Start your new year learning 'The Secret'.

[SilentBull]

I think that documentary took an important concept and basically dumbed it down for the masses. I read "Think and Grow Rich" and that made much more sense to me because it focused on you coming up with a detailed plan to reach your goal. "The Secret" teaches you how to think positively about what you want but they don't really cover the Action part of it, making people believe that if you want riches, you just have to sit and visualize it, and it will come.

 

[VIDEODROME]

Damnit I'll go to the Casino and just be really focused on winning hands at Blackjack.

 

[CaptUSA]

Deborah, allow me to speak up here. I read Napoleon Hill years ago along a journey of self-education. Many of the insights he gathered are included in the "Secret". Folks, if you do this right, it will work for you. It has to. You begin to see the world in a much more positive light. You take responsibility for your outcomes. If you are not experiencing a great world, it is because you are doing something wrong. But you can fix it. It's not easy... It takes a lot of work... But it can be done.

I encouraged my wife to start doing this - something that is extremely hard for her - but she's doing it. Why? Because she sees I'm happier and wants to share in it. Which only makes me happier. I still haven't asked for anything specific (to be honest, I don't know what else I want) but I do get the strong sense that if I want something, it will be achieved.

I don't know how much of a secret this is since damn near every majorly successful person from Eminem to Bill Cosby seems to know it. If you want to go from rags to riches, this is part of it. You need to take the right action as well, but if you start here, the right actions will reveal themselves to you. Thanks, Deborah for reminding me about this. This thread (and this forum) needed some positivity.

"Whatever the mind can conceive and believe, it can achieve" - Napoleon Hill
"Leap, and the net will appear" - John Burroughs

 

[Deborah K]

You misunderstand.

I'm saying that the ONLY value of "the secret" or "the law of attraction" is that it gets people to clarify their real goals and work toward really achieving them. You don't need any silly "energy" hocum.

Hokum implies there's no scientific evidence to back this process up. I've already listed the science that backs this up. The beauty of this process is that it provides common ground for science and theology.

I think that documentary took an important concept and basically dumbed it down for the masses. I read "Think and Grow Rich" and that made much more sense to me because it focused on you coming up with a detailed plan to reach your goal. "The Secret" teaches you how to think positively about what you want but they don't really cover the Action part of it, making people believe that if you want riches, you just have to sit and visualize it, and it will come.

First you claim they dumbed it down, then you claim they don't cover the action part of it. Spoon feeding people details about how to put their own plan together would be dumbing it down. The LofA encourages you to act on your inspirations. That's the key. When an inspired thought comes to you - don't be fearful, or lazy - act on it. If 'Think and Grow Rich' worked for you, then good on you! Chances are, it's the same concept.

Damnit I'll go to the Casino and just be really focused on winning hands at Blackjack.

I know you meant this as snark, but it won't work just by focusing. You have to have unwavering faith that you'll win. You have to really believe you deserve it. You have to visualize the outcome and feel the feelings you would have if you won. You have to have gratitude for the good in your life, and you have to monitor your feelings and determine to be in a state of happiness as much as you can. After you have consistently kept yourself in this state, then go play and see what happens.

Deborah, allow me to speak up here. I read Napoleon Hill years ago along a journey of self-education. Many of the insights he gathered are included in the "Secret". Folks, if you do this right, it will work for you. It has to. You begin to see the world in a much more positive light. You take responsibility for your outcomes. If you are not experiencing a great world, it is because you are doing something wrong. But you can fix it. It's not easy... It takes a lot of work... But it can be done.

I encouraged my wife to start doing this - something that is extremely hard for her - but she's doing it. Why? Because she sees I'm happier and wants to share in it. Which only makes me happier. I still haven't asked for anything specific (to be honest, I don't know what else I want) but I do get the strong sense that if I want something, it will be achieved.

I don't know how much of a secret this is since damn near every majorly successful person from Eminem to Bill Cosby seems to know it. If you want to go from rags to riches, this is part of it. You need to take the right action as well, but if you start here, the right actions will reveal themselves to you. Thanks, Deborah for reminding me about this. This thread (and this forum) needed some positivity.

