Total RP Pres. Texas votes 69,824 vs RP district14 Total votes 54,111

So Hyoomen claims he is being logical, he claims he is only here to offer alternatives, yet he uses as an example the only other congressman in all of congress that the elite establishment absolutely despise as evidence that there is nothing wrong with these election numbers.

While we are trying to open up eyes to the obvious anomalies and abnormalities of the voting numbers, you do the exact opposite by propping up the same establishment numbers of one of the only friends of Ron Paul's, who many times actually votes with Ron Paul. Do you not see your own fallacy here? It becomes very circular after that. You have tried your best to shape perception, to cultivate doubt on these forums, to dismiss any and all allegations with alternatives yet you fail because these questions will persist, they will linger. There is such a thing as "blowback", its very real. It happened when Peden tried to release polling numbers placing him ahead by 10 points, but that didn't really work too well. In any event keep on trying, you are doing a bang up job for your masters, just let it be know they own you.

So, here it is hyoomen, Show me a rally with Mccain pulling at least 1000 people from the street. A street rally. I want to see a youtube or pictures of him with adoring crowds. Not a staged event from a University. I want to see a street rally for John Mccan with all his fans.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/bryanmartin/2287818536/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bryanmartin/2287819144/in/set-72157603970964652/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bryanmartin/2287817532/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bryanmartin/2287032469/in/photostream/


Let's actually up the ante. Show me a rally like that in Texas. This was in Austin. This was a rally for Ron Pauls presidential bid where he had 5k or so people attend. These are ordinary people coming in from the street. Are you seeing the picture yet??

Show me Mccain's huge magnificent rally's where he gets 10x that, so at least it equals in some way all the voting patterns from state to state.!!! SHOW ME!!
 
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syborius said:
So Hyoomen claims he is being logical, he claims he is only here to offer alternatives, yet he uses as an example the only other congressman in all of congress that the elite establishment absolutely despise as evidence that there is nothing wrong with these election numbers.

While we are trying to open up eyes to the obvious anomalies and abnormalities of the voting numbers, you do the exact opposite by propping up the same establishment numbers of one of the only friends of Ron Paul's, who many times actually votes with Ron Paul. Do you not see your own fallacy here? It becomes very circular after that. . . In any event keep on trying, you are doing a bang up job for your masters, just let it be know they own you.

So, here it is hyoomen, Show me a rally with Mccain pulling at least 1000 people from the street. A street rally. I want to see a youtube or pictures of him with adoring crowds. Not a staged event from a University. I want to see a street rally for John Mccan with all his fans.

Let's actually up the ante. Show me a rally like that in Texas. This was in Austin. This was a rally for Ron Pauls presidential bid where he had 5k or so people attend. These are ordinary people coming in from the street. Are you seeing the picture yet??

Show me Mccain's huge magnificent rally's where he gets 10x that, so at least it equals in some way all the voting patterns from state to state.!!! SHOW ME!!
Click to expand...
If rallies and moneybombs were votes, we wouldn't have to worry about voter fraud because we'd simply have an applause-o-meter. I am a young person who cares and has done volumes to turn others into intellectually fortified Ron Paul supporters. I was unable to make the UT Austin or Killeen rallies, but I was at the Denton rally the week before where a third of us attendees had to move to another room and hear an abbreviated version of Dr. Paul's speech because there were so many more of us than anticipated. But by the same token, I didn't see many of those 'energized youth' offering themselves as election judges or poll watchers. I didn't see a statistically significant number of the 60-80 year olds who are accountable for the majority of votes cast in election after election at the rally or in other Ron Paul events.

It is blatantly disrespectful of you to question my loyalty simply because I question the prevailing 'logic'. I'd point out how similar your attacks on me are to how "the Establishment" attacks its detractors, but I fear the point would be missed. My masters? How dare you? Is this the sort of talk you would expect from Ron Paul to somebody who tries to inject cautious logic into unfounded accusations?

I offered one example (the first of many I'm sure I'll find and you'll reject as further proof that the Establishment is In Power) and you accuse me of not being concerned about vote anomalies/abnormalities. Is the difference between TX-14 votes in Dr. Paul's TX-14 race and his Presidential race qualifiable as an abnormality or anomaly? Yes, in one sense (strange that people would vote for a person in one election but not another); no, in another sense (matches polling figures nationwide). Does it NECESSARILY indicate voter fraud? No -- it could represent, as previously mentioned, the disconnect between his domestic policy and his foreign policy, the difference in his opponents for each race, the senselessness of the average voter (no offense to TX-14 voters), voter fraud, the Congressman's own interest in running for House of Representatives again vs. running for President, the effect of an incumbent for one office as a 'darkhorse' for another, people's interest in voting for the 'obvious winner' regardless of issues or community pride, the amount of money per vote spent on his Congressional race vs. the amount of money per vote spent on his Presidential race, etc.
 
hyoomen said:
If rallies and moneybombs were votes, we wouldn't have to worry about voter fraud because we'd simply have an applause-o-meter. I am a young person who cares and has done volumes to turn others into intellectually fortified Ron Paul supporters. I was unable to make the UT Austin or Killeen rallies, but I was at the Denton rally the week before where a third of us attendees had to move to another room and hear an abbreviated version of Dr. Paul's speech because there were so many more of us than anticipated. But by the same token, I didn't see many of those 'energized youth' offering themselves as election judges or poll watchers. I didn't see a statistically significant number of the 60-80 year olds who are accountable for the majority of votes cast in election after election at the rally or in other Ron Paul events.

