Student Debt "Cancellation"

[TheTexan]

Here's an exercise for the reader: Who, if anyone, would federal courts recognize as having "standing" to sue over this issue - and for what kind of "relief"? (At least with the vaccine mandates, those directly subject to the mandates were easily recognized as having standing, and relief consisted of their not having to take the jab.)

What's ironic, is that if we sued them for theft, and miraculously won a judgement, they wouldn't have any money to pay us with.

Yet somehow, they magically can keep makin' it rain

 

[Invisible Man]

Serious question: Is there a silver lining here that cancelling these federal student loans will deprive the federal government of the revenue they would have gotten by the loans getting paid back?

Or does that not work?

 

[GlennwaldSnowdenAssanged]

Serious question: Is there a silver lining here that cancelling these federal student loans will deprive the federal government of the revenue they would have gotten by the loans getting paid back?

Or does that not work?

It matters not because in the end all wealth leads back to the government.

 

[ClaytonB]

 

[kahless]

There is not a week that goes by that the Biden admin is sending $$$ to Ukraine. What is the latest, 900 billion. That is just Ukraine alone, look at PPP loans and spending across the board. Barely a peep on the right about anything else but who does the right wing grifters go ape shit about, money to poor. It shows where their loyalties are.

There are battles to fight and there are battles that are not worth the fight like this one. The right is trying hard to lose in Nov. fighting this one as they remained silent about corporate welfare for the elites.

 

[CaptUSA]

There is not a week that goes by that the Biden admin is sending $$$ to Ukraine. What is the latest, 900 billion. That is just Ukraine alone, look at PPP loans and spending across the board. Barely a peep on the right about anything else but who does the right wing grifters go ape shit about, money to poor. It shows where their loyalties are.

What?! This is money FROM the poor!

This is another wealth transfer from the lower classes to the upper classes. Sorry if you missed that point. And yeah, I can deal with your "whataboutism", but I know lots of people who didn't go to college and have struggled mightily to make ends meet and to feed their families. They couldn't afford the debt and didn't think it was wise to take it on. I know others who scrimped and saved to pay off their loans because they didn't want that burden hanging them. But now, we're going to take those people's money to spend on the spoiled laptop class?! Yeah, sorry if this bothers me. This is the grasshoppers looting from the ants.

 

[ClaytonB]

Serious question: Is there a silver lining here that cancelling these federal student loans will deprive the federal government of the revenue they would have gotten by the loans getting paid back?

Or does that not work?

The great Student Loan Bailout is more of an insult than an injury.

Scene: Corleone sent a few of his thugs to tie you up, grope up your gal in front of you, gag you and then cut off your pinky finger and cauterize the wound, leaving you in blinding pain as your gal screams her brains out. After getting "the message", you're untied and, on the way out, the greenhorn that kept quiet the whole time because he's never seen anything like this in his life, spits on you. You know, to make his "contribution" to the ordeal. That's the Student Loan Bailout. It's an insult, to be sure, but compared to everything that came before, you won't even remember it tomorrow...

 

[acptulsa]

What?! This is money FROM the poor!

Even if they don't pay income tax, and only pay FICA tax, everybody is paying inflation tax these days.

 

[ClaytonB]

What?! This is money FROM the poor!

This is another wealth transfer from the lower classes to the upper classes. Sorry if you missed that point. And yeah, I can deal with your "whataboutism", but I know lots of people who didn't go to college and have struggled mightily to make ends meet and to feed their families. They couldn't afford the debt and didn't think it was wise to take it on. I know others who scrimped and saved to pay off their loans because they didn't want that burden hanging them. But now, we're going to take those people's money to spend on the spoiled laptop class?! Yeah, sorry if this bothers me. This is the grasshoppers looting from the ants.

I'm with kahless on this one.

The Fed is not a creature of the Democrat party, or the Left. The Fed is a creature of the Right. Really let that marinate and soak in... because the very people that conservative libertarians look to as their political allies (GOP right-wingers) are the very same people who are betraying them, certainly at the top levels, and many at the lower levels, as well. When the Fed is running the printing-press 24/7 to prop up the banksters and Wall Street zillionaires, you don't hear a peep out of the Republican Swamp, like McConnell and crew. But let Fed money be diverted from its usual destination in Wall Street/DC to middle-class folks -- some of whom are SJW weirdos, but most of whom are just aiming for a mid-level corporate job -- and an outcry will be raised in the right-wing that has not been equaled since the deaths of all firstborn in Egypt.