"Whatever the mind can conceive and believe, it can achieve" - Napoleon Hill
"Leap, and the net will appear" - John Burroughs

Well put, Captn! And I agree that this forum desperately needs some positivity. I've noticed it's becoming a very depressing place to visit, which saddens me. In the video, they cover the reason why the wrong political opponents almost always win - and it's because our society spends too much time focusing our energy and emotions on being anti- this and that. The LofA works against you in the same way it works for you. If you spend your time fearing and focusing on what you don't want - all you're doing is attracting what you don't want into your life.

We need to focus our cause on being more PRO-LIBERTY and less ANTI-government, etc. Too much attention is paid to what we don't want. Go into New Posts at any given time. Almost all of it is negative. Go into almost any thread and people are squabbling at best, and attacking each other at worst. It's completely non-productive. And as someone who likes to get shit done, I find myself avoiding this forum anymore. I'm not saying we should never debate anything (Lord knows I love a good debate), but our energy and our focus needs to change here. Minds have become idle.

 

[SilentBull]

First you claim they dumbed it down, then you claim they don't cover the action part of it. Spoon feeding people details about how to put their own plan together would be dumbing it down. The LofA encourages you to act on your inspirations. That's the key. When an inspired thought comes to you - don't be fearful, or lazy - act on it. If 'Think and Grow Rich' worked for you, then good on you! Chances are, it's the same concept.

Let me clarify. "Think and Grow Rich" emphasizes the need for you to come up with a detailed plan for your goal. It tells you to have a deadline. It doesn't create the plan for you. The Secret, and I've seen it more than once (and the other one, "What the Bleep do we Know?"), doesn't emphasize action. They have a guy there talking about how he started receiving checks in the mail, without even going into where the money came from. That's silly. The guy obviously wrote a book or something, but he doesn't mention that. He just says he started visualizing money, and then it came in the mail. That's as dumbed down as you can get.

Don't get me wrong. I believe in The Secret, but I think that documentary doesn't do it justice because it simplifies it too much and I think it may have the opposite effect for many who think they just need to sit on their ass and visualize a big house and a nice car. Think and Grow Rich goes through examples of people who visualized the action, not just the material things they wanted to end up with.

For example, in the introduction, Napoleon Hill talks about a man who had a dream of becoming Thomas Edison's partner. He didn't just dream of owning a big house and having money. He knew how he wanted to become rich and developed a plan to do it.

If anyone is interested, you can get the PDF for free here: http://www.soilandhealth.org/03sov/0304spiritpsych/030413.hill.think.and.grow.rich.pdf

Oh, and doesn't The Secret teach that you can find an empty parking spot by visualizing it, or is that the other documentary, "What the Bleep do we Know?"

 

[Deborah K]

Let me clarify. "Think and Grow Rich" emphasizes the need for you to come up with a detailed plan for your goal. It tells you to have a deadline. It doesn't create the plan for you. The Secret, and I've seen it more than once (and the other one, "What the Bleep do we Know?"), doesn't emphasize action. They have a guy there talking about how he started receiving checks in the mail, without even going into where the money came from. That's silly. The guy obviously wrote a book or something, but he doesn't mention that. He just says he started visualizing money, and then it came in the mail. That's as dumbed down as you can get.

Don't get me wrong. I believe in The Secret, but I think that documentary doesn't do it justice because it simplifies it too much and I think it may have the opposite effect for many who think they just need to sit on their ass and visualize a big house and a nice car. Think and Grow Rich goes through examples of people who visualized the action, not just the material things they wanted to end up with.


If anyone is interested, you can get the PDF for free here: http://www.soilandhealth.org/03sov/0304spiritpsych/030413.hill.think.and.grow.rich.pdf

Oh, and doesn't The Secret teach that you can find an empty parking spot by visualizing it, or is that the other documentary, "What the Bleep do we Know?"

Basically we agree that the LofA is as real as the law of gravity. Right? I think our disagreement lies in the technique. Thank you for the link. The more books and clips we add the better. As long as people grasp the concept, that's all that really matters.