It is blatantly disrespectful of you to question my loyalty simply because I question the prevailing 'logic'. I'd point out how similar your attacks on me are to how "the Establishment" attacks its detractors, but I fear the point would be missed. My masters? How dare you? Is this the sort of talk you would expect from Ron Paul to somebody who tries to inject cautious logic into unfounded accusations?

I offered one example (the first of many I'm sure I'll find and you'll reject as further proof that the Establishment is In Power) and you accuse me of not being concerned about vote anomalies/abnormalities. Is the difference between TX-14 votes in Dr. Paul's TX-14 race and his Presidential race qualifiable as an abnormality or anomaly? Yes, in one sense (strange that people would vote for a person in one election but not another); no, in another sense (matches polling figures nationwide). Does it NECESSARILY indicate voter fraud? No -- it could represent, as previously mentioned, the disconnect between his domestic policy and his foreign policy, the difference in his opponents for each race, the senselessness of the average voter (no offense to TX-14 voters), voter fraud, the Congressman's own interest in running for House of Representatives again vs. running for President, the effect of an incumbent for one office as a 'darkhorse' for another, people's interest in voting for the 'obvious winner' regardless of issues or community pride, the amount of money per vote spent on his Congressional race vs. the amount of money per vote spent on his Presidential race, etc.
Click to expand...

You seem to be losing rather badly, I see those pictures from austin TX are hard to swallow given your vociferous attempt at rebuttal....btw, you forgot to show me....
 
WTF are you talking about? I had seen numerous pictures of the Austin rally. I never said anything decrying the awesomeness of all of the Texas rallies heretofore.

Please allow me to phrase my response a better way: what, specifically, do you think a rally of 5000 people for Ron Paul indicates?
 
Is this still an actual discussion? Amazing.

PEOPLE VOTE FOR THE PERSON WITH NAME RECOGNITION. If it's between somebody they've heard of and somebody they haven't, they choose the person they know most about.

If McCain was running against RP for this congressional seat he would have won.

When it's a nobody named Chis Peden, RP wins.

What is so impossible to grasp about this concept? Why must everything be a conspiracy?
 
hyoomen said:
WTF are you talking about? I had seen numerous pictures of the Austin rally. I never said anything decrying the awesomeness of all of the Texas rallies heretofore.

Please allow me to phrase my response a better way: what, specifically, do you think a rally of 5000 people for Ron Paul indicates?
Click to expand...

It indicates your head in the sand of denial. I asked you to show me! SHOW ME A MCCAIN RALLY from the STREET with that kind of support...SHOW ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I want to see something tangible from you, something, anything other than your empty platitudes, and conjecture. SHOW ME pictures of a rally for Mccain. Surely he must have 1 youtube, or a few pictures from a single state where he is winning these landslide victories..You fight very hard to prop up the establishment position. Now SHOW ME!!!
 
/me faints from exhaustion and and bewilderment that there is a voice of reason

BTW, for the continued conspiracy theorists, I'm currently seeking records of AZ polls for Rep. Udall for his House seat vs. his Presidential bid. He was a bit more beloved than Ron Paul, though. It is difficult to find examples with any similarity, as Representatives rarely run for President.

Another Rep. who ran for Pres. was John B. Anderson in 1980, who, after falling out the Republican nomination race, sought candidacy as an independent and gave one of the strongest showings as a third party candidate in the 20th century (with approximately 7%). The example is again not perfect -- though he didn't carry a single precinct in the country including the one from which he had originated as a Representative -- he had dropped out of his House race to run for President. Thus, one could argue, he had shown more dedication to his run for President than has Congressman Paul. Though he has recently endorsed Obama, he is definitely a person to research for anybody who is interested in Republicans or Democrats running third party in a Presidential election. He's also an advocate for Instant Runoff Voting -- both as a way of encouraging more legitimate numbers in elections and of mitigating the 'spoiler effect' that keeps many people from voting for third party candidates.

Anybody else have other examples? Is there any example I could give that would prove that the numbers could just be the numbers and nothing more or will you refuse to hear it, syborius?
 
I suppose Hooey would like us to believe that 40,000 people just walked away in District #14 after voting for President without voting in their own Congressional race.

Answer me that one, smart guy.
 
SteveMartin said:
Constituent,
...

McCain has virtually no support beyond the newsroom. ...
Click to expand...

Wrong.
He's been numberOne ever since it became clear the Giuliani could simply not be sold.

Checking regularly with the only Song Sheet that counts, helps avoid wild speculations - not to mention shock & outrage...

Song Sheet
V
SongSheet.jpg


That little page, accurately predicted every twist and turn in fortunes over the last six months.
Ron Paul is nowhere, because he isn't on that page, tho no less than 23 havebeens are.
It's just the way democracy works...
 
