Stubborn Christians???

[Alabama Supporter]

We need a great Ron Paul video on Godtube. I've yet to see one. Maybe I should go buy a dummies guide to youtube production and make one this week...

 

[nigh_eve]

When all else fails...

Money talks.

One of the strongest suits that Dr. Paul holds is his view on the corrupt monetary policy. We cannot continue to borrow and print money and not expect consequences. None of the other candidates will talk about this or deal with it. I think they are content to spend the futures of our children and grandchildren with no intention of paying it back, which I've convinced at least one Christian friend, to be immoral.

Remind your Christian friends of Proverbs 22:7

The rich rules over the poor,
And the borrower becomes the lender's slave.

If we're not careful, we'll all be worshipping Confucious!

 

[Kade]

Point them to Augustine's City of God which is the best articulation of the Just War Doctrine.

Also, to some extent we might need to wait out the Huckabee campaign. When Huckabee eventually drops out, Paul will be the only pro-life Evangelical left in the race. So even though a Christian voter may disagree with his foreign policy, his other attributes may be strong enough to justify a vote.

Great, call someone who opposes the fact that Ron Paul is Evangelical Pro-Lifer a single issue voter, but use it to attract the largest group of halfwits this side of Pakistan.

The "stubborn" Theocrats of the Fascist Republican party are not going to waste their vote on anyone who values diversity and differences of opinion. They don't want to vote anymore, and they actively fight to get their rights taken away.

The concept of a "Christian Voter" is the most damaging evidence that this country is run by a majority of Cromwellian troglodytes loyal to the type of government that His Highness, George Bush II, employs.

I'm curious, because this type of thing always gets me thinking..

When the non-believers, gays, heathens, homeless, scientists, and academic professors are gone, who are you going to turn against?

Oh yea, this stuff...

Christian voters. pfft.

Try convincing them to think. Remind them that faith is a personal issue, and should be left that way. Don't resort to a tactic that people on here readily insult others for using...

If you make this upcoming presidency about values, we lose perspective on what matters. Our economy should be the focus, and this is why, as an atheist, I am as close as I am to supporting, and actively bringing support, from the undesirables of your precious families values-driven society.

If I can convince hundreds of thousands of people to vote for Ron Paul among atheists, scientists, gays, pagans, deists, Satanists, and professors, than you people shouldn't have such a damn hard time convincing the "single issue" zombie genuflects over.

 

[M.Bellmore]

Great, call someone who opposes the fact that Ron Paul is Evangelical Pro-Lifer a single issue voter, but use it to attract the largest group of halfwits this side of Pakistan.

The "stubborn" Theocrats of the Fascist Republican party are not going to waste their vote on anyone who values diversity and differences of opinion. They don't want to vote anymore, and they actively fight to get their rights taken away.

The concept of a "Christian Voter" is the most damaging evidence that this country is run by a majority of Cromwellian troglodytes loyal to the type of government that His Highness, George Bush II, employs.

I'm curious, because this type of thing always gets me thinking..

When the non-believers, gays, heathens, homeless, scientists, and academic professors are gone, who are you going to turn against?

Oh yea, this stuff...

Christian voters. pfft.

Try convincing them to think. Remind them that faith is a personal issue, and should be left that way. Don't resort to a tactic that people on here readily insult others for using...

If you make this upcoming presidency about values, we lose perspective on what matters. Our economy should be the focus, and this is why, as an atheist, I am as close as I am to supporting, and actively bringing support, from the undesirables of your precious families values-driven society.

If I can convince hundreds of thousands of people to vote for Ron Paul among atheists, scientists, gays, pagans, deists, Satanists, and professors, than you people shouldn't have such a damn hard time convincing the "single issue" zombie genuflects over.

I'm not sure how this helps win over Christian voters, but whatever.

 

[Kade]

I'm not sure how this helps win over Christian voters, but whatever.

There's that special concept again.

Yea, seriously, whatever. I don't care about Christian voters. If they vote for another dictator, than this country voted itself out of a democracy, and who are we to argue with any of the founder's warnings about that...?

 

[M.Bellmore]

There's that special concept again.

Yea, seriously, whatever. I don't care about Christian voters. If they vote for another dictator, than this country voted itself out of a democracy, and who are we to argue with any of the founder's warnings about that...?

I don't follow your logic. If you want to focus on a group of voters (especially a large group) to try and win them over for Ron Paul, is there something wrong with that?

 

[coffeewithchess]

I'm a Christian myself, so this is by no means an attack.

I think I tried too hard, or something...I'm so passionate that I looked angry. I tried to convert Christian friends, at least if anything to see how wrong this war is. Unfortunately, they associate my feelings with Ron's and it drove them away. They also thought I came across as thinking I was better than they are. UGH. So I am going to stop trying at least for now.

I am just wondering has anyone successfully talked sense into pro war Christians?

I was close to one of them, and I feel like I've lost her.

I know what you are saying here....I used to do the same thing. I was SO PASSIONATE, that I would come across as angry and "CRAZY", and like you said, people thinking that I thought I was better than them. Then my wonderful wife spoke with me, after I had a heated debate/argument with a friend over a political matter. She told me that it wasn't what I was saying, but how I was saying it. Instead of trying to convince them Iraq is wrong, ask them questions. Ask them if they know how much the United States is in debt, how much are we borrowing on a daily basis, etc. By asking questions, you will open the minds of the people and have them openly listen to you. Also, the best thing to do is simply apologize to your friend. Say, "I know I came across as angry and "holier than thou", I didn't mean to, this is something I'm just passionate about. Please forgive me." Then it's up to your friend.

