Vaccinations and my daughter

[GunnyFreedom]

I'm sorry that you had a bad experience. It's rare, but it happens. While we are at it, we should ban cars of the street, outlaw sex and any other activity that has the potential of harm...

This is a non-sequitur. The gov't does not dictate by law that everyone have sex at 10 years old. The gov't does not mandate by fiat that we strap children of 10 into automobiles and set them loose on the freeway.

Furthermore, nobody seems to me to be saying that vaccines should be outlawed, just that they should not be forced into our children with us at the point of a gun. I dunno, but it that really too much to ask?

 

[yongrel]

This is a non-sequitur. The gov't does not dictate by law that everyone have sex at 10 years old. The gov't does not mandate by fiat that we strap children of 10 into automobiles and set them loose on the freeway.

Furthermore, nobody seems to me to be saying that vaccines should be outlawed, just that they should not be forced into our children with us at the point of a gun. I dunno, but it that really too much to ask?

I don't think anyone here is arguing for mandatory vaccines. I certainly am not.

I think that everyone should drink water, but I do not want the government to mandate hydration.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

Do you know how ridiculous this thread is... my word, breathtaking inanity.

Get your damn kids vaccinated you morons.

Poke yer kid with this needle and inject him with this stuff that could kill him, or we will execute you by firing squad and bill your family for the bullets?

 

[Kade]

This is a non-sequitur. The gov't does not dictate by law that everyone have sex at 10 years old. The gov't does not mandate by fiat that we strap children of 10 into automobiles and set them loose on the freeway.

Furthermore, nobody seems to me to be saying that vaccines should be outlawed, just that they should not be forced into our children with us at the point of a gun. I dunno, but it that really too much to ask?

It's a state law, and it remains a state law. Fight it at the local level if it upsets you.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

I don't think anyone here is arguing for mandatory vaccines. I certainly am not.

I think that everyone should drink water, but I do not want the government to mandate hydration.

Well, in a free society, there will be people who do things you don't like. Whether behaviors are 'mandated' by force of law or by social castigation, the end result is the same.

 

[Kade]

Poke yer kid with this needle and inject him with this stuff that could kill him, or we will execute you by firing squad and bill your family for the bullets?

I am against mandatory vaccinations outside of requirement for public education.

 

[yongrel]

Well, in a free society, there will be people who do things you don't like. Whether behaviors are 'mandated' by force of law or by social castigation, the end result is the same.

The end result may be the same, but the means are totally different. Being called stupid and irresponsible by a ton of people is not at all equivalent to the government mandating vaccinations.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

It's a state law, and it remains a state law. Fight it at the local level if it upsets you.

so are you saying that government abuses of liberty cannot occur at state level? Are you saying that if your state just up and banned atheism, that this is just a state thing and the federal gov't has no business intervening on your behalf?

 

[GunnyFreedom]

I am against mandatory vaccinations outside of requirement for public education.

And when public education is required lest the parents go to prison, then effectively that means "give your kid the needle or go to jail."

Some ' liberty ' position there, guy!

 

[yongrel]

And when public education is required lest the parents go to prison, then effectively that means "give your kid the needle or go to jail."

Some ' liberty ' position there, guy!

Not true. Homeschooling and private schools are an option.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

The end result may be the same, but the means are totally different. Being called stupid and irresponsible by a ton of people is not at all equivalent to the government mandating vaccinations.

so instead of restricting freedom through legislation and gov't guns, you would choose to restrict freedom through humiliation and castigation. In either case, liberty suffers. I fail to see how that is a good thing.

 

[yongrel]

so instead of restricting freedom through legislation and gov't guns, you would choose to restrict freedom through humiliation and castigation. In either case, liberty suffers. I fail to see how that is a good thing.

No, liberty does not suffer through ridicule. They are still free not to vaccinate their children. They are just called foolish for doing so. Their ability to refrain from vaccination remains intact.

 

[Kade]

And when public education is required lest the parents go to prison, then effectively that means "give your kid the needle or go to jail."

Some ' liberty ' position there, guy!

I don't recall private school and homeschooling being banned...

 

[Kade]

so instead of restricting freedom through legislation and gov't guns, you would choose to restrict freedom through humiliation and castigation. In either case, liberty suffers. I fail to see how that is a good thing.

Do you know what smallpox is?

Let me remind you:

You can choose not to vaccinate, I will continue to ridicule that decision because if everyone listens to you, like what is happening with the propaganda in Africa, people die in large numbers.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

Not true. Homeschooling and private schools are an option.

sure, private schools are an option, if you are wealthy. And homeschooling is in many places either outlawed (like California) or very heavily restricted (like throughout most of New England and the 'blue' states) to the point where it's nearly impossible for Joe and Jane Ordinary to do it themselves, unless the hire an accredited teacher -- again, wealth is required.

So it's ok to force poor people to stick their kids with something potentially deadly or face prison, so long as the rich have a way out?

 

[Kade]

sure, private schools are an option, if you are wealthy. And homeschooling is in many places either outlawed (like California) or very heavily restricted (like throughout most of New England and the 'blue' states) to the point where it's nearly impossible for Joe and Jane Ordinary to do it themselves, unless the hire an accredited teacher -- again, wealth is required.

So it's ok to force poor people to stick their kids with something potentially deadly or face prison, so long as the rich have a way out?

Bullshit.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

Not true. Homeschooling and private schools are an option.

Do you know what smallpox is?

Let me remind you:

You can choose not to vaccinate, I will continue to ridicule that decision because if everyone listens to you, like what is happening with the propaganda in Africa, people die in large numbers.

Ahhh yes, this 'freedom' thing is all well and good, until someone decides to be 'free' to do something you don't like. Fascinating.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

Bullshit.

Is that what you call the crap you keep posting?

 

[Kade]

Ahhh yes, this 'freedom' thing is all well and good, until someone decides to be 'free' to do something you don't like. Fascinating.

I said I was against mandatory vaccinations...

But this whole line of reasoning is eventually flawed, at some point the "true libertarian" approach fails...

I mean, seriously, are you really okay with person walking around with naked, with a case of smallpox and measles, carrying a bazooka in front of your kid's school?

 

[yongrel]

Ahhh yes, this 'freedom' thing is all well and good, until someone decides to be 'free' to do something you don't like. Fascinating.

No one's arguing that people shouldn't be free to be stupid. I just believe that I am also free to call them stupid.