US Navy murders Venezuelan citizens on the open seas

[unknown]

 

[jmdrake]

 

[acptulsa]

Libertarians in 1776:

Humans don't need machines to create hyperbole.

Yo, Tater. How was that boat going to reach American territory? Hmmm?

Those of us with brains have been asking since the incident was announced. Been ignoring this reality because you get more votes by being an idiot?

 

[Anti Federalist]

Yo, Tater. How was that boat going to reach American territory? Hmmm?

Those of us with brains have been asking since the incident was announced. Been ignoring this reality because you get more votes by being an idiot?

I'm guessing the vessel would have been fully equipped to make the trip in Trinidad which is where it was heading.

Very roughly it's 1600 miles from Trinidad to South Florida.

Assuming a steady 25 knot cruise, that's 64 hours, less than three days.

Again, making an assumption, let's say those four outboards were fairly modern, less than 20 years old, four stroke, 200 HP models, Mercury, Yamaha, Suzuki - they all burn roughly the same amount, 6-7 GPH at 3000-4000 RPM, which is more than enough to maintain that 25 knot cruise on a vessel that size. 7 x 4 = 28 total GPH

That's 28 GPH at the high end. 28 x 64 = 1792 gallons.

Round it up to 1800.

That vessel could easily hold that much fuel, along with drug cargo, again, making an assumption that it wasn't a bulky product like weed or something. And again, making an assumption that they did not have pre planned refueling vessels along the way to meet them.

I saw journeys like that, on vessels like that, done numerous times, during Bill Clinton's Haitian invasion in the 90s.

Not taking a stand one way or the other on the legal or moral justifications of this strike, frankly I've got more pressing outrages to worry about.

But whoever those guys were, they most certainly could have reached the US in that vessel, in a fairly short period of time, even when making assumptions about the routing and planning.

 

[acptulsa]

Round it up to 1800.

And then they pull up to the pumps in Miami or Key Largo and fill it up without attracting attention?

I'm rounding up to 3600 gallons. Which is this tank:

It's pretty easy to see into that open hull. Where's that tank?

 

[jmdrake]

I'm guessing the vessel would have been fully equipped to make the trip in Trinidad which is where it was heading.

Very roughly it's 1600 miles from Trinidad to South Florida.

Assuming a steady 25 knot cruise, that's 64 hours, less than three days.

Again, making an assumption, let's say those four outboards were fairly modern, less than 20 years old, four stroke, 200 HP models, Mercury, Yamaha, Suzuki - they all burn roughly the same amount, 6-7 GPH at 3000-4000 RPM, which is more than enough to maintain that 25 knot cruise on a vessel that size. 7 x 4 = 28 total GPH

That's 28 GPH at the high end. 28 x 64 = 1792 gallons.

Round it up to 1800.

That vessel could easily hold that much fuel, along with drug cargo, again, making an assumption that it wasn't a bulky product like weed or something. And again, making an assumption that they did not have pre planned refueling vessels along the way to meet them.

I saw journeys like that, on vessels like that, done numerous times, during Bill Clinton's Haitian invasion in the 90s.

Not taking a stand one way or the other on the legal or moral justifications of this strike, frankly I've got more pressing outrages to worry about.

But whoever those guys were, they most certainly could have reached the US in that vessel, in a fairly short period of time, even when making assumptions about the routing and planning.

Thanks for the analysis. My biggest question is "Why blow the ship out of the water instead of boarding it and seizing evidence and crew members to question?" I wonder if we're headed to a Panama style invasion or if this is merely a blockade?

 

[acptulsa]

Last gasp of the Petrodollar?

While Trump's Excuseniks cling to The Fentanyl Theory, Col. Magregor more wisely asks, why open a third front in the Oil and Gas War? Strategically it's ridiculous. And he comes up with logical answers, which naturally point back at the Federal Reserve.

 

[Anti Federalist]

And then they pull up to the pumps in Miami or Key Largo and fill it up without attracting attention?

I'm rounding up to 3600 gallons. Which is this tank:

It's pretty easy to see into that open hull. Where's that tank?

I imagine not installed yet.

Like I said, the vessel, from everything I've read, was on it's way to Trinidad.

Fuel most likely would be in bladder tanks like these:

Marine Fuel Bladder 300 Gallon Space Saver - Ready Containment

Product Specifications: Capacity: 300 Gallons Material: Industrial-grade, puncture-resistant fabric Dimensions: 68″ x 68″ x 15″ Weight: [insert weight] Includes: 1 each 2” Grey Stand Pipe for Fill/Vent; 1 each 3/4″ Right Angle Ball Valve for Discharge

readycontainment.com

I've ferried vessels with three 1500 gallons bladder tanks stowed in the cockpit, engine room and salon deck.

