Who plans on joining the Free State Project in New Hampshire this year?

[Keith and stuff]

There are still some things NH is slightly behind on, such as marijuana law reform. But it looks like they're catching up with the help of newly elected libertarian Republicans!

Even though NH is designed to have the weakest governor in the county, the governor is still able to veto. We would have medical marijuana in NH if it wasn't for Gov. Lynch and his veto. The House passed a decrim bill and a hemp bill this year.

Even today there was good news in NH.

NH GOP Kills Gay Marriage Repeal
March 21, 2012 by Jason Sorens
http://pileusblog.wordpress.com/2012/03/21/nh-gop-kills-gay-marriage-repeal/

The New Hampshire House, dominated 3-to-1 by Republicans, has just voted by an approximately 2-to-1 majority to kill a bill that would have repealed same-sex marriage

While Republicans in other states have been moving for years to prevent or even get a constitutional ban on gay marriage, Republicans in NH refuse to even go to civil unions. They decided to keep gay marriage in NH.

Meanwhile, the NH Senate just passed a bill to give businesses tax credits for funding private and out-of-district public school scholarships.

Ron Paul Co-chair Sen. Jim Forsythe was the main player behind this bill.

 

[WilliamShrugged]

I'm really pressing hard on myself to save so i can move up there... I should have moved up there last year now i have to build up my savings and look to see if my job in banking can get me a good start up there. In a year or two well see.

 

[kahless]

I took this from 2008 Tax Foundation data of 1822 tracked US counties. The lower the rank indicates the higher county property tax rate. There are more than a 1100 US counties that have lower property taxes than the lowest NH county listed.

County / Tax as a percent of home value / Rank

Belknap County, New Hampshire 1.44% 317
Carroll County, New Hampshire 0.99% 672
Cheshire County, New Hampshire 1.99% 58
Coos County, New Hampshire 2.00% 57
Grafton County, New Hampshire 1.65% 190
Hillsborough County, New Hampshire 1.69% 170
Merrimack County, New Hampshire 1.86% 98
Rockingham County, New Hampshire 1.61% 210
Strafford County, New Hampshire 1.80% 123
Sullivan County, New Hampshire 1.89% 87


Median Property taxes paid

Rank / County / Amount
100 Belknap County, New Hampshire $3,436
273 Carroll County, New Hampshire $2,364
57 Cheshire County, New Hampshire $4,020
234 Coos County, New Hampshire $2,544
98 Grafton County, New Hampshire $3,454
33 Hillsborough County, New Hampshire $4,741
35 Merrimack County, New Hampshire $4,581
25 Rockingham County, New Hampshire $5,196
47 Strafford County, New Hampshire $4,196
96 Sullivan County, New Hampshire $3,475

As someone pointed out here I am not taking into consideration areas in these counties that are without property taxes. I see a link by another poster and check only a few of those places that turned out to have 0 population which calls into question whether they are state lands and/or having buildable property.

 

[Anti Federalist]

I took this from 2008 Tax Foundation data of 1822 tracked US counties. The lower the rank indicates the higher county property tax rate. There are more than a 1100 US counties that have lower property taxes than the lowest NH county listed.

County / Tax as a percent of home value / Rank

Belknap County, New Hampshire 1.44% 317
Carroll County, New Hampshire 0.99% 672
Cheshire County, New Hampshire 1.99% 58
Coos County, New Hampshire 2.00% 57
Grafton County, New Hampshire 1.65% 190
Hillsborough County, New Hampshire 1.69% 170
Merrimack County, New Hampshire 1.86% 98
Rockingham County, New Hampshire 1.61% 210
Strafford County, New Hampshire 1.80% 123
Sullivan County, New Hampshire 1.89% 87


Median Property taxes paid

Rank / County / Amount
100 Belknap County, New Hampshire $3,436
273 Carroll County, New Hampshire $2,364
57 Cheshire County, New Hampshire $4,020
234 Coos County, New Hampshire $2,544
98 Grafton County, New Hampshire $3,454
33 Hillsborough County, New Hampshire $4,741
35 Merrimack County, New Hampshire $4,581
25 Rockingham County, New Hampshire $5,196
47 Strafford County, New Hampshire $4,196
96 Sullivan County, New Hampshire $3,475

As someone pointed out here I am not taking into consideration areas in these counties that are without property taxes. I see a link by another poster and check only a few of those places that turned out to have 0 population which calls into question whether they are state lands and/or having buildable property.