 

[sugaki]

There's that special concept again.

Yea, seriously, whatever. I don't care about Christian voters. If they vote for another dictator, than this country voted itself out of a democracy, and who are we to argue with any of the founder's warnings about that...?

Yes, blame it on the Christian voters. Because when the war started, the majority of the population wasn't in support of the war or anything. It was only the magical, 30% neocons. Please.

 

[pcosmar]

Yes, blame it on the Christian voters. Because when the war started, the majority of the population wasn't in support of the war or anything. It was only the magical, 30% neocons. Please.

When it was started it was marketed and sold through the media.
As usual they did a good job of selling lies.
People are waking up.

 

[weatherbill]

I have a great Ron Paul flyer for churches. PM me your email to get it..... !

carpe diem....seize this day

 

[sugaki]

When it was started it was marketed and sold through the media.
As usual they did a good job of selling lies.
People are waking up.

That's irrelevant. People blaming it on the neocons, then side-stepped the issue by saying "media told us lies!" is just an excuse. It was an obvious fluke from the beginning. If people get easily fooled by "media," it's still the people's fault.

Kade has some obvious issues, too. Christians can't think? I don't see much thinking coming from you, considering you call Bush a dictator. Last I checked, dictators don't get voted in by an electoral college, then voted in again. Not to mention the fact that our system of democracy has this thing called checks and balances. The legislative branch can overrule presidential vetos with enough of a consensus (2/3). Pelosi-led democratic Congress just recently overruled a veto on spending for levees and post-Katrina reconstruction. So no, Bush isn't a dictator, just an incompetent president. He didn't somehow nullify the powers of the legislative and judiciary branch in the span of two terms.

Tired of these lame ad hominems, especially coming from somebody with a whole lot of rhetoric and not a lot of knowledge.

 

[SteveB-NY]

I apppreciated an earlier poster's quotes from the Pope as a point of reference for Catholic voters. I am less convinced however that St. Augustine is a winnable arguement as it can be argued [perhaps not well] that the invasion of Iraq was designed to liberate the Iraqis from tyranny.
The problem I face when discussing Ron Paul after mass on a Sunday or around the community is that in my area, 19 miles north of ground zero, the concept of Deo et Patria has become heavily loaded in favor of the latter. It is fair to describe the predominant point of view as "kill them all, let God sort them out".
My approach, which I admit has mixed sucess, is to point out that Ron Paul is not anti-military, in fact he is a Vietnam era veteran, he is not a "blame America" guy as Rudy tried to paint him but rather a thoughtful man who studies the issues and tries to understand the why so that we can avoid another attack.
Finally, I argue that even if you assume that everything we were told prior to the invasion was absolutely correct, and that Sadam was violating U.N. resolutions left right and center, the question comes down to is Cofffey Annan's prestige worth the two new headstones in the graveyard behind our church.
It is the media portrayal of Congressman Paul that is the biggest problem I run into.

 

[Marceline88]

I would direct stubborn Christians to the man who said these pesky words.....

"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God"

And remind them that the Lord is the Prince of Peace, and Peace is not a dirty word, it's the goal.

 

[sugaki]

I would direct stubborn Christians to the man who said these pesky words.....

"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God"

And remind them that the Lord is the Prince of Peace, and Peace is not a dirty word, it's the goal.

Taking that verse a bit out of context though (assuming you're applying that to the war in Iraq).

I can find verses in the bible and use them out of context to justify war too. The same said:

Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s enemies will be the members of his household. Matt 10:34

 

[J4ck]

'pro war christians' = ?
no offense.

 

[Marceline88]

Taking that verse a bit out of context though (assuming you're applying that to the war in Iraq).

I can find verses in the bible and use them out of context to justify war too. The same said:

Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s enemies will be the members of his household. Matt 10:34

I don't think I am taking it out of context at all. I am applying it to all war and violence.

As for the above verse....did Jesus ever actually pick up a sword? No. Was he speaking literally here? No, he was speaking metaphorically, metaphysically. I believe the only sword he wielded was the sword of truth. And the truth will certainly set a man against his own father and family members at times, does it not?

 

[sugaki]

As for the above verse....did Jesus ever actually pick up a sword? No. Was he speaking literally here? No, he was speaking metaphorically, metaphysically. I believe the only sword he wielded was the sword of truth. And the truth will certainly set a man against his own father and family members at times, does it not?

Jesus never picked up a sword, but he also told his disciples that they could carry a sword. My point is Matthew 5 doesn't preach wholesale pacifism. Heck, God commanded the Jewish people to wipe out whole civilizations, children and all.

 

[Nicketas]

,.,.,

 

[traitorist]

wow, so Kade (and others I've seen posting on this forum) is willing to throw away the votes of what amounts to approximately 70% of the American people, who believe in God or consider themselves Christian, in the name of his hatred and disdain for them and their religious beliefs?

Oh yeah, and blame them all too for our political current mess?

Pffft to you.

Very un-Ron Paul.

 

[Primbs]

There are some just war text books that Georgetown University used for teaching in the early 1980s.

They explain just war from a practical point of view.