Total RP Pres. Texas votes 69,824 vs RP district14 Total votes 54,111

[TruthAtLast]

Immediate action is being taken right here and right now. Information and knowledge lead to victory. Nothing much else ever has.

OK, i can go with that. But I'd still love someone to investigate this further. Isn't there a smoking gun we can find?

 

[NerveShocker]

I KNOW what the long term goal is. Geesh, can you please stay on topic. My point is that this entire thread is based on the numbers in Texas. I am saying we need proof. Then others say that proof wont matter because we can't take anyone to court (which I'm not arguing with). So I merely am responding that if there is no immediate action that can be taken regarding this alleged voter fraud, then why are we arguing WHAT the reason was?

Go watch those videos again, you'll be out of this skeptic phase faster than you can count to 3. Seriously.. I've been where you are, I know the remedy. You keep saying I don't offer and option but I offer the only option that Edward Griffen says is viable. This is overthrowing and giving the power back to the people. You do this hopefully peacefully by one by one waking up the population and letting them know who truly represents the voice of the people. (What we do here everyday) In other words getting people to vote those who have our best interests at heart into positions of power.

Of course theres always the other way which as the Revolution against British rule and tyranny did involves violence. This would only happen if there was no choice or as Jack Kennedy said "When peaceful protests become illegal, violent protests become inevitable."

 

[SteveMartin]

NS,

Sadly that day seems to be arriving quickly. If we can't even vote anymore, that's all we have left.

Thank goodness we have strong evidence that many in the military are with us.

This blatant fraud in Texas may lead to many things.

TAL,

My apologies. You are young if that is your picture, and we old guys who have been fighting these traitors for decades are running out of patience--I shouldn't take that out on people who are just beginning to understand the depths of the problem.

 

[hyoomen]

Wow, where did you learn to talk like that? Alan Greenspan teach you some of his GreenSpeak? ... and other inanities

You've questioned my intelligence, you've questioned my speech, you've questioned my support of Ron Paul, you've put words in my mouth. What else would you like to do?

I said specifically I was offering alternatives to the idea of voter fraud; they happen to be not senseless suggestions and do not require specific evidence to refute your foregone conclusion. I'm not opposed to the possibility of voter fraud out of hand, but it is a serious allegation that warrants better evidence than your onerous assumption that all people who vote for A for Office B must also vote for A for Office A when Office B and Office A are different and present different obstacles.

I'll try not to take too much offense at the idea that you questioned my support of Ron Paul indirectly by saying I have a lot to learn about "us Ron Paul supporters" in an exclusive way. I am, however, learning how rapidly people are willing to jump to the idea of conspiracy without considering the more commonplace answers of coincidence, stupidity, or a lack of will.

BTW, if you'll "have me know" a statistic, please back it up with your source. Which specific polls are you using to back up the idea that only 10% make up their mind at the polls? It is somewhat moot, as I was simply offering one of many alternative possibilities, but I'm curious nevertheless.

 

[SteveMartin]

Oh goodie! More hooey from the hooyman!

Want to try telling us another race in the history of American politics where a candidate running for two positions got a 5-fold variation in votes from voters in the same district on the same day for one office versus another?

 

[TruthAtLast]

Go watch those videos again, you'll be out of this skeptic phase faster than you can count to 3. Seriously.. I've been where you are, I know the remedy. You keep saying I don't offer and option but I offer the only option that Edward Griffen says is viable. This is overthrowing and giving the power back to the people. You do this hopefully peacefully by one by one waking up the population and letting them know who truly represents the voice of the people. (What we do here everyday) In other words getting people to vote those who have our best interests at heart into positions of power.

Of course theres always the other way which as the Revolution against British rule and tyranny did involves violence. This would only happen if there was no choice or as Jack Kennedy said "When peaceful protests become illegal, violent protests become inevitable."

So would we say that education and informing the public is really the best long term goal? I talk to people every day that are so darn brainwashed that I don't know how to UN-brainwash them. I can talk to them about liberties being taken away, and how socialism creates eternal reliance on those in power, and the Homegrown Terrorist Act, and Rendition, and the FEMA concentration camps, and how the FED was created, how the IRS was never properly radified, how fractional reserve banking destroys a currency, how the media facilitates these actions, how our foreign policy affects our safety, and I can talk about the NAU and the Amero, and the how the U.N. and the World Bank were created, and I can spout off countless quotations from other presidents and heads of industries over the years..... and when all is said and done..... the truth is so friggin overwhelming that people immediately say that it is impossible or that I'm into conspiracies, or worse. Hell, my own family are hard pressed to believe it. My mom is friggin voting for McCain.

