Tom Woods and Lew Rockwell tear into Rand

[r3volution 3.0]

As others have explained, Lew and Tom have been trashing Rand for a long time now.

If you believe that they're both intelligent and well-intended libertarians, this behavior is inexplicable, so...

The goal is not to appeal to the most nihilistic idiots on the internet. The goal is to present libertarian ideas and go about implementing them in the most practical manner.

reposted for emphasis

 

[r3volution 3.0]

" No one seems to appreciate that he, like his father, doesn't *want* to be president but is running in hope of salvaging something of this country."

Oh, so now it's back to being a "message" campaign? Wonderful!

No retard, it means that Rand gets no joy out of campaigning and is making a large personal sacrifice by doing so.

Since I donated to Rand with the belief he actually, really wanted to President instead of being a prophet, I'm going to ask for a refund.

I don't believe that you ever had any intention of supporting Rand.

Because the nice thing about being a prophet is, it doesn't cost anything.

Instead of Rand Paul for President in 2016 the campaign should be re-titled "Rand Paul Traveling Salvation Show 2016". Got to have a little truth in advertising don't you know?

Why are you here?

 

[eleganz]

A lot of you guys forget the fact that Lew and Tom RELY on riling up the anti-government, ancap, Adam Kobkesh type crowd (nothing inherently wrong with it). Most of the libertarian supporters that weren't happy with Rand's decision to stick his middle finger up against the party after 2012 needed a place to hang out. Its all very obvious and actually nothing wrong with it but Lew will always be Lew and Tom, well, he'll always be Tom.

Lew doesn't care about electoral anything, he wants the system to crumble. I don't blame him for wanting that but if you believe in having no government go focus on the private sector, be successful, spread the message about voluntarism, why waste time attacking the guy who is more or less on your side?

 

[robskicks]

A lot of you guys forget the fact that Lew and Tom RELY on riling up the anti-government, ancap, Adam Kobkesh type crowd (nothing inherently wrong with it). Most of the libertarian supporters that weren't happy with Rand's decision to stick his middle finger up against the party after 2012 needed a place to hang out. Its all very obvious and actually nothing wrong with it but Lew will always be Lew and Tom, well, he'll always be Tom.

Lew doesn't care about electoral anything, he wants the system to crumble. I don't blame him for wanting that but if you believe in having no government go focus on the private sector, be successful, spread the message about voluntarism, why waste time attacking the guy who is more or less on your side?

exactly, and the same goes for Tom

 

[fisharmor]

You know, nobody in this thread who is taking exception to what they said is even bothering to address the material.
You're all indistinct from people who spout "they hate us for our freedoms" when we have a long and incredibly detailed record of certain Muslims' material grievances with us which doesn't include that statement.

You want to know what they think? They're both very eloquent speakers and neither is prone to bullshitting.
I know you've all given up on the idea that there might be people in this world who say what they mean and mean what they say, but just try it for once. Listen to what they're actually saying, and ignore what you want to hear, and you'll find out exactly what they're thinking.

I say this knowing fully that one of you is going to respond to me and fail to understand what I've written. I look forward to quoting your text, so go ahead.

why waste time attacking the guy who is more or less on your side?

Wow, it actually took almost 4 and a half hours. But here we are.

Go ahead. Be the first person in the thread other than me to detail what they said, and explain why you perceive it as an attack.

 

[William Tell]

Familiarity breeds contempt. They are critical, and some of those criticisms are valid. But it shows that they have given up. One way to guarantee a loss is to give up too early. Elections are dynamic. Front runners change. And more than anything, there hasn't been any actual elections yet. A sports team doesn't give up until they are mathematically eliminated. Giving up during the preseason is a bit premature.

Of course they are focused on Rand because they do believe he has the best positions of any of the candidates. But when the discussion is about criticism, maybe it's best to focus some equal time on the other candidates. There's still a lot of them out there.

The glass is half full. Don't dump it out yet, cause some of us will drink it! And if it's Franzia, Suz will kill you if you pour it out.

+Rep.

 

[William Tell]

Yup. Lew has been bashing Rand on Facebook for months. It's been disgusting.

I think Lew spends more time trashing liberty allies than he does enemies.

 

[fisharmor]

I think Lew spends more time trashing liberty allies than he does enemies.

I think Rand's supporters spend more time trashing Lew than they do actually listening to what he's saying.

 

[William Tell]

I think Rand's supporters spend more time trashing Lew than they do actually listening to what he's saying.

I used to listen to him. I've learned to tune him out now. I'm not mindlessly anti Lew. Lew is pointlessly anti Rand.

If Lew and Tom want to spend their time talking trash about the most high profile guy who is basically on their side, fine. That's their problem. They won't get any support from me.

I've always liked Tom Woods as a person. But he's hurting himself and his cause. There is a middle ground between supporting Rand and trashing him. It would be better if they found it in my opinion. But geniuses like them probably don't want to hear from guys like me.

 

[fisharmor]

Well, thanks for admitting that you and the rest of the people commenting on how wrong Lew is didn't fucking listen to what we're supposed to be talking about.

