Turkey Shoots Down Russian Military Plane Near Syrian Border

Provisions don't matter when you've been vaporized.

I've prepped for hurricanes and unemployment, not nuclear war!

Point taken.

However, consider this possibility: Theye are attempting to scare us all so sheet-white shitless that we will accede to any demand they make upon us. "Look how close we came to nuclear annihilation. If your freedom really worth that?" Scare people enough... maybe even with one or two detonations and I guarantee there will be sufficient plurality in the USA and Europe to put an end to anything resembling individual freedom. Overnight.

Get the troops soiling their camos in sufficiency along with the civilians and any order Bammy gives will be enforced such that the likes of us would be eradicated from the earth with the first hint of questioning the wisdom of the great black hope (and change).

I am not saying that there is definitely this grand a conspiracy afoot, but if you think about it, it would be the easiest thing to pull off. Troops go and do as you are told. If the global oligopolists are secretly colluding and snickering behind closed doors, how would we ever know? This whole tension deal could be nothing but smoke and mirrors. So all the Big Players agree we will have a vignette that appears as if nuclear war has broken out or is imminent. Troops do as they are told, regardless of reasons, so when they are ordered to shoot at these guys over here, that is what they do. Tell them to stop; they stop. So the big boys agree they will fight here, then there, then over there and that it will matter no whit who wins what because it is all a farce. Then the large detonation... probably in the USA since we are the people who need to be brought to heel the most, and it will be all over. Globally. The world will fold like a cheap suit, welcome the world government in exchange for their basic human rights and that will be that. It would be relatively easy to do. The only obstacle is the cooperation of all the major players. If they are not on the same globalist team, then my speculation is hot air. But if they are as one beneath all appearances, the imagination reels at the possibilities, given the high-tech killing machines our armed forces have become.

Indeed we live in interesting times.
 
Point taken.

However, consider this possibility: Theye are attempting to scare us all so sheet-white shitless that we will accede to any demand they make upon us. "Look how close we came to nuclear annihilation. If your freedom really worth that?" Scare people enough... maybe even with one or two detonations and I guarantee there will be sufficient plurality in the USA and Europe to put an end to anything resembling individual freedom. Overnight.

Get the troops soiling their camos in sufficiency along with the civilians and any order Bammy gives will be enforced such that the likes of us would be eradicated from the earth with the first hint of questioning the wisdom of the great black hope (and change).

I am not saying that there is definitely this grand a conspiracy afoot, but if you think about it, it would be the easiest thing to pull off. Troops go and do as you are told. If the global oligopolists are secretly colluding and snickering behind closed doors, how would we ever know? This whole tension deal could be nothing but smoke and mirrors. So all the Big Players agree we will have a vignette that appears as if nuclear war has broken out or is imminent. Troops do as they are told, regardless of reasons, so when they are ordered to shoot at these guys over here, that is what they do. Tell them to stop; they stop. So the big boys agree they will fight here, then there, then over there and that it will matter no whit who wins what because it is all a farce. Then the large detonation... probably in the USA since we are the people who need to be brought to heel the most, and it will be all over. Globally. The world will fold like a cheap suit, welcome the world government in exchange for their basic human rights and that will be that. It would be relatively easy to do. The only obstacle is the cooperation of all the major players. If they are not on the same globalist team, then my speculation is hot air. But if they are as one beneath all appearances, the imagination reels at the possibilities, given the high-tech killing machines our armed forces have become.

Indeed we live in interesting times.

I also consider this a possibility.

There's a meme going around calling people "Putinphiles". But as one RT commenter said, it's natural to trust someone who lies to you some of the time as opposed to someone who lies to you all of the time.

Perhaps we are seeing theater related to the final stages of the formation of world government via the ruse of polarization. The Watchmen plot. Many things are suspicious. Turkey acting irrationally in public view being a big one. Russia deploying their carrier killer to the mediterranean just when US and French carriers expected to arrive also curious.

All the while the signals from all sides is "we aren't communicating" as if there is a genuine interest from all parties that we just need some kind of Ghandian enlightement.

All very suspicious. And as you say, it's Americans that need to be brought to heel the most. All the research I've done over the years makes it hard for me to simply swallow that the global chess game has simply gotten out of control. It's like everyone is reading from a script. "We stand by Turkey." "We must defend attacks against Russian citizens." "France is at war."

So many bold statements but hardly any real reflection and little urgency it seems to take real action anywhere except the media. You would think the UN would be in permanent session with how bad the conflagration that is going on. Martial law in France, Belgium, and now Tunisia.

Definitely time to pay attention. It seems every week there's an incident that a country "can't ignore."
 
