War Makes sense, America doesn't...and I miss the war...

Hey Uriel, I was going to send this pm but that doesn't seem to work for newbs, even oldnewbs. Anyways, I read an article in vanity fair about a group of veterans that have formed some kind of writing club. It's called Words after War. I've never been through some shit like that but writing has always helped me find something worth saying of the past, a thing worth saving from the past, even if it has fallen short of approaching true and ubiquitous meaning. Welcome back, that's not sarcastic but probably sounds like it. But maybe something found in a harder place, more demonstrative of the true tragedy of human life, well hell those are the places true meaning is to be found, if it is to be found anywhere. By being willing to share this I would say you have a writer's soul, and though it doesn't sound like its possible I do believe that writing, that is bequeathing your thoughts, observations, and feelings, to the future is very important. Particularly when the future looks like so much fail especially regarding elites sending other people to war.

Sure, one could say: Look at all the veteran writers in the past, what have they accomplished? It still happens, people still fall into line for the same old line. But I say perhaps critical mass hasn't yet been reached, in that respect, or rather it hasn't been written.

I cannot comment on anything you feel, though, since the only battle scars I have are self inflicted. Man vs Self, fuck being a trope.
 
Last edited:
this is one of the stupidest things to say to someone who's explaining their epiphany. Bravo douchebag. You are really getting on my shitlist and that's a new one because in 7 years I've been here no one has done that.

Because unlike most people, I don't care about being popular. Not even on a libertarian forum.
 
Because unlike most people, I don't care about being popular. Not even on a libertarian forum.

He wasn't trying to teach you how to be popular. He was trying to point you toward a good outlet for your Christian compassion.

Jesus, as I recall, made quite a point of showing people compassion at the moment they made a heartfelt repentance of their sins. At that pivotal moment, He was smart enough to do nothing to discourage them. Why do you think He made forgiveness His main weapon against evil? Because He actually liked saving people.

Lots of Christians have a 'private club' mentality. But Jesus never showed the slightest interest in setting up one of those. Quite the opposite. It's pretty obvious that He felt He had better things to do at the moment of repentance than bashing people over the head in an arrogant manner for the very sins they're repenting of.
 
He wasn't trying to teach you how to be popular. He was trying to point you toward a good outlet for your Christian compassion.

Jesus, as I recall, made quite a point of showing people compassion at the moment they made a heartfelt repentance of their sins. At that pivotal moment, He was smart enough to do nothing to discourage them. Why do you think He made forgiveness His main weapon against evil? Because He actually liked saving people.

Lots of Christians have a 'private club' mentality. But Jesus never showed the slightest interest in setting up one of those. Quite the opposite. It's pretty obvious that He felt He had better things to do at the moment of repentance than bashing people over the head in an arrogant manner for the very sins they're repenting of.

Maybe I'm just stupid, but I didn't see any repentance in the OP. I saw a "the world loses nothing when an Afghan dies, they're barbarians so while we shouldn't have gotten involved I wasn't wrong for doing what I did." Do I have a hard time with compassion? Yeah, I'll admit that. But I didn't see any repentance in this thread.
 
Maybe I'm just stupid, but I didn't see any repentance in the OP. I saw a "the world loses nothing when an Afghan dies, they're barbarians so while we shouldn't have gotten involved I wasn't wrong for doing what I did." Do I have a hard time with compassion? Yeah, I'll admit that. But I didn't see any repentance in this thread.

Hm.

Well, if you want my opinion, I think you should look harder.

Humanity is sweeter when its bearer can be humane even to those who never earned his respect...
 
Hm.

Well, if you want my opinion, I think you should look harder.

Humanity is sweeter when its bearer can be humane even to those who never earned his respect...

I don't think the post that Todd quoted qualifies as being inhumane. Then again, I've never been thin-skinned.
 
I don't think the post that Todd quoted qualifies as being inhumane. Then again, I've never been thin-skinned.

You have been thin-skinned. I've seen it. And nothing makes your skin thinner than finding out your very best intentions did not actually lead you to do the right thing.
 
Because unlike most people, I don't care about being popular. Not even on a libertarian forum.

Popularity? Who cares about that. It's as if your statement somehow helped Uriel come to his ephiphany...somehow added to his revelation. :rolleyes: Nah...he got there on his own before you came along.

One of the lesson points I've learned in life is that Telling people the truth, standing on principle and being a Dick can be mutually exclusive.
 
Last edited:
My service was prior 9/11, and I was far from infantry. Being color blind severely limited my job options, and instead of making a mockery of religion (Chaplain's Assistant) I went 75B, Personnel Administration Specialist). In other words, I never saw any form of combat while I was in the Army. I know the disconnect you're describing though, and I think it's not so much "the war" you're missing, but rather the controlled chaos that is military life.

