U.S. using food crisis to boost (GMO) bio-engineered crops

[amy31416]

I found an interesting article written in 2002 here: http://www.law.mq.edu.au/html/MqLJ/vol2pdf/volume2-1.pdf

If you look at pages 12 and 13 you will find a bit of information about the terminator problem.

It is becoming a decision of if there is a right to save seed. Some claim farmers have no right to be able to save seed and should have to buy all of the seed they need.

I can see this all getting out of hand in a hurry.

Great find, thanks for sharing. I wish I could quote from it. I'm rarely in favor of new laws, but terminator technology should be outlawed for the danger it presents. Apparently it does cross-pollinate, which is a very bad thing for the farmers. I read pages 10-14 and there's enough info there to make anyone uncomfortable with the direction this is going.

Then, moving on to the legal issues--farmers not allowed to save seeds? What the hell are these people thinking? This is a drastic change to traditional farming and allows the farmer no control of the quality or properties of the food he grows.

Any company or organization that supports terminator technology should be absolutely shunned and exposed.

If you find any other articles, I'd love to read more.

 

[Dr.3D]

Evidence found for corn cross pollination with the terminator gene.

I have found some evidence of corn being cross pollinated with the terminator gene.
In the last paragraph of page 13 in this article: http://www.centerforinquiry.net/uploads/attachments/genetic-engineering-ethics_2.pdf

And is was a Monsanto patent that was at fault.

 

[amy31416]

I have found some evidence of corn being cross pollinated with the terminator gene.
In the last paragraph of page 13 in this article: http://www.centerforinquiry.net/uploads/attachments/genetic-engineering-ethics_2.pdf

And is was a Monsanto patent that was at fault.

Hmmph...not sure if the format is different but page 13, last paragraph is discussing GE farm animals being more resistant to disease and thus not needing megadoses of antibiotics.

**oops, nevermind** I see it.

The farmers should be allowed to sue the shit out of Monsanto for any contamination. I've read that Monsanto has pulled the opposite stunt--suing the farmers who have evidence of their patented terminator crop, even if they didn't plant it.

The good news on page 14 is that the contamination "appears" to be limited to the first generation though.

 

[Dr.3D]

Hmmph...not sure if the format is different but page 13, last paragraph is discussing GE farm animals being more resistant to disease and thus not needing megadoses of antibiotics.

**oops, nevermind** I see it.

The farmers should be allowed to sue the shit out of Monsanto for any contamination. I've read that Monsanto has pulled the opposite stunt--suing the farmers who have evidence of their patented terminator crop, even if they didn't plant it.

The good news on page 14 is that the contamination "appears" to be limited to the first generation though.

I have to wonder how long those farmers can keep going if people around them are using the terminator crop. Seems like they would be running out of their seed pretty soon. Once they have lost the seed they have been working with for so many years, they will have nothing left but to buy from the seed manufacturers who make seeds that are nowhere as nice as the ones they had been using all their lives and generations of farmers before them.

All of the work that went into breeding up a strain of great tasting corn generation after generation will have been lost.

Looks like the only ones to win in this one are the makers of the modified product. All of the 'natural' seed will be gone after a short time if they keep getting their seed production killed by the crops being planted around them.

 

[amy31416]

I have to wonder how long those farmers can keep going if people around them are using the terminator crop. Seems like they would be running out of their seed pretty soon. Once they have lost the seed they have been working with for so many years, they will have nothing left but to buy from the seed manufacturers who make seeds that are nowhere as nice as the ones they had been using all their lives and generations of farmers before them.

All of the work that went into breeding up a strain of great tasting corn generation after generation will have been lost.

Looks like the only ones to win in this one are the makers of the modified product. All of the 'natural' seed will be gone after a short time if they keep getting their seed production killed by the crops being planted around them.

I would support an organization of farmers who oppose it and are organizing to sue Monsanto and any other company who cross-contaminates the terminator technology onto any other crops. I wonder if that exists yet?

 

[Dr.3D]

I would support an organization of farmers who oppose it and are organizing to sue Monsanto and any other company who cross-contaminates the terminator technology onto any other crops. I wonder if that exists yet?