I personally like the way 'The Secret' lays it all out. I was one of those people who got too hung up on the "how" am I going to do this. Now that I don't worry about that, I'm finding that the "how" presents itself to me in a timely fashion. It unrolls as needed. This method works for me. The analogy used in the clip is - driving from NY to Cali in the dark; you can only see about 200 ft in front of you, but you KNOW the road will take you there.

For example, in the introduction, Napoleon Hill talks about a man who had a dream of becoming Thomas Edison's partner. He didn't just dream of owning a big house and having money. He knew how he wanted to become rich and developed a plan to do it.

The 'LofA' is about attracting whatever you want, which includes money, etc. So, if someone wants to lose weight, or find the love of their life, etc., they can 'intend' it. There's a whole section in the clip that covers health issues.

The parking spot is in this clip. You won't believe me, but I'll tell you anyway: I've been getting parking spots for years. I learned how to do this about 20 years ago. Whenever I'm in a car with someone who doesn't know this, they always think it's a coinkydink. But my family knows, they do it, it works. And as far as the scenario about the checks coming in the mail - the point is not in HOW he achieved it - the point is that he wanted it, visualized it, went through the process of an attitude of gratitude, etc. and ACTED on his inspirations (obviously), which manifested his desire. The guy who made millions writing the 'Chicken Soup for the Soul' series, goes into a little more detail about how his intentions manifested. I dunno, I'm not one who needs a lot of detail when I get the big picture, but I realize not everyone perceives things in the same way. Which is why I'm glad to see people posting other aspects of this.

 

[mczerone]

Hokum implies there's no scientific evidence to back this process up. I've already listed the science that backs this up. The beauty of this process is that it provides common ground for science and theology.

What science? Where?

Where is a link to a peer-reviewed longitudinal study showing that similarly situated individuals will fare better/worse depending on if they simply set out goals and make a plan, or if they do that while trying to manifest positive outcomes using "the energy of the Universe"?

I went through all your posts in this thread, and never saw "science."

Or perhaps your were referring to these disputable facts:

Here are some indisputable facts for you:

1. The entire Universe and everything in it is made up of energy.

2. Every thought has a frequency, you can measure a thought. Your thoughts are emitting a magnetic frequency.

3. The field of psychology took the visualization process that was used in the Apollo program and instituted it during the 80s and 90s into the Olympic program and named it ‘Visual Motor Rehearsal’. They then took Olympic track and field athletes and hooked them up to bio-feedback machines and had them running their events in their minds. The same muscles fired in the same sequence in their minds as on the field. The mind cannot distinguish between visualization and reality. Tiger Woods and many other professional athletes use this form of training.

4. In medical science, they are beginning to understand the degree to which thoughts and emotions actually determine the physical substance, structure, and functions of our bodies. Consider the placebo effect. Consider the cliché: mind over matter.

5. Science has learned that the human mind is the biggest factor in healing.

6. The law of attraction has been well known for thousands of years. It’s found in the Bible, and every well-known philosopher has taught on it. Consider Plato for example. Inventors, athletes, scientists, writers, composers, and on and on throughout history have used the law of attraction and talked about it.

7. The law of attraction manifests the things you are thinking and feeling, whether your thoughts are good or bad, and whether you believe it or not. Your entire life is a result of what your thoughts and feelings have attracted into it. "Whether you think you can or you can't - either way you are right." Henry Ford

1. Using physics jargon to set a mood doesn't prove anything. "Made up of energy" is not a well-defined term, and I'm not sure what exactly it's supposed to mean. In physics, energy is a measurable property of matter. So are charge and mass (somewhat equivalent to energy) and spin and a handful of other measurables. The universe isn't "made up of" these measurables. More strictly, they are human constructs used to help us understand the dynamics of our world. The Universe, as a non-human entity, might not care about "energy" as such, but it's useful to use because of how we observe the system.

To say that there is some abstract quality called "energy" is a metaphysical conclusion. It can't be strictly proven or disproven. And to then say that all the Universe is constructed from this category makes another extra-logical assertion that must simply be taken on faith.

2. You don't know what "frequency" means.

3. This purportedly shows real world applications of "mind-hacking." There's nothing requiring a "universal energy." Further, there's no links to evidence, either that this is actually used (believable), or that it's clinically effective.