Obama points finger at Russia over jet shoot-down by Turkey

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...-at-russia-over-jet-shoot-down-by-turkey.html

President Obama pointed the finger at Russia over its warplane being shot down by Turkey, suggesting the incident might not have happened if Moscow were more concerned with hitting ISIS targets than moderate opposition to Syria’s Bashar Assad – a campaign that puts them dangerously close to the Turkish border.

The president, speaking Tuesday alongside visiting French President Francois Hollande in Washington, stressed that officials are still gathering details on the international incident.

He and Hollande both said they want to prevent an “escalation,” as Obama urged the Russians and Turks to talk to one another.

But Obama also suggested the nature of Russia’s air campaign is contributing to such confrontations.

“I do think that this points to an ongoing problem with the Russian operations,” Obama said. “In the sense that they are operating very close to a Turkish border, and they are going after moderate opposition that are supported by not only Turkey but a wide range of countries.”

He said that if Russia directed its efforts toward the Islamic State, “some of those conflicts, or potentials for mistakes or escalation, are less likely to occur.”

Obama also said Turkey “has a right to defend its territory and its airspace.”

The French president arrived in Washington 11 days after the Paris terror attacks. Part of the purpose of the trip was to urge Obama to work with Russia to build a new coalition to fight the extremists.

Obama said Tuesday he would like to have Russia’s cooperation in the fight against ISIS.

“Them cooperating would be enormously helpful,” Obama said.

But Obama said the challenge right now is Russia’s focus on “propping up Assad” rather than going after ISIS. He called Iran and Russia a “coalition of two” supporting Assad.

The Turkey-Russia incident complicated Hollande’s visit, and his effort to build a broader coalition.

Russian President Vladimir Putin said earlier that Turkey’s decision to shoot down a Russian warplane near Turkey's border with Syria is a "stab in the back" and would have “significant consequences” for its relations with Turkey.

Even before the incident, Hollande faced a tough challenge in getting Obama to agree to a partnership with Moscow. The U.S. is deeply skeptical of Putin's motivations, given his long-standing support for Assad.

The U.S. appeared to be keeping its distance from the overall disagreement. Col. Steve Warren, a spokesman for the U.S.-led coalition, said the jet downing is an "incident between the Russian and Turkish governments."

As for the incident, he said: “We were able to hear everything that was going on. Obviously, you know, these are on open channels. I'm sure there's others who heard it all as well.”

At the press conference, Obama also defended his controversial plan to admit thousands of Syrian refugees into the U.S. The president cited France’s plans to admit 30,000 refugees and suggested the U.S. stay on course to admit thousands as well.

“There have been times in our history, in moments of fear, when we have failed to uphold our highest ideals, and it has been to our lasting regret,” Obama said. “We must uphold our ideals now.”

Obama defended the plan to bring in 10,000 Syrian refugees through next year a week after the House, with support from dozens of Democrats, voted to significantly tighten screening for Syrian and Iraqi refugees amid security concerns. The Senate has not yet voted on the measure.

But Obama defended the current vetting process, saying: “Nobody who sets foot in America goes through more screening than refugees.”

Meanwhile, Obama vowed to be vigilant while urging Americans not to change how they live their lives, in the wake of the Paris terror attacks. “Americans will not be terrorized,” he said.

He also said the U.S. and France “stand united” and said ISIS “cannot be tolerated” and “must be destroyed.”

Given the rash of attacks, Obama is now facing increased pressure at home and abroad to ramp up U.S. efforts to destroy the militants. So far, Obama is resisting calls to either change or significantly escalate his approach, and instead is focused on getting other countries to offer more counterintelligence, humanitarian and military assistance.

The U.S. campaign has centered largely on launching airstrikes, while training and assisting security forces on the ground in Iraq. Efforts to train and equip moderate rebel groups in Syria have struggled, and Obama has authorized the deployment of 50 special operations forces to the country to jumpstart the program.

France has stepped up its airstrikes following the Paris attacks, relying in part on U.S. intelligence to hit targets in Raqqa, the Islamic State group's stronghold in Syria.

Last week, Hollande called for the U.S. and Russia to set aside their policy divisions over Syria and "fight this terrorist army in a broad, single coalition." But his office acknowledges that "coordination" sounds like a far more realistic goal.

From Washington, Hollande will travel to Moscow for meetings with Putin.

While Russia is backing a new diplomatic effort in Syria, Moscow still refuses to support steps that explicitly call for removing Assad from power.

Russia has being targeting ISIS more then the west.

Its clear NeoCons are running the white house and Obama is just a pawn.
 