I tend to believe those farmers are so poor from losing their crops they can hardly stay afloat. I don't know how they could even attempt to fight a huge corporation like Monsanto.

 

[amy31416]

I tend to believe those farmers are so poor from losing their crops they can hardly stay afloat. I don't know how they could even attempt to fight a huge corporation like Monsanto.

Any better suggestions? I wasn't necessarily thinking that poor farmers would fund it, but that there are so many people who hate Monsanto that their legal team would be funded by donations. Hell, you'd probably even be able to find some liberal leaning, big corporation hating lawyers to do it gratis.

 

[Dr.3D]

Any better suggestions? I wasn't necessarily thinking that poor farmers would fund it, but that there are so many people who hate Monsanto that their legal team would be funded by donations. Hell, you'd probably even be able to find some liberal leaning, big corporation hating lawyers to do it gratis.

I don't have any better suggestion.... I hope somebody is trying to do something about the situation.

The good news on page 14 is that the contamination "appears" to be limited to the first generation though.

Sometimes it only takes one generation of not being able to reproduce for extinction to take place. Notice I didn't say it always takes only one generation.

Seems Monsanto could modify the marijuana plant so it had the terminator gene and that would put an end to the war on pot. (oops... maybe I said something I shouldn't have said.)

I don't know how long farmers can keep seed or if they even kept enough seed to replant again. It may be they have already lost the ability to grow the particular strain of corn they had been growing.

I've been reading about how this has been happening in places like India and Africa. Those people are already having a hard time supporting the population they have. Now with our wonderful export of GM seeds to their country, it shouldn't be long before they won't be able to support the food needs of their country. It seems as if all of this is part of a plan to get them dependent on GM seeds and perhaps cause mass starvation in the process.

 

[amy31416]

Sometimes it only takes one generation of not being able to reproduce for extinction to take place. Notice I didn't say it always takes only one generation.

Wait, you wrote that?

Seems Monsanto could modify the marijuana plant so it had the terminator gene and that would put an end to the war on pot. (oops... maybe I said something I shouldn't have said.)

Yeah, they don't need any more ideas.

I don't know how long farmers can keep seed or if they even kept enough seed to replant again. It may be they have already lost the ability to grow the particular strain of corn they had been growing.

I've been reading about how this has been happening in places like India and Africa. Those people are already having a hard time supporting the population they have. Now with our wonderful export of GM seeds to their country, it shouldn't be long before they won't be able to support the food needs of their country. It seems as if all of this is part of a plan to get them dependent on GM seeds and perhaps cause mass starvation in the process.

I think this is where we part ways on our opinions. While I agree that it's a way to get people dependent on their product, I highly doubt that causing mass starvation is part of their plan. The whole point of using these GM seeds in Africa and parts of India was because the environment was not suitable to grow crops in the first place and GM seeds have allowed that. GM seeds with terminator properties is just cruel though, in my opinion. Especially in those countries.

 

[thuja]

there are not only terminator seeds, but now there are traitor seeds. those are nasty too.

i keep posting these, and you should read them.
www.nongmoproject.org www.non-gmoreport.com also www.gmwatch.eu, which was hacked, and may not be back to full operation yet. get their very educational emails and you will learn a lot.
the only way to feed people is by growing organic, which outproduces gmos and conventional, provides more nutrients and better taste,and does not kill people, animals and wildlife, and which uses natural predators like bats and birds to kill pests. the gmos and chemicals are killing everything.
gmos and nanos are very very dangerous.

 

[Dr.3D]

I think this is where we part ways on our opinions. While I agree that it's a way to get people dependent on their product, I highly doubt that causing mass starvation is part of their plan. The whole point of using these GM seeds in Africa and parts of India was because the environment was not suitable to grow crops in the first place and GM seeds have allowed that. GM seeds with terminator properties is just cruel though, in my opinion. Especially in those countries.

So we must part ways as to opinion because I suggested motives are not always as they seem? History is replete with such examples. Just look at how Spain sent missionaries to Mexico under the guise of 'spreading the Christian way' only to see how they used it to gain control of the people in that country.