I know we need to "retake the ship" but there has GOT to be a method of effectively informing the public to these things without them being dismissed.

The department of education often controls the text books and very intelligent kids are coming out of school brainwashed.

 

[constituent]

fwiw, i doubt the votes have ever been accurately counted.

"free and fair" elections are probably just pie in the sky.

however, after watching the backlash to every state being
"voter fraud..." well, it's kinda like... we know that already.

i will tell you this though, just as an anecdotal story about
voting in tx.

my wife and i battled our 18 mo. old baby in a line for nearly
two hrs... right before we got up to the sign in table, a lady walks
up the line, "are there any republicans?"

my wife and i were alone in raising our hands...

we were brought immediately to the voting tables.

we'd been waiting in the "democrats" line b/c there
was no "republican" line... well, there was, you just couldn't
see it until you'd waited to get near the voting room.

the world is a crazy place.

something like 10x the turnout of any election ever, and
almost zero republicans.

there was a major failure in strategy that played out somewhere.

if not strategy, expectation.

just some thoughts.

 

[SteveMartin]

TAL,

The best thing is what we are all doing. When TPTB pull their next "terrorist attack" many people who may think your nuts now will become friendlies who will join us. You can only suspend disbelief for so long. You have planted the seed of truth, and TPTB will inevitably come along and water it.

Check out the nearby "petition" thread. That is (IMHO) how we take this to the next level, WITHOUT making it just a pure educational effort.

 

[theantirobot]

Could be the party elite was worried Ron would go third party if he lost his seat.

best explanation yet

 

[SteveMartin]

Constituent,


Very few Republcians, and yet we are supposed to believe there is all this enthusiasm out there for their anointed neocon?? Unbelievable brashness for the MSM to say otherwise, isn't it? Coincidence that we are stuck with the absolute worst of the original 11 they gave us, huh? The most warlike, belligerent S.O.B. ever to run for the office...

McCain has virtually no support beyond the newsroom. And those in the hinterland who do support him tend to be the most brainwashed and unintelligent of all.

 

[constituent]

Constituent,


Very few Republcians, and yet we are supposed to believe there is all this enthusiasm out there for their anointed neocon?? Ubelievable brashness for the MSM to say otherwise, isn't it?

McCain has virtually no support beyond the newsroom. And those in the hinterland who do support him tend to be the most brainwashed and unintelligent of all.

amen to that.

 

[Barney]

Somethings amiss. Everyone here feels it. Even the contrarians and the naysayers. So,...

Why not poll the district?


It wouldn't cost much and it may not be something that would hold up in court, but seriously,... how many here are dying to know?

I for one am tired of being force fed numbers I don't believe.

 

[SteveMartin]

Barney,

Right on, brother! I am Sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo sick of them getting away with this BS!!!

It would probably be quashed by the morons in Arlington, but hey, if anyone knows anybody in that district who is a real grassroots go-getter, I'd be willing to call him/her and try to get something rolling!

 

[hyoomen]

SteveMartin, et al

For those of you who can't produce an accurate, well-defended logical argument which succeeds in going beyond any element of reasonable doubt, I shall try to take a moment to post some basic references to logical thought later -- in another thread so you won't further accuse me (erroneously, thus far) of detracting from the thread.

Thus far your responses to my arguments have been the Ron Paul-fanatic equivalent of "if you're against the war on terror then you are unAmerican". I had hoped us Ron Paul supporters stood for more than that.

 

[SteveMartin]

hooyman,

Have fun. Nobody here is buying your hooey.

We are already way beyond a reasonable doubt in just comparing the 37,000 votes RP got in CD #14 for the congressional race vs. the measly 6000+ he got for the presidential race. Anybody who can't see that is not worth my time to read.