Yes, the rates are higher than what they are in many areas of the country.

It needs to be addressed and we're working on it.

Ain't nothin perfect...

 

[Keith and stuff]

It is true, property taxes tend to be high is certain parts of WA, OR, CA, IL, TX, FL and every state in the Northeast. NH is included in those states. Are overall state taxes lowest in NH? Yes. Are overall combined state and local taxes near the lowest in NH? Yes. However, people in parts of NH like high property taxes. As I mentioned a day or two ago, people in Rockingham County and in Portsmouth, NH like high property taxes.

As for the places in NH without property taxes, they are unincorporated townships. Many of them are purchases or grants that were issued while NH was still part of England or shortly after. Some of them do not have buildable land or people. Some of them do. There are also places in NH with very low property taxes, places with buildable land.

You are aware of Grafton, NH, right? It's likely the freest place in the continuous 48 states. More liberty lovers continue to move there. It may end up becoming the beacon showing the industrialized world that liberty can work.

 

[Crotale]

I don't see how property taxes are worse than an income tax? All taxation is theft and forced labour, but as I said earlier, I'd rather have my money stolen from me through property tax than income tax.

 

[tbone717]

I'm curious how old most of you folks are that are planning on moving to NH, and how established you are in your careers. There is no way that we would ever leave PA to move to NH. We are in our early 40's, I have a successful businesses here, family (including aging parents), friends - a lifetime of connections. We have a great home that we have put a lot of work into, and at this stage of our life does not cost much for us to maintain. Moving to NH would require us to start over from scratch. At our age, and considering all that we have established here, it would be foolish for us to do so.

 

[kahless]

I don't see how property taxes are worse than an income tax? All taxation is theft and forced labour, but as I said earlier, I'd rather have my money stolen from me through property tax than income tax.

Property taxes ensure forced labor in the governments economic system. Without property taxes you could live freely on your property, live off your land and trade with others. Therefore you could avoid any forced participation by our government slave masters.

Hopefully FSP will eventually do something about it. Where ever I am at I plan to dedicate the rest of my life fighting our authoritarian governments restrictions on owning property by forced private property taxation. I will fight our Communist political parties, our money grubbing teachers unions that want to make us all subservient to them as well as my local, state and county governments, because living freely on private property is basic right of freedom.

fighting = politically and peacefully.

 

[kahless]

I'm curious how old most of you folks are that are planning on moving to NH, and how established you are in your careers. There is no way that we would ever leave PA to move to NH. We are in our early 40's, I have a successful businesses here, family (including aging parents), friends - a lifetime of connections. We have a great home that we have put a lot of work into, and at this stage of our life does not cost much for us to maintain. Moving to NH would require us to start over from scratch. At our age, and considering all that we have established here, it would be foolish for us to do so.

I am in my 40s also so a long way off from retirement but it is something that needs to be considered now. I have seen first hand from seniors whom worked and owned property all their lives only to be forced in ill health to slave to our authoritarian governments to pay school property taxes for other peoples kids and pay services they do not want or ask for, so they are not thrown off their land.

 

[tbone717]

I am in my 40s also so a long way off from retirement but it is something that needs to be considered now. I have seen first hand from seniors whom worked and owned property all their lives only to be forced in ill health to slave to our authoritarian governments to pay school property taxes for other peoples kids and pay services they do not want or ask for, so they are not thrown off their land.