4. Again, real-world mind-hacking. The placebo effect and positive thinking are, according to all evidence, INTERNAL phenomena. They are ways that the mind can influence it's own body's functions. There, again, is no need for "universal energy" and there's actually evidence that positive thinking/prayer can't influence the healing/functioning of others, showing that any benefit from positive thinking is internal to the thinker.

5. "biggest factor in healing"? That's a pretty big claim. What are the measures for determining this "biggest factor?" Medicine can re-attach limbs, can use micro-radiation to combat cancer cells, and can even alter the chemistry of the brain through pharmaceuticals. Certainly these procedures are bigger factors in healing than "positive thinking" in many, if not an overwhelming super-majority, of cases of healing.

6. Appeal to authority/antiquity. Doesn't prove effectiveness or that there's anything beyond the mundane effects of positive thinking.

7. Does an arrow "attract" a target? Do you "attract" your workplace to your car? I agree with the Ford quote here, but again, that's due to an INTERNAL effect of attitude. If I'm not aiming my arrow at a target, I'm going to miss it when I shoot the arrow. Aiming and visualizing helps me, internally, do what is needed to hit the target, to not do those things that keep from hitting the target, and to focus on the task at hand. The target is not being "attracted" to my arrow the longer I visualize, it is an inanimate object. I am simply controlling my body in a very conscious way so that the actions that I take will produce the outcome that I want.

Ultimately it comes down to agency. You have to take the actions that will produce the outcomes that you want. And meditation, positive thinking, visualization, and meticulous planning are great tools to focus on a clear goal and deduce a realistic action plan. But you can't control those things that are outside your self. You might have the best plan, the most positive thinking, and the best visualization, but a bus crashes through your front window and you die or a contractor that you've counted on to build your new office skips town with your money or a bird flies through the path of your perfectly planned fast ball or a boulder falls on the expressway causing an hour back-up and making you miss a flight to an important business meeting, costing you a huge account and ruining your business.

There are an infinitude of things that can ruin the best laid plans, and positive thinking can't prevent those risks. All that planning and visualization can do is prepare you for contingencies, so that you, yourself, can avoid the more likely ones or make plans to work around them.

 

[Deborah K]

What science? Where?

Where is a link to a peer-reviewed longitudinal study showing that similarly situated individuals will fare better/worse depending on if they simply set out goals and make a plan, or if they do that while trying to manifest positive outcomes using "the energy of the Universe"?

I'm positive, if you took a little time you would discover a multitude of "peer reviewed" studies on the connection between health, healing, and the mind. Surely, you aren't denying that.

1. Using physics jargon to set a mood doesn't prove anything. "Made up of energy" is not a well-defined term, and I'm not sure what exactly it's supposed to mean. In physics, energy is a measurable property of matter. So are charge and mass (somewhat equivalent to energy) and spin and a handful of other measurables. The universe isn't "made up of" these measurables. More strictly, they are human constructs used to help us understand the dynamics of our world. The Universe, as a non-human entity, might not care about "energy" as such, but it's useful to use because of how we observe the system.

Do you deny that whether you look at the Universe, galaxies, solar systems, planets, living organisms, cell structure, etc., that they are made up of energy? I'm not a scientist, but I don't think that disqualifies me from discerning that mass-energy equivalence, which arose from Einstein's formula E=Mc2 indicates that substance is a measure of its energy content.

To say that there is some abstract quality called "energy" is a metaphysical conclusion. It can't be strictly proven or disproven. And to then say that all the Universe is constructed from this category makes another extra-logical assertion that must simply be taken on faith.

Again, Einstein's formula of relativity says differently. I can find nothing from Einstein where he claims "some abstract quality called "energy" is a metaphysical conclusion".

2. You don't know what "frequency" means.

Here's how I am applying it: Physics. a. the number of periods or regularly occurring events of any given kind in unit of time, usually in one second. b. the number of cycles or completed alternations per unit time of a wave or oscillation.

Do you deny that thoughts (which are basically brain activity) can be measured?

3