Whats with all the 9/11 junk?

[revolutionman]

i personally believe that the 9/11 Commission Report was hog wash, but as a political movement public perception of the movement is all important. Candidates will get laughed off the ballot if they are connected openly with the 9/11 truth movement. We need to run parallel to one another, but never openly intersect.

 

[Peace&Freedom]

i personally believe that the 9/11 Commission Report was hog wash, but as a political movement public perception of the movement is all important. Candidates will get laughed off the ballot if they are connected openly with the 9/11 truth movement. We need to run parallel to one another, but never openly intersect.

There is a self-perception problem that dwarves the public perception of 9-11 truth. Many Paul supporters have from the start thought of themselves as a 'mainstream' movement, even in the face major efforts to show their strength (such as the march) drawing less than 10,000 people. They have further thought they could selectively choose to promote non-mainstream liberty issues a la carte, like the federal reserve, or 'blowback' theory etc., to the 90% of voters who barely know who the Vice President is. These Paulite pots believed, and seem to still believe, they can call all the liberty kettles black.

I remember reading columns by the late Sam Francis less than ten years ago where he lamented that merits aside, it would be almost impossible to get the general public to understand issues like ending the Fed, which only 'Birchers' were known to care about (they were the stigmatized 'truthers' back then). The very informed-10% vs. the 'sheeple'-90% Jericho wall still stands today, for a variety of reasons. Because that wall still stands, the Revolution is NOT a mainstream movement, and thus in no position to assert their custom set of 10% liberty issues as 'winning' issues, compared to 9-11 truth being a 'get laughed off the ballot' issue to champion.

To do so reflects a lack of perspective as to how long it will take to move our existing emergent mass movement into a mature mass movement. I think it will take an alliance embracing and promoting all liberty issues of major concern to the grassroots, while disposing of a la carte factionalism. At this time, all these issues are still viewed as fringe by a large segment of the public who will never research the facts, be it over the IRS, the Fed, the borders or the war. It will be interesting, though, to see if some planned 9-11 truth events happen to garner a larger audience than was gathered for the Revolution March. If they do, what becomes of the notion that the Paul movement was bigger than 9-11 truth, or that the latter is 'junk?'

 

[RickyJ]

How dare any of you cast shame on a truther. We have worked so very hard, not only for 911 truth, but also for promoting freedom and constitutional awareness.

Shame on you

Absolutely! 9/11 truth will wake up more people than knowledge of the Federal reserve and fiat money ever will. We have undeniable facts you can see with your own eyes and hear with your own ears on our side. Google WTC7. Watch it come down. Then realize NO plane hit it, it was announced as having totally collapsed up to 30 minutes BEFORE it happened on several major networks and the BBC. It collpased around 5:20pm that afternoon. The towers came down in the morning. It was a "perfect demolition" in the words of a demolition expert who saw it come down, not knowing it was WTC7. Perfect demolitions like that take months to do. It was done around 5:20pm on 9/11. 9/11 was an inside job.

 

[abruzz0]

I bought into the "official" story of 9/11 for about 6 weeks, then I heard this guy named Alex Jones talk about how it was an inside job. For 6 1/2 years I've studied the event, seen the videos, studied goverment sponsored terror, and there's no way I can deny it all and say "Oh, it's just a crazy conspiracy theory. Life is perfect. Everything's fine." And as one poster put it, "Who cares?" Yeah, seriously, who cares if our government launches false flag attacks to ruin our military, economy, and whatever was left of our reputation around the world?

I don't "believe" 9/11 was an inside job. I know it was an inside job. Do the research and be honest with yourself.

As is the case with any political movement, some folks are more vocal than others. When I talk about 9/11 being an inside job, I discuss it with co-workers and my fellow students one on one. I've found that to be an effective way. However, if things keep going the way they are, I might have to do what's right, get on a bullhorn, and force people to learn the truth.

Can the people who accept the official 9/11 fable look themselves in the mirror and believe they're being intellectually honest? You acknowledge government corruption is rampant, yet you'll give them the benefit of the doubt and call 9/11 a prime example of government incompetence. What a ridiculous notion. The criminals who run our government don't care if they slaughter 3,000 innocent people. The ends justify the means for them. Surely you're quite aware of that, right? The neocons are ruthless killers. What's 1 million dead Iraqis to them? It's an excellent excuse to invade Iran and mutilate more people. So what is 3 thousand meager souls, a few planes, and a couple buildings falling down to them? Nothing. But I know it wasn't "nothing." It was the catalyst that has brought us this bogus "War on Terror." It was the catalyst for the ever-increasing police state we're living in today. 9/11 is the root of all this. It's time people stop lying to themselves and get a fucking clue. That's what I'm sick of.

 

[JosephTheLibertarian]

Really really disappointing. All the signs and t-shirts made me sick.