Right and I understand that. It is a nice goal for those who are trying to achieve it, however there is little if any incentive for someone like myself other than a plan and a dream that may or may not come about. Sure I will save money with no state income tax and no sales tax, but I would have to find a way to replace a sizable income. I am self-employed and have been all my life, walking away from a business like I have would be foolish for the relatively small savings of taxes. And that doesn't take into account the aspect of family, friends, etc.

So what is the incentive for someone like myself that owns a home, has a large family and friend network, a business that provides a sizable income, and ties to the community?

 

[Schiff_FTW]

Right and I understand that. It is a nice goal for those who are trying to achieve it, however there is little if any incentive for someone like myself other than a plan and a dream that may or may not come about. Sure I will save money with no state income tax and no sales tax, but I would have to find a way to replace a sizable income. I am self-employed and have been all my life, walking away from a business like I have would be foolish for the relatively small savings of taxes. And that doesn't take into account the aspect of family, friends, etc.

So what is the incentive for someone like myself that owns a home, has a large family and friend network, a business that provides a sizable income, and ties to the community?

You obviously are not the target market. But to many young people who haven't really settled down the Project is an attractive option. When I went to the FSP Liberty Forum a few years back I'd estimate at least half the people there were under 30. Which is great for the future of the movement, especially if it keeps making tangible gains, as people will stay active if they see results.

 

[Keith and stuff]

Schiff_FTW, a guy that worked for Schiff in NYC moved to NH as part of the FSP last year. If you listen to Schiff's show, you may have heard about it.

The target market for the FSP is pretty much everyone that signs the state of intent. It is sometimes easier for people from the Northeast, like PA or NJ, to move to NH. We have had lots of movers from PA, including a few last year. A couple of PA families created the Bardo Farm in NH which now has an annual Bardo Farm Fest. It may have had 100 people last year. It's a mix of friends and family from PA and liberty lovers in NH. A really interesting event. There is another married couple from PA that are doing great in NH. The wife works in financial services (really big in NH) and the husband still does the same job he did while in PA, I beleive. Another guy that moved from PA traveled to NV to volunteer for Paul in the NV Caucus. Heck, I have a roommate that moved here from PA

One of the top firearms/weapons defense attorneys in the nation moved here from NJ. He practices law in at least NJ and NH. He has done a lot of work to reduce firearm and knife regulations in NH. The Speaker of the NH House is originally from NJ

If someone has kids, I especially encourage a move. Not only is NH by far the best state to raise a child (lowest child poverty, lowest crime, lowest teen prego rate, lowest infant mortal., lowest risk of parent killing child...) but it is also the freest state. It makes sense to raise children in a freer environment. Children learn as they grow. Perhaps that's why children and adults tend to be smarter in NH than other states and do wonderful at smartness/intelligence state to state comparisons.

 

[tbone717]

You obviously are not the target market. But to many young people who haven't really settled down the Project is an attractive option. When I went to the FSP Liberty Forum a few years back I'd estimate at least half the people there were under 30. Which is great for the future of the movement, especially if it keeps making tangible gains, as people will stay active if they see results.

I think the issue with this for many is that it is a dream, and while it is a nice one, it is still a plan laid out on paper rather than something concrete. Even going back to my mid 20's I would have have walked away from all that I had achieved at that point for something that was hypothetical. Even in my mid 20's I had my own business, owned a home and had family ties. My roots here today are far stronger than they were 20 years ago, but nonetheless I still had roots.

I think it is a nice idea, but it is a very hard sell unless someone has little, if any, career success and family ties.

 

[tbone717]

Schiff_FTW, a guy that worked for Schiff in NYC moved to NH as part of the FSP last year. If you listen to Schiff's show, you may have heard about it.

