christianity's description of Hell is spot on in describing our current reality. Clearly we are already living in hell. Eating meat is just par for the course here, as is all evil. Justice would be for all beef eaters to return back as a cow, and all chicken eaters to return back as a chicken, etc., for as many times as they have eaten. This forum is titled "Peace Through Religion", yet most of the participants on this thread argue in favor of "Violence Through Religion".

Non sequitur. The meat eaters in this thread prefer humane and ethical means of treating and slaughtering animals raised for food.