This isn't about your damn 9/11 conspiracy. Grow a brain.

Yeah well... what are you going to do about it? What do you think can be done about it? ok. gotcha. Shit happens in a public demonstration.

 

[OhioMichael]

I used to be really annoyed by all of you 'truthers'. I used to believe that you were detrimental to the liberty cause.

I apologize for my earlier annoyance. I know now that you are all sincere and I am glad that you have aligned yourselves with the liberty movement. It's a big tent and the 'truthers' are probably more passionate than any other group.

 

[GoRon2008]

9/11 was an inside job. The evidence is overwhelming.

Anyone who denies this has not done the research.

If we can expose 9/11 the cult of the omnipotent state will collapse.

I dare you to post one credible piece of evidence proving this.

I will rip it to shreds. I hate the government more than anyone. I wanted it to be true. I really did and I was disappointed when I realized it was all bullshit. If you believe Controlled Demolitions were used, you are delusional.


Again, truthers, I challenge you. I await your "evidence".....

And in case this thread gets deleted, my email is [email protected]. I would love to wake a truther up. I will be polite and professional. I truly want to help somebody realize they are misguided.

 

[GoRon2008]

wow, people expressing their concerns through the use of signs and t-shirts made you "sick?"

hardcore libertarian i see.

Yes, Seeing delusional people running around shouting off "9/11 was an inside job" without any real evidence whatsoever makes me sick.

Not to mention Ron Paul doesn't believe this crap and this march was mostly about him and furthering his cause, not yours.

 

[Leroy_Jenkems]

Absolutely! 9/11 truth will wake up more people than knowledge of the Federal reserve and fiat money ever will. We have undeniable facts you can see with your own eyes and hear with your own ears on our side. Google WTC7. Watch it come down. Then realize NO plane hit it, it was announced as having totally collapsed up to 30 minutes BEFORE it happened on several major networks and the BBC. It collpased around 5:20pm that afternoon. The towers came down in the morning. It was a "perfect demolition" in the words of a demolition expert who saw it come down, not knowing it was WTC7. Perfect demolitions like that take months to do. It was done around 5:20pm on 9/11. 9/11 was an inside job.

You're looking at effects, and arbitrarily pointing at a cause that fits your agenda. I distrust government, too, but I've read over the arguments of why the steel columns in the Twin Towers couldn't have melted from burning jet fuel, witnesses heard loud explosions, several of the hijackers are still alive, blah blah blah. You can make those claims all day long, but there is NO concrete forensic evidence consistent with the principles of physics and engineering to support the "truther" theories of how WTC7, the Twin Towers, etc came down.

Where's the beef?

 

[lucius]

I dare you to post one credible piece of evidence proving this.

I will rip it to shreds. I hate the government more than anyone. I wanted it to be true. I really did and I was disappointed when I realized it was all bullshit. If you believe Controlled Demolitions were used, you are delusional.


Again, truthers, I challenge you. I await your "evidence".....

And in case this thread gets deleted, my email is [email protected]. I would love to wake a truther up. I will be polite and professional. I truly want to help somebody realize they are misguided.

Neo-CONNED: a speech by Ron Paul: http://video.google.com/videoplay?d...4&q=neoconned&ei=0IOQSO_AIYWSqQL4lampBw&hl=en

Insightful, especially minutes 36-40: at the 37:45 he describes a tried & true reoccurring pattern that has been happening for almost a 100 years--what's different now?

 

[raiha]

Thanks for posting that speech Lucius. I knew about the Machiavellian derived inspiration of the neocons but i didn't know about Michael Ledene's (sp?) bright idea of advocating a Pearl Harbour type of incident to galvanize public support behind their pre-emptive war ambitions.
I've seen snippets of the speech in the past but not the whole thing.

One brave man Ron Paul!

 

[RickyJ]

You're looking at effects, and arbitrarily pointing at a cause that fits your agenda. I distrust government, too, but I've read over the arguments of why the steel columns in the Twin Towers couldn't have melted from burning jet fuel, witnesses heard loud explosions, several of the hijackers are still alive, blah blah blah. You can make those claims all day long, but there is NO concrete forensic evidence consistent with the principles of physics and engineering to support the "truther" theories of how WTC7, the Twin Towers, etc came down.

Where's the beef?

This is ALL the beef I need to know 9/11 was an inside job. Now where's your beef that it wasn't? The MSM? The government? PLEASE!
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3898962504721899003

 

[Leroy_Jenkems]

This is ALL the beef I need to know 9/11 was an inside job. Now where's your beef that it wasn't? The MSM? The government? PLEASE!
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3898962504721899003

Here I go again, being a lemming to the corporate-controlled media's propaganda...

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/1227842.html?page=5#wtc7
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wtc7#Collapse

Now, I don't trust Wikipedia much, but it makes points worth examination.