The target market for the FSP is pretty much everyone that signs the state of intent. It is sometimes easier for people from the Northeast, like PA or NJ, to move to NH. We have had lots of movers from PA, including a few last year. A couple of PA families created the Bardo Farm in NH which now has an annual Bardo Farm Fest. It may have had 100 people last year. It's a mix of friends and family from PA and liberty lovers in NH. A really interesting event. There is another married couple from PA that are doing great in NH. The wife works in financial services (really big in NH) and the husband still does the same job he did while in PA, I beleive. Another guy that moved from PA traveled to NV to volunteer for Paul in the NV Caucus. Heck, I have a roommate that moved here from PA

One of the top firearms/weapons defense attorneys in the nation moved here from NJ. He practices law in at least NJ and NH. He has done a lot of work to reduce firearm and knife regulations in NH. The Speaker of the NH House is originally from NJ

If someone has kids, I especially encourage a move. Not only is NH by far the best state to raise a child (lowest child poverty, lowest crime, lowest teen prego rate, lowest infant mortal., lowest risk of parent killing child...) but it is the freest state. It makes sense to raise children in a freer environment. Children learn as they grow. Perhaps that's why children and adults tend to be smarter in NH than other states and do wonderful at smartness/intelligence state to state comparisons.

But what is the incentive for someone who has already built for themselves a very nice life where they currently live, other than the ideology behind the movement. I just don't see the selling point.

 

[Liberty4life]

We need a nationwide free state project, this country has been polarized and divided, we live in two country's now.
One country is entirely taken over by illegals in every sense of the word.
Unfortunately most of the levers of power are also controlled by this "bandit" country.

 

[TheTexan]

But what is the incentive for someone who has already built for themselves a very nice life where they currently live, other than the ideology behind the movement. I just don't see the selling point.

Maybe so your family doesn't get murdered by cops? Just a thought.

 

[kahless]

FSP should look at banding together on the county level and having like minded counties forming a separate state instead of trying to take over the entire state. FSP will always be held back and denied their right to self determination by the heavily populated Socialist counties.

 

[Schiff_FTW]

I think the issue with this for many is that it is a dream, and while it is a nice one, it is still a plan laid out on paper rather than something concrete. Even going back to my mid 20's I would have have walked away from all that I had achieved at that point for something that was hypothetical. Even in my mid 20's I had my own business, owned a home and had family ties. My roots here today are far stronger than they were 20 years ago, but nonetheless I still had roots.

I think it is a nice idea, but it is a very hard sell unless someone has little, if any, career success and family ties.

I disagree. I'm 28 and intend to move to NH within a few years after my current job winds down. It would be foolish for me to stay in CT with the ridiculous taxes and otherwise very high cost of living. I want to start my own business, and CT is a horrible place to do that. I watch what my boss has to put up with and I'm amazed we haven't gone under yet. It is like CT wants small businesses to fail.

There are many reasons why people would want to move to NH, just because you're not persuaded doesn't mean others aren't (indeed over a 1000 have been so far).

 

[TheTexan]

I think the issue with this for many is that it is a dream, and while it is a nice one, it is still a plan laid out on paper rather than something concrete. Even going back to my mid 20's I would have have walked away from all that I had achieved at that point for something that was hypothetical. Even in my mid 20's I had my own business, owned a home and had family ties. My roots here today are far stronger than they were 20 years ago, but nonetheless I still had roots.

I think it is a nice idea, but it is a very hard sell unless someone has little, if any, career success and family ties.

It doesn't have to be hypothetical. If even a fraction of this movement agreed to move to NH, it would be a guaranteed success.

Basically the problem is, very few are taking the FSP seriously, because very few are taking the FSP seriously. It's circular. We just need to find a way to change perception of the project so that more people view it as a viable option.

I believe extremely strongly that those currently trying the Free Country Project are destined to fail, because the country doesn't want freedom and will fight them at every turn. I believe if they can just accept this to be true, they will basically be left with 2 options

1) Live as a slave
2) Take their freedom back

 

[TheTexan]

FSP should look at banding together on the county level and having like minded counties forming a separate state instead of trying to take over the entire state. FSP will always be held back and denied their right to self determination by the heavily populated Socialist counties.

A worthy proposition.