That said, they could do like the Haitians did and stow as many 55 gallon plastic drums of fuel they would need.

And again, that's assuming they did not have vessels to meet them along the route with fuel. I've seen that before.

If the cargo was drugs, most likely they would transfer the cargo offshore to a go-fast boat with somebody onboard with local knowledge, and legitimate US paperwork, the smugglers would also get on board and they would scuttle the fishing skiff they came over on.

I've salvaged the wrecks of these vessels 100 times, if I have done it once.

And making that last 100-200 mile leg, that's what these were designed to do in the first place:

And before that, these made that last short leg with booze:

 

[Anti Federalist]

Thanks for the analysis. My biggest question is "Why blow the ship out of the water instead of boarding it and seizing evidence and crew members to question?" I wonder if we're headed to a Panama style invasion or if this is merely a blockade?

Your guess is as good as mine.

The only thing that makes surface sense is "show of force".

 

[TheTexan]

If I have a ton of missiles lying around I'm gonna find an excuse to use them shrug

Boat goes boom

 

[acptulsa]

I've ferried vessels with three 1500 gallons bladder tanks stowed in the cockpit, engine room and salon deck.

That said, they could do like the Haitians did and stow as many 55 gallon plastic drums of fuel they would need.

Any of these things invisible? Anyplace on that boat to hide such? We couldn't intercept in out own waters?

You're reaching in order to make Trumpscuses. This is the last stand of the Petrodollar, and it's ridiculous for anyone educated enough to frequent this forum to think it's about Fentanyl.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Any of these things invisible? Anyplace on that boat to hide such? We couldn't intercept in out own waters?

You're reaching in order to make Trumpscuses. This is the last stand of the Petrodollar, and it's ridiculous for anyone educated enough to frequent this forum to think it's about Fentanyl.

No, I am not, and I clearly stated that in my first reply in this thread.

I am merely saying, based on my own 40+ years of personal experience as both a licensed Salvage Master and Vessel Master, that has spent years in this area of the world and dealt with maritime human and drug smuggling on a first hand basis, that a voyage from Trinidad to Florida is both well within the realm of reality for such a vessel, and has been done before, and is done now, on a regular basis.

Why this particular vessel was smoked right here, right now, is entirely up for speculation, and I'm not going to argue those points because I don't know and frankly don't care that much.

Your explanation of the "why" makes as much sense as anybody else's, so maybe you're right.

 

[Occam's Banana]

Thanks for the analysis. My biggest question is "Why blow the ship out of the water instead of boarding it and seizing evidence and crew members to question?" I wonder if we're headed to a Panama style invasion or if this is merely a blockade?

Why this particular vessel was smoked right here, right now, is entirely up for speculation, and I'm not going to argue those points because I don't know and frankly don't care that much.

Your explanation of the "why" makes as much sense as anybody else's, so maybe you're right.

As my default position, I just assume the US government is lying about whatever it's publicly stated motives and/or justifications are. This approach probably has a lower "false positive" rate than taking them at their word. (At present, I suspect "narco-terrorism" might well be a deliberate misspelling of "oil", and this "show of force" flex is only ostensibly aimed at Carlos the Venezuelan Dope Runner.)

In any case, a lot of the favorable reaction to this incident is rather amusing. Going by some of the orgasmic reactions I've seen, you'd think we'd just won the greatest naval engagement since the Battle of Midway.

 

[TheTexan]

Maybe just preparing us for a bit more conflict in South America

We've kinda been neglecting that continent as far as drone strikes go

They deserve our freedom and democracy as much as any other

 

[TheTexan]

By the way, McD's gold sauce is really good you should try it

 

[Occam's Banana]

https://x.com/jeremykauffman/status/1964777469648781409

 

[Occam's Banana]

 

[Brian4Liberty]

 

[nikcers]

Apparently if you want to reduce cigarette deaths the best way to do it is to get people off cocaine.

This is because virtually every person who does cocaine or smokes crack smokes cigarettes because the cocaine makes cigarettes more addictive and harder to quit and it makes cocaine more addictive and harder to quit when you smoke cigarettes.

 

[Anti Federalist]

The number of deaths per year in the US among cigarette smokers is 440,000

Apropos of nothing that this thread is really about, but that figure is utter horseshit.

I've been hearing that number thrown out for years now, even as the number of smokers has drastically decreased.

The same way they monkeyed around with drunk driving deaths and COVID 19 deaths is how they arrived at that number, usually how it works is anybody that has ever reported on any health form that they smoked at any time in their lives, when they die, even if they die in a car crash or house fire, their death is chalked up as a "smoking related fatality".