So yes, this is absolutely exposing how the Federal Reserve is the lynchpin of the class warfare being fought (and won) against the middle and lower-class by the ultra-wealthy elites in NYC, DC, and all around the world (the Fed is international).

Let me draw a diagram:

(a) Fed (infinity cash)
(b) Wall Street / DC plutocracy
(c) Middle management / "laptop class"
(d) Ordinary American workers
(e) The poor

(b) uses (a) to transfer real wealth from (c), (d) and, yes, even (e) to (b)

All other claimed combinations of redistribution are propaganda. (d) and (e) getting in a hoopla because a tiny drop of infinity-cash from (a) has been splashed away from (b) to (c) is the most naive case of falling for Wag-the-Dog class-warfare tactics.

KNOW THY ENEMY

 

[oyarde]

Serious question: Is there a silver lining here that cancelling these federal student loans will deprive the federal government of the revenue they would have gotten by the loans getting paid back?

Or does that not work?

As far as I know the feds probably have not been collecting revenue on these as before pre plague level because I think they suspended payment requirements to be deferred to later. In americas failure they have made the unproductive a protected class . Is the govt going to spend less ? I'm going with no .

 

[fcreature]

There are battles to fight and there are battles that are not worth the fight like this one. The right is trying hard to lose in Nov. fighting this one as they remained silent about corporate welfare for the elites.

Not sure. I see it the exact opposite actually. No one cares about sending money to Ukraine or the PPP loans. Nearly everyone who has paid back student debt, paid for college out of pocket, or didn't go to college is absolutely furious about this. This hits home in a very deep way, and is an easy issue to win on, but Republicans don't know how to fight.

 

[kahless]

Not sure. I see it the exact opposite actually. No one cares about sending money to Ukraine or the PPP loans. Nearly everyone who has paid back student debt, paid for college out of pocket, or didn't go to college is absolutely furious about this. This hits home in a very deep way, and is an easy issue to win on, but Republicans don't know how to fight.

That is what is moronic about it. No one cares about trillions to the elites and corporate welfare which is far more individually than paying off some student debt. Logically anyone can see this but the regular people get outraged because they are being led by the nose by right wing pundit grifters that do not have their best interests at heart. This provides another example for the entire country that the right is solely concerned about the best interests of Wall Street and satisfying the elites than the regular people. (even though you could say the same about the left it is just where the narrative is). It is a sure fire way to lose in November.

Those that are led by the nose by this do not realize their favorite pundits would love for Republicans they claim to support to lose in November. Simply because it will not be profitable for them to create outrage with a Republican majority. It is far more profitable when Republicans are a minority and when they can play victim status.

 

[Krugminator2]

That is what is moronic about it. No one cares about trillions to the elites and corporate welfare

Trillions doesn't go to elites in corporate welfare. You know where trillions does go? Lower and middle class people. It is an unpopular and correct view that NO ONE has the guts to say. I post the chart constantly showing two-thirds of the budget is entitlement spending so I won't do it for a 200th time. I would cut corporate welfare first even though it is peanuts compared to individual spending just so there wouldn't be any whataboutism like Biden used. But make no mistake, public sector pensions, social security and Medicare, and government employee incomes are where the biggest bloat is at. Everything else oil subsidies, whatever you think Wall Street is getting, defense contractors, etc is peanuts.

I find student loan forgiveness to be an issue that is a hill to die. I would impeach Biden over this. This is blatantly buying votes.

 

[Snowball]

Dems say page 637 of the Heroes Act gave Biden the right to do this.

 

[kahless]

Trillions doesn't go to elites in corporate welfare. You know where trillions does go? Lower and middle class people. It is an unpopular and correct view that NO ONE has the guts to say. I post the chart constantly showing two-thirds of the budget is entitlement spending so I won't do it for a 200th time. I would cut corporate welfare first even though it is peanuts compared to individual spending just so there wouldn't be any whataboutism like Biden used. But make no mistake, public sector pensions, social security and Medicare, and government employee incomes are where the biggest bloat is at. Everything else oil subsidies, whatever you think Wall Street is getting, defense contractors, etc is peanuts.