Let's be honest, in the grand scheme of things you know exactly where you are, and where everyone else is within your world. There's something to be said for living the old axiom "Know your role". As many times as I said I couldn't wait to get out, I've said just as many times since that I wish I was still in. There are many misconceptions here regarding that lifestyle, many evident here, which is why I'm really posting this I guess. My job allowed me to help, TRULY help, soldiers and their families. My PMOS had me in a position of running Company, and later Battalion, PACs. BY position virtue alone, this put every soldier's entire life in my hands. I still remember when I was stationed in Korea an E6 thanking me with tears in his eyes for helping him, and all I did was fast track some orders for him through DoD so we could expedite his family moving to his next CONUS post. They were homeless (his dependents), and needed those orders to get post housing ahead of his arrival. The fact that I took out a laptop and did it on Sunday at the barracks instead of waiting until Monday at the office made quite an impression. And that leads me to my point.

People talk about bonds and honor, and that is definitely there. Something else people talk about is the structure, but they don't use it in the right context. There is a unique structure as (speaking to deployed / over seas ) your social life, work life, educational life, ect are all intertwined. It can become comforting fairly quickly, and nothing throws a monkey wrench in that faster than civilian life. At least, that is how it was for me when I got out and had to re-train myself on many things. I'm saying this in hopes that you are the same, and hopefully recognize it as nothing more. This thread is good though, and I hope you continue to find some venue to talk if the need arises. Hell, if need be, I'll PM you my # are you can talk my ear off. Those are some deep questions you're asking, and they can lead to a really dark place if you're not careful.

But the great thing is, even if you think you are alone, you're not. One thing my service in the Army gave me that will last forever is a list 30 miles long of brothers from other mothers. Because it doesn't matter when one served, or what branch.....there is a bond we all just feel with each other. You've got more family than you know of.

And I really wish some people would temper their personal observations on things like having served in the military. It's not like we all ran to a recruiter, and I said, "I want to kill sum'bitches!". Nor does it mean we've participated in slaughtering entire villages of women and children. For example, I joined during peacetime because I had a wife and two children who needed me to find some way to fill a lot of needs in a short time. But even admin guys like me have basic infantryman training, understand fire team tactics, have small arms weapons training, and other skills. In other words, we can't take the "moral high ground" and say we never "sold out". However, if and when that shit does hit the fan, it's people like Uriel, Gunny, and Pericles who liberty will need. I can promise you the last thing you want to do is face off against a 10 man group of highly motivated well trained, and well armed personnel with 15 to 20 untrained rednecks. And I say that as a redneck who grew up hunting and shooting.

People change and learn as they get older. So, instead of wanting to dissect their past, perhaps you should consider it a win to have someone like minded who also has the benefit of knowing how the enemy conducts themselves, both in tactics and armaments. If you're Christian, then know God has brought us all together for a reason. Some made a thread not too long ago regarding some serious "hate" towards former military here, and they were right. I fully respect someone's decision to have no part of the military, and had my life not went the way it did, I most assuredly would not have enlisted myself. The flip side to that coin is that you have no clue about why someone else joined, what they did, or where their heart is at.

To go into a repeated spiel about how immoral someone was regarding a decision they made in life, perhaps it might be better to be sure you know the why of something before you start judging?
 
The Afghan people are feral anyways. There is no loss to world when an Afghan dies..

The death of every human is a loss.

The senseless murder of war is not at all a good thing. Despite the obviously intense brainwashing you have been through.

:(
 
I always wonder if the birth of stories like this is not so much war as it is a general existential crisis that so many people experience when they are not actively engaged in something that forces them to live entirely in the moment. There's something to be said for finding ways to live in a state of flow and focus, and I imagine that the complex nature of a war theater -even during down-time- forces one into that mindset.

Out of curiosity, you say that you enjoy working out, having a drink, and spending time with friends and family. When you're doing those things, and actively engaged in the moment, how do you feel? Are you less restless then? Does a sense of ennui set in when you are not doing those things?

Further, do you write? Do you do anything artistic? Do you take part in sports? Do you play golf, or pool? Have you ever tried martial arts? I feel like all of these things can provide venues to live in the moment, to avoid ennui, and to provide enjoyable goals and reasons for being.
 
War can offer a tremendous amount of clarity and focus. There is you, your buddies, and a few other good people. There are the bad people. You protect the good people and kill the bad people - it seems so simple. having survived going in harm's way, everything else seems trivial. Some guys get hooked on the rush from going into danger and coming back alive, so they keep doing more dangerous things .... for the greater rush - just like any other addict. Don't be one of those guys. Put the experience in a box, and put the box on the shelf in the closet.

Every once in a while, take the box down and open it. Then put it back.

Welcome back to the land of the round door knobs, Marine.

I was watching this documentary on the Hind helicopter and there was a section where they were talking about Russian army conscripts. These men were largely not ethnic Russian and didn't believe in the war, but after one of their buddies was killed they became dedicated to fighting and killing for their memory.

See: http://youtu.be/SiF_MpHcjd0?t=27m21s
 
The death of every human is a loss.

The senseless murder of war is not at all a good thing. Despite the obviously intense brainwashing you have been through.

:(

This^^
Matthew 6:26 said:
Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they?
 
Back
Top