I tend to look at the money. When I see money to be made, and somebody claiming to be doing something out of the goodness of their heart for another people, I tend to look at the money as the motive and not goodness of any heart. It usually all boils down to money. While it may not be part of the plan to starve people, the starvation may in fact be a byproduct of their plan to make some money and gain control. Notice how I said perhaps when I mentioned starvation. I did not imply the motive was starvation, but instead the plan may cause it regardless of intent.

 

[Ninja Homer]

The farmers should be allowed to sue the shit out of Monsanto for any contamination. I've read that Monsanto has pulled the opposite stunt--suing the farmers who have evidence of their patented terminator crop, even if they didn't plant it.

That's just it... It takes a lot for a farm to be Certified Organic, and all it takes is for a little GMO seed to blow into their crops, and they lose their certification. If they try to sue Monsanto for contaminating their crops, then Monsanto turns around and sues them for patent infringement. Monsanto usually wins, because they have the money to pay for good lawyers and can just outlast almost any farmer in an expensive court battle.

This brings up some SERIOUS issues about patents on life. Should life be patentable? Should patents on life have the same laws as other patents? If they just have a patent on 1 gene, does that mean they own the rights to the whole plant? Patent rights on life carry huge responsibilities... what needs to be done to make sure people with these patents are being responsible?

Here's a farmer who was successful against Monsanto in court:
http://www.percyschmeiser.com/

An article about a lawsuit by Canadian organic farmers against Monsanto:
http://www.mindfully.org/GE/GE4/Monsanto-Sued-By-Farmers11jan02.htm

 

[amy31416]

That's just it... It takes a lot for a farm to be Certified Organic, and all it takes is for a little GMO seed to blow into their crops, and they lose their certification. If they try to sue Monsanto for contaminating their crops, then Monsanto turns around and sues them for patent infringement. Monsanto usually wins, because they have the money to pay for good lawyers and can just outlast almost any farmer in an expensive court battle.

This brings up some SERIOUS issues about patents on life. Should life be patentable? Should patents on life have the same laws as other patents? If they just have a patent on 1 gene, does that mean they own the rights to the whole plant? Patent rights on life carry huge responsibilities... what needs to be done to make sure people with these patents are being responsible?

Here's a farmer who was successful against Monsanto in court:
http://www.percyschmeiser.com/

An article about a lawsuit by Canadian organic farmers against Monsanto:
http://www.mindfully.org/GE/GE4/Monsanto-Sued-By-Farmers11jan02.htm

That's why these small-time farmers, even those who haven't had it happen to them (yet) need to band together against companies like Monsanto. They'll have a lot of support from the general public if they publicize first. This, first and foremost needs to be publicized to the mainstream.

Maybe a group like anonymous might consider a hiatus from Scientology for a new target such as Monsanto, that would be a start to get the information out.

 

[torchbearer]

That's why these small-time farmers, even those who haven't had it happen to them (yet) need to band together against companies like Monsanto. They'll have a lot of support from the general public if they publicize first. This, first and foremost needs to be publicized to the mainstream.

Maybe a group like anonymous might consider a hiatus from Scientology for a new target such as Monsanto, that would be a start to get the information out.

The small farmer is dead in Louisiana.
Corporate farms recieved all the gov. subsidies during the drought.
Like Trent Lott, who doesn't even farm.

We don't farm anymore, haven't for about 10 years.
What is going to happen to america when all of their small farmers are gone?
Government intervention destroyed farming in this state, and sometimes i think its purposeful.

 

[amy31416]

The small farmer is dead in Louisiana.
Corporate farms recieved all the gov. subsidies during the drought.
Like Trent Lott, who doesn't even farm.

We don't farm anymore, haven't for about 10 years.
What is going to happen to america when all of their small farmers are gone?
Government intervention destroyed farming in this state, and sometimes i think its purposeful.

All the more reason to do something about this. I'm not schooled in the ways of farming, the laws, etc., but we all have a stake in the food supply.

 

[sidster]

The small farmer is dead in Louisiana.
Corporate farms recieved all the gov. subsidies during the drought.
Like Trent Lott, who doesn't even farm.