All the air space violations (non war) I know have always ended up in said violator being intercepted and guided away from the country. So did these barbarians not do that? these people must be having a serious butt hurt because Russia is going serious dmg to their proxy army ISIS.
 
All the air space violations (non war) I know have always ended up in said violator being intercepted and guided away from the country. So did these barbarians not do that? these people must be having a serious butt hurt because Russia is going serious dmg to their proxy army ISIS.

Speaking of air-space violations, a Turkish jet was shot down over Syria on June 22, 2012 a full 10 miles from Turkish border a mile from Syrian coastline. Syria apologized for the incident even though the aircraft was unidentified and protocol in that case was certainly more justifiable than Turkish behavior this early morning.

Double standards. If you'd like to see the relative position, google "Om Al-Toyour". That's the closest city where the shot down Turkish jet crashed.

Syria Shoots Down Turkish Warplane, Fraying Ties Further
June 22, 2012
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/23/w...-in-syria-apparently-a-rebel-ambush.html?_r=0

Maybe this is payback?
 
All the air space violations (non war) I know have always ended up in said violator being intercepted and guided away from the country. So did these barbarians not do that? these people must be having a serious butt hurt because Russia is going serious dmg to their proxy army ISIS.

Could be that.

Could be theater.

Right now, 2 + 2 <> 4 and one needs wonder why.

Something here has the stink on it and the possibilities are truly frightful.

Oh, and once again I will ID Detroit as the perfect target for a nuclear detonation. In the minds of many Americans it's... well... DETROIT. Never mind the state of decay, it is a huge metropolis, home of the US automobile industry. Yet, if it went up in smoke, the loss would be minimal in real terms in the eyes of one taking a very clinical view of such an event with an eye toward a winning strategy for achieving voluntary global dominance. Vaporizing Detroit would absolutely freak everyone out in a very big way, and yet the material loss would be tiny in comparison with lighting one off in any other US city of comparable size. It's the best of all worlds for anyone with this sort of scheming on their mind.

The more I think of this, the more plausible it becomes. Well, I guess there'll be no sleep in this house tonight.
 
All the air space violations (non war) I know have always ended up in said violator being intercepted and guided away from the country. So did these barbarians not do that? these people must be having a serious butt hurt because Russia is going serious dmg to their proxy army ISIS.

Turkey had protested such violations peacefully many times in the past. On this occasion, they made ten requests over five minutes for the plane to leave their airspace. It continued on and was shot down.
 
Turkey had protested such violations peacefully many times in the past. On this occasion, they made ten requests over five minutes for the plane to leave their airspace. It continued on and was shot down.

So says....Turkey. The pilot is on paid leave, but after investigating itself, Turkey has declared that policy was followed.
 
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Turkey had protested such violations peacefully many times in the past. On this occasion, they made ten requests over five minutes for the plane to leave their airspace. It continued on and was shot down.

Lol.
 
Turkey had protested such violations peacefully many times in the past. On this occasion, they made ten requests over five minutes for the plane to leave their airspace. It continued on and was shot down.

Really, Zippy?

Erdogan 2012 concerning Syrian shootdown of Turkish plane.

"A short-term border violation can never be a pretext for an attack," he told Parliament at the time.

Erdogan 2015 concerning Turkish shootdown of Russian plane.

"We did not want this situation to happen, but everybody has to respect Turkey’s right to defend its borders," he told reporters, adding that the military’s actions were "fully in line with Turkey’s rules of engagement."

http://sputniknews.com/military/20151125/1030698044/erdogan-airspace-violation-contradiction.html


Age of lawlessness.
 
Turkey had protested such violations peacefully many times in the past. On this occasion, they made ten requests over five minutes for the plane to leave their airspace. It continued on and was shot down.

Then why did they send this memo to the U.N. saying that Russia violated Turkey territory for just "17 seconds?" So what you are saying oh Zippypoo is that Russia flew across the border for 17 seconds? And that is justified?

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Leaked Ankara UN letter claims Su-24's ‘air space violation’ lasted 17 seconds
 
Then why did they send this memo to the U.N. saying that Russia violated Turkey territory for just "17 seconds?" So what you are saying oh Zippypoo is that Russia flew across the border for 17 seconds? And that is justified?

Well, Erdogan said in 2012 "short term violation not justification for attack".

Therefore, "short term" must be less than 17 seconds.
 
For the record, Turkey violates Greek airspace all the time.
 
Russian SU-24s came around in two passes is how one storyline goes
they were warned while back in Syria but they came back around again from east to west for their bombing run along border
and 17 secs after that second time across Turk airspace got taken out by two F-16s . . . or so one story goes anyway.
 
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