Yes, the video you sent showing WTC7 coming down looks EXACTLY like a controlled demolition, but if the "inside" people wanted to get rid of this building, why would they even bother making it a nice "controlled" collapse? Why even bother taking the time to place charges at the precise locations on the main structural foundation columns to execute a clean vertical fall? Why not just throw a bunch of charges on the columns and let the chips fall where they may? Does the "truth" story thicken the plot here? I am willing to hear you out.

 

[Melissa Miles]

Here I go again, being a lemming to the corporate-controlled media's propaganda...

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/1227842.html?page=5#wtc7
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wtc7#Collapse

Now, I don't trust Wikipedia much, but it makes points worth examination.

Yes, the video you sent showing WTC7 coming down looks EXACTLY like a controlled demolition, but if the "inside" people wanted to get rid of this building, why would they even bother making it a nice "controlled" collapse? Why even bother taking the time to place charges at the precise locations on the main structural foundation columns to execute a clean vertical fall? Why not just throw a bunch of charges on the columns and let the chips fall where they may? Does the "truth" story thicken the plot here? I am willing to hear you out.

I gotta say, after watching the first video, it does not come as comfort to me when I scrolled all the way down to find a mccain vs obama banner advertisement... I don't know...

 

[Leroy_Jenkems]

I gotta say, after watching the first video, it does not come as comfort to me when I scrolled all the way down to find a mccain vs obama banner advertisement... I don't know...

Yeah, there's some ad banners on the forums that have no place here, like the one advertising for the Church of Scientology, and the one for Juan McCain stating that he supports judges that will properly interpret the Constitution. Yeah right...

 

[PatriotOne]

Yes, Seeing delusional people running around shouting off "9/11 was an inside job" without any real evidence whatsoever makes me sick.

You trolls are so predictable. You think by simply repeating the same lie over and over again (no real evidence!) is going to keep people from looking at the mountain of evidence. That dam has already broke asshat. There is a reason that dozens of 9/11 video's (and related topics) are consistently in the top 100 most viewed video's on Google alone. It's not established truthers watching them over and over again. We've already seen them and passed them on to OTHER people, who are watching them and passing them on to OTHER people, who are watching them and passing them on to OTHER people. They aren't doing that because they think there is no credible evidence, they are doing that because they are shocked at the amount of evidence there is after they watch them.

I suggest you change your "the earth is not round because there is no evidence for it " rhetoric and immediately commence to stage 2 of becoming a Government apoligist by making excuses for them instead.

 

[JosephTheLibertarian]

Going to a bank cannot prove, or disprove, the stupidity of interpreting the 9/11 message as a threat. The outcome would be irrelevant. Assume dim people are working the bank, and assume a dim cop responds. Assume I get arrested for something. Fine; landed the way you hoped, but proves nothing. It is a pointless excercise.

On the other hand, the TSA proves their stupidity daily, no further research required. We flew fine for decades without the TSA, and do not need them at all. The TSA causes more harm than good, and should be eliminated.

 

[Isaac Bickerstaff]

The elephant in the room is that 9/11 was used by the administration and their handlers as an excuse for a power grab. Nobody called them on it because they were afraid, "Better off losing liberty than being dead."
Classic machiavellian politics.
The movement appears to have been polluted by passion, but the original intent was to show people that they were afraid of the wrong enemy. I believe that there is as much room for Truthers in our movement as there is room for those who believe in the 19 terrorist theory. There is really only one rule that we need to follow here, and that is "Don't be a knob"
It is merely cognitive dissonance that makes the blowback against the truth movement so passionate among fellow liberty loving folks. CBS has one version AFP has another. The truth most likely lies in the middle.

 

[JosephTheLibertarian]

What I don't understand is how we are expected to just believe the "facts" as they are spoon-fed to us. Conspiracies like this exist because people aren't content that the information we are given by the media is entirely truthful, not because they don't believe the facts. It's a tragedy that we will never know the whole, complete, story of what happened on 9/11.

 

[Leroy_Jenkems]

It is merely cognitive dissonance that makes the blowback against the truth movement so passionate among fellow liberty loving folks. CBS has one version AFP has another. The truth most likely lies in the middle.

Hopefully I'm not taking the last line of your post out of context, but that's my perspective - the truth lies somewhere in the middle. I do believe that the government knew about the attacks well before they occured, but did nothing. Yet, even if there were base charges of thermite, C4, whatever set up in WTC7 and/or the Twin Towers, how is it known that our government did the set up, and not other terrorists connected with foreign or possibly domestic cell networks?

At the end of the day, the human mind takes postulated scenarios to whichever extreme of speculation that emotions deem necessary. You can state that through logical discourse and deductive reasoning the truther movement has arrived at its current theory of what really happened, but I've met more than several truthers since joining the grassroots, and none of them struck me as very methodical in their thought and reasoning processes.

I realize stereotyping is never appropriate, however.