Here is what RON PAUL said today:

"Of course all the spontaneous effort and work and sign making; there is no doubt in the minds of congress who has the most enthusiastic supporters. It would be nice if this translated into a much higher percentage. To some degree this is a little disappointing, but there are different explanations for that. The type of credibility the front runners get from the media has something to do with it. Sometimes I wonder about the counting of the votes."

 

[SteveMartin]

bump

 

[hyoomen]

"The type of credibility the front runners get from the media has something to do with it. Sometimes I wonder about the counting of the votes."

Even Rep. Paul does not make the logical error of jumping to a conclusion. He simply allows for the possibility and, probably, expects there to be some answers in the future.

I don't deny that something is awry. But then, I also can't forget that every person I encountered in N. Texas who I didn't know to be a Ron Paul fan in advance had either not heard of him or thought he had dropped out. I can't forget that Congressman Paul himself laid off Presidential campaign staff and spent nearly a month focusing almost exclusively on his Congressional primary race. I can't ignore that in the last week leading up to Tuesday polls show Rep. Paul dropping from 11% to 7% to 4% as Huckabee enacted a huge media blitz and dramatic grassroots/church surge to try and overtake McCain. McCain's numbers held steady and Huckabee siphoned off would-be Rep. Paul supporters on the basis that he might have a better chance of stopping McCain at this point than Rep. Paul. I don't like it, but that is clearly borne out by statistics that are far more scientific than "well those people voted for him in one race but didn't vote for him in that other race so we call shenanigans". Could TX-14 have trended similarly? I'm not sure. Do a poll and find out.

None of what we have talked about, except for one brief mention in one of my previous posts, has even really touched on a phenomenon many of us know all too well. Since many (most?) people tend to vote for the 'lesser of two evils', many people might have thought Ron Paul to be the lesser of the two evils between him and Peden, but not the lesser of the three evils between him and McCain and Huckabee. Most of us on the boards and/or those of us who stayed up for 60 hours straight merging databases and calling people in multiple counties and training precinct participants and sending mass emails with resolutions and delegate strategies and/or those of us who further went on to become delegates and Precinct Convention Chairs and pass resolutions, etc. would never fathom Dr. Paul as the 'lesser of two evils', but that doesn't mean Joe Blow of Victoria, TX doesn't.

I'd like to point out at this point that I've done my best to not counter this run away allegation with ad hominem attacks or appeals to emotion, community/family (Ron Paul supporters), or any other logical misstep.

I'm at this time trying to figure out how to filter results of other elections for candidates who ran in two races simultaneously and then assess whether there have been past statistical anomalies of this sort, though I suspect if I were to demonstrate past instances you'd all only accept them as "further proof of a conspiracy". In essence you've setup a circuitous logic in which you have only one answer and you'll seek to fit all evidence into it.

 

[TN_VOL]

Unbelievable.... Completely Unbelievable

 

[hyoomen]

First result in researching similar phenomenon, Congressman Paul's Democratic friend, Dennis Kucinich:

http://publicpolicypolling.blogspot.com/2008/02/ohio-10th-district-poll.html

Ohio 10th District Poll

Voters in Ohio's 10th Congressional District aren't planning to cast a symbolic vote for their Congressman, Dennis Kucinich, for President:

Hillary Clinton 55
Barack Obama 31
Dennis Kucinich 4

Hillary Clinton has a strong advantage in the heavily white district.

But despite a challenge in the primary from four opponents, Kucinich appears pretty safe for reelection:

Dennis Kucinich 55
Joe Cimperman 29
Barbara Anne Ferris 5
Tom O'Grady 4
Rosemary Palmer 1

Since there isn't much enthusiasm in the district for his Presidential candidacy, it looks like Kucinich made the prudent choice by coming home before the South Carolina primary and campaigning for reelection.

While a strong majority of Democrats (59-26) support Kucinich for reelection but Republicans and independents planning to vote in the primary appear to be less enthused with him. He leads 45-35 with the former group and trails 45-34 with the latter.

Gee, I wonder if those numbers look familiar. Oh wait, maybe all of the Diebold machines and polling surveys in the land are automatically programmed to give incumbent Congressmen who are running for President the same numbers, approximately 70% for incumbent Congressional seat, 4% for White House. I CRACKED THE CODE. </sarcasm>

 

[SteveMartin]

hooyman,

Nice job! Extra pay check for you this week!