You passed the bar for Rand supporters: turning off your ears and sticking with the program.

 

[William Tell]

Well, thanks for admitting that you and the rest of the people commenting on how wrong Lew is didn't fucking listen to what we're supposed to be talking about.

According to who? This thread is about Lew talking crap about Rand. You are a Lew fan. Nothing wrong with that.

 

[robskicks]

Well, thanks for admitting that you and the rest of the people commenting on how wrong Lew is didn't fucking listen to what we're supposed to be talking about.

You passed the bar for Rand supporters: turning off your ears and sticking with the program.

It's the free market at work. Don't like the product, don't fucking come back for more.

 

[Dr. Dog]

I think Lew spends more time trashing liberty allies than he does enemies.

Typical "purist" circlejerk.

 

[William Tell]

It's the free market at work. Don't like the product, don't fucking come back for more.

Shut up and donate to LRC, punk.

 

[William Tell]

Typical "purist" circlejerk.

Yeah. If Rand spent all his time trashing Lew and Tom I would tell him to grow up, just like I'm telling them now.

 

[Badger Paul]

"No retard, it means that Rand gets no joy out of campaigning and is making a large personal sacrifice by doing so."

Really? Well, I know a lot of people who made a lot personal sacrifices for his father and for Rand too, without which he would never be a U.S. Senator. If he didn't want to run for President he should have said so, not torture himself. You're asking me to support a man for President who doesn't want to be President or campaign for it? Lovely! Should I and others cease and desist to keep him from this miserable fate such is the Oval Office?

Why am I here? I've been here since 2007. You in for that long? All I'm doing is simply expressing the concern I and I'm sure others have this campaign from the candidate himself has been less than a 100 percent effort and may well wind up another giant sucking machine designed to part donors from their for little in return as what happened at the end of the 2012 campaign. As I said I don't want to see that happen again. If my words light a fire under Rand and claque, well then that's what I hoped for.

 

[r3volution 3.0]

"No retard, it means that Rand gets no joy out of campaigning and is making a large personal sacrifice by doing so."

Really? Well, I know a lot of people who made a lot personal sacrifices for his father and for Rand too, without which he would never be a U.S. Senator. If he didn't want to run for President he should have said so, not torture himself. You're asking me to support a man for President who doesn't want to be President or campaign for it? Lovely! Should I and others cease and desist to keep him from this miserable fate such is the Oval Office?

Let's try again:

No, retard, Rand does want to become President, no one's said anything to the contrary; the point you've been (deliberately?) failing to grasp concerns his motives.

He's not doing it for status or money, or because he enjoys the spotlight (as with most politicians), he's doing it for altruistic reasons.

No doubt he would much rather be back in Kentucky practicing medicine than dealing with this grotesque circus we call politics, but he's taking one for the team.

The name Cincinnatus comes to mind.

...and you criticize and mock him for it. Lovely

Why am I here? I've been here since 2007.

That you've been around this long and still this thick is cause for despair.

...All I'm doing is simply expressing the concern...

No, you're intentionally undermining the only libertarian candidate in the race, for reasons unclear (stupidity? "burn it all down!" nihilism? ...dunno), like Lew and Tom.

 

[Badger Paul]

"That you've been around this long and still this thick is cause for despair."

And you'll be gone if he loses Iowa and New Hampshire unlike some folks who have been at this for a long while . Rand's dislike of politics may make him noble in your eyes but to the average voter, its just makes him puzzling and off-putting and not someone who the voters are looking at, at least not right now.

 

[r3volution 3.0]

"That you've been around this long and still this thick is cause for despair."

And you'll be gone if he loses Iowa and New Hampshire unlike some folks who have been at this for a long while.

I've been at this since 2008.

But your prediction that I'll be a 'fair weather fan' is amusing considering that you've already abandoned Rand, months before the first vote is cast.

Rand's dislike of politics may make him noble in your eyes but to the average voter, its just makes him puzzling and off-putting and not someone who the voters are looking at, at least not right now.

So...you're angry at Rand because he isn't a selfish, greedy, money-grubbing asshole like most other politicians?

Just go away, your past your expiration date

 

[Suzu]

" No one seems to appreciate that he, like his father, doesn't *want* to be president but is running in hope of salvaging something of this country."

Oh, so now it's back to being a "message" campaign? Wonderful! Since I donated to Rand with the belief he actually, really wanted to President instead of being a prophet, I'm going to ask for a refund. Because the nice thing about being a prophet is, it doesn't cost anything.

Instead of Rand Paul for President in 2016 the campaign should be re-titled "Rand Paul Traveling Salvation Show 2016". Got to have a little truth in advertising don't you know?

That's not at all what I meant. Go back and read my words without misinterpretation, and consider the fact that it's possible to want to win without really wanting to be president. Who in their right mind would really want to spend the days of their lives trying to straighten out the mess in D.C.? Someone who cares about the direction of the country more than about just having a good time in the personal realm.