We don't farm anymore, haven't for about 10 years.
What is going to happen to america when all of their small farmers are gone?
Government intervention destroyed farming in this state, and sometimes i think its purposeful.

That's just sad to read.

All the more reason to do something about this. I'm not schooled in the ways of farming, the laws, etc., but we all have a stake in the food supply.

I agree. What do we do? How do we start? Is The Revolution the way?
..or at least a good starting point? How long would it take us to revert all
the damage that has been done over the past century or more?

 

[amy31416]

I agree. What do we do? How do we start? Is The Revolution the way?
..or at least a good starting point? How long would it take us to revert all
the damage that has been done over the past century or more?

Not entirely sure, but I think that we would start here, and perhaps start raising awareness via YouTube etc. First things first, it'd be good to see if there's actually a farming union/committee/group that already exists who's concerned about this. There are plenty of people who are already aware of and against Monsanto.

Just have to reiterate though, I'm okay with many of the GM foods out there being used for good purposes. I'm against Monsanto given their business strategies, dishonesty and strong-armed tactics. I'm 100% against terminator technology, and it appears that Monsanto is the sole owner of that.

Also, push forward the "think globally, act locally" thing. Support local organic farmers who are doing the right thing. Join the local co-op, things like that.

 

[thuja]

Not entirely sure, but I think that we would start here, and perhaps start raising awareness via YouTube etc. First things first, it'd be good to see if there's actually a farming union/committee/group that already exists who's concerned about this. There are plenty of people who are already aware of and against Monsanto.

Just have to reiterate though, I'm okay with many of the GM foods out there being used for good purposes. I'm against Monsanto given their business strategies, dishonesty and strong-armed tactics. I'm 100% against terminator technology, and it appears that Monsanto is the sole owner of that.

Also, push forward the "think globally, act locally" thing. Support local organic farmers who are doing the right thing. Join the local co-op, things like that.

its great that you support organics.
organic crops are polyculture, and that is in tune with nature.the monoculture crops are not natural, and for one thing, do not support natural predators for pests, so that allows chemical pesticides to be used. those chemicals kill natural predators and the bees.
consider the dangers in nano technology as well, as it ties in, and can be used in pesticides. take a look at www.foe.org and its australian site, and look at www.etcgroup.org for more on the dangers of nanos.

if people wish to support organic, first buy it and only it, and that way more land will be devoted to it. there are organic groups to support, like marinorganic.org, for example. they can tell you which other things to support. buy at markets too.
the farmers do need our support in fending off the corporations who wish to control the food supply and more.
as i poste earlier, there are ways to detect gmos, and supporting such organizations is useful. www.nongmoproject.org

 

[SeanEdwards]

The story of golden rice sums up the enviro-nuts pretty well:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_rice

This engineered strain of rice could have saved millions of lives and prevented hundreds of thousands of cases of blindness caused by vitamin A deficiency every year. The developers of the rice voluntarily agreed to forgo their intellectual property rights in order to make the rice available to impoverished people as a humanitarian gesture.

But it never happened, because the anti-GM luddites had a coniption fit. These assholes are blocking use of a food that could improve millions of lives, because of some nebulous, undefined fear of "franken-foods". They don't have any scientific evidence to support their fear of golden rice, but they're willing to condemn millions of third world children to preventable blindness regardless.

 

[thuja]

The story of golden rice sums up the enviro-nuts pretty well:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_rice

This engineered strain of rice could have saved millions of lives and prevented hundreds of thousands of cases of blindness caused by vitamin A deficiency every year. The developers of the rice voluntarily agreed to forgo their intellectual property rights in order to make the rice available to impoverished people as a humanitarian gesture.

But it never happened, because the anti-GM luddites had a coniption fit. These assholes are blocking use of a food that could improve millions of lives, because of some nebulous, undefined fear of "franken-foods". They don't have any scientific evidence to support their fear of golden rice, but they're willing to condemn millions of third world children to preventable blindness regardless.

there seems little hope that some people will ever do any proper research, wishing to remain forever misinformed.
i wonder if some scientists, once they learn the truth about their discoveries results, ever just jump off a bridge or something.