I find student loan forgiveness to be an issue that is a hill to die. I would impeach Biden over this. This is blatantly buying votes.

No doubt a part of that chart is what Americans paid into Medicare and SS, considered a handout.

So the the hill to die on is 500 billion to poor Americans, but not well over trillion to Ukraine and 800 billion in PPP. Got it.

Keep it up and it will be a Democrat party sweep in November.

 

[acptulsa]

Trillions doesn't go to elites in corporate welfare.

I think we'll never be able to agree on definitions. For example, I don't think you consider the money spent weaponizing the cold, developing the poison and selling the "emergency" to be anything but government spending on propaganda and buying vaccines. But in the end...

And, of course, you wouldn't dream of calling Ukraine corporate welfare for Raytheon or Burisma, either. Like I say, we just aren't going to agree on definitions.

 

[Invisible Man]

No doubt a part of that chart is what Americans paid into Medicare and SS, considered a handout.

Correct. That is a handout. Money is being taken from current wage earners and transferred to current Medicare and SS recipients, just as their money was taken from them back when they were wage earners and transferred to others.

So the the hill to die on is 500 billion to poor Americans, but not well over trillion to Ukraine and 800 billion in PPP. Got it.

1. How do you get this from what he said? He just said he would cut corporate welfare first?
2. Why not die on both hills?
3. I'm not sure where your 500 billion number comes from, but the portion of entitlements that goes to poor Americans is just a fraction of a much larger number in that's in the trillions going to Americans who run the gamut from poor to rich.
4. What trillion to Ukraine?
5. If at any time you are concerned that not enough of your money is being transferred to poor people, you can always donate more. You don't need the government to be the middle man. Cutting government handouts to the poor is an unmitigated good thing. There is no downside to it and a lot of upside.

 

[PAF]

I think we'll never be able to agree on definitions. For example, I don't think you consider the money spent weaponizing the cold, developing the poison and selling the "emergency" to be anything but government spending on propaganda and buying vaccines. But in the end...

And, of course, you wouldn't dream of calling Ukraine corporate welfare for Raytheon or Burisma, either. Like I say, we just aren't going to agree on definitions.

That's one helluva chart. I would say it deserves a thread of its own.


On a side note, I keep hearing political candidate commercials. Like always, one side complains about the other's lying. Back and forth, dem vs repup. But you never hear the candidate's detailed outlines on what or how they would specifically cut spending, improve trade, or talk about individuals rights to privacy. "Hey, vote for me because that candidate is lying, I approve this ad, paid for by xyz!"

 

[kahless]

Correct. That is a handout. Money is being taken from current wage earners and transferred to current Medicare and SS recipients, just as their money was taken from them back when they were wage earners and transferred to others.

1. How do you get this from what he said? He just said he would cut corporate welfare first?

True and do not disagree as Krugminator2 sees it. Except where I was replying to his quote, about a hill to die on.

I find student loan forgiveness to be an issue that is a hill to die.

2. Why not die on both hills?

Strategy. You have to pick your battles if you want to regain seats and power in November.

4. What trillion to Ukraine?

Over time and latest. I am going to go back and fact check this. Allot of fake news out there, maybe this one got me with the amounts being inflated in the spreadsheet I was looking at.

 

[nobody's_hero]

What?! This is money FROM the poor!

This is another wealth transfer from the lower classes to the upper classes. Sorry if you missed that point. And yeah, I can deal with your "whataboutism", but I know lots of people who didn't go to college and have struggled mightily to make ends meet and to feed their families. They couldn't afford the debt and didn't think it was wise to take it on. I know others who scrimped and saved to pay off their loans because they didn't want that burden hanging them. But now, we're going to take those people's money to spend on the spoiled laptop class?! Yeah, sorry if this bothers me. This is the grasshoppers looting from the ants.

Maybe he's talking about the poor colleges that are owed money. Those poor colleges with grossly inflated tuition costs and silly fees you have to pay, like to use the campus swimming pool even though you never use it once the whole time you are in college.

Because if they really wanted to help the poor, they would let graduates file bankruptcy and walk away from their debt.

But it is like the old saying, "if you owe the bank 10,000, you have a problem. If you owe the bank $10,000,000, the bank has a problem."

This is trying to solve the bank's problems.