SteveMartin said:
LOL...Proemio...

Are you saying we have the best democracy a shekel can buy?
Click to expand...

It took me about 40 years to realize that democracy is as much a scam as fractional reserve banking, and also has a similar, finite life-cycle, whereby it must eventually self-destruct. With democracy, the moment arrives when over half the voting population depends on government 'largesse' in some fashion. We are way past that mark, if you count all the fashist constructs involving 'strategic' corporations.

The worst part about my 'discovery' was the fact that less than two weeks after my great moment, I discovered that the ancient greeks had all this already figured out; and so did obviously some of the Founders.
There isn't much 'change' available under the sun, except packaging...

Since we are effectively only 'hours' away from the critical point, Ron Paul will most likely be the next President - almost by default.
Events are marching his (our) way.
That's what I believe since the day he announced his intention to run - and still do, as long as we keep him going...

----------
BTW. it's not sheckels. It's all the dollars from all the various 'aid' packages. It's called buying your own demise...
 
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Wow!
It's great to see this post get this amount of attention.
Let me clarify, the 54,111 votes were for Ron Paul's Congressional seat in District 14.
The problem is that I can't believe that 54,111 people in his district would vote for him for Congress but not for President.
This does not make sense, maybe we need to find these people or poll his district to see if they voted for him for President as well.

I just can't see a large group of people voting for Ron Paul for Congressman and then voting for McCain or Huckabee for President.
They are in 180 degrees away from his political philosophy.
 
Looks like in Texas you can vote for whoever you want to in the general election.

Voting in the Primary Elections

If you are a registered voter in the state of Texas, you will simply choose your party and vote in that party's primary. To explain, we do not register by party in Texas. One becomes "affiliated" with a party by voting in a party's primary and the affiliation lasts for that primary year. As an example, if a voter voted in the March 2006 primary or April 2006 runoff primary, the voter affiliated with that party for the rest of that year, but on December 31, 2006 the affiliation expired. The affiliation means that the person may not vote in another party’s primary or participate in another party’s convention or sign an independent candidate’s petition for place on the ballot if the independent candidate’s position appears on the primary ballot.
Note that in the general election in November, a voter may vote for whomever he/she wishes, regardless of how or whether he/she voted in the primary or runoff primary election, since all candidates are on the same ballot.
 
Folks, please calm down. Take a deep breath and think.

RP did quite poorly in terms of TX-14 presidential votes for some combination of factors: campaign distracted by congressional run, people wanted to keep him as their representative, he simply did not reflect peoples' foreign policy and other national priorities that are relevant to a president (vs. House member), weak advertising and phone-banking relative to the Big 2, he was running against two more prominent and better funded peers vs. 1 bozo deputy mayor and the fact that incumbents have an ENORMOUS advantage in House races, especially in a primary. We could think of other reasons if we tried. RP got like 12%+ for Prez in his district, so there was some bounce due to hometown pride and name recognition, but it doesn't trump everything.

Have you taken a break from your pile-on of hyoomen yet? By the way, do any of you live in TX-14? Have you spoken at length with people there? How many, and what did they say? This issue has been addressed at other sites (I think it was either Daily Paul or Daily Dose) and someone pointed out that they lived down there and personally knew of several people that voted for RP for Congress and the Huckster for Prez. Does RP think he got blatantly screwed by a factor of 2x-3x as most of you are alleging? Let me know what you come up with.

Oh, and in reference to the earlier point re: Austin "well, but RP had a lot of signs up and people at the rally, so he must have gotten so many more votes" - I would point out that he has had more signs up throughout the entire country (and big rallies), including places where we finished in low single digits. How many at the Austin rally were from other parts of Texas, or even other states for that matter? Let's not kid ourselves, Granny smith and Grandpa neo-con that voted for Huckster and McVain don't usually put up yardsigns or go to rallies. RP earned 17% in Travis county - hey, that's a very good showing for him.

Let's work on something real, not get drunk on feel-good stories about how we were robbed ....based on zero evidence.
 
hyoomen said:
What, specifically, are you referring to? I haven't seen this statistic borne out.
Click to expand...

Why didn't the people that voted for Mccain in the 14th district also vote for Peden? It makes no sense. if Mccain won the presidential bid in a landslide in the 14th district, wouldn't those same people be motivated to vote for Peden as well? You have basically all those people give a thumbs up to Mccain because they HATE HATE HATE Ron Paul, but for the congressional run just walk out on Peden, and not vote?
 
First, pay attention that not all of them voted for McCain or Paul. In one county there were even 350 early votes given to Hugh Cort (for some reason I haven't figured out). Huckabee played a part in keeping votes away from McCain. That having been said, many people didn't vote for McCain because they hate Ron Paul -- they voted for McCain because he is the presumptive nominee of the GOP.

In the grand scheme of things, it doesn't make sense -- but in the context of the erosion of principle and intellect in our American political experiment it is par for the course.

We will change this, though. Are you a delegate in your state? Are you ready to teach about what we know best: the need for all men to embrace their right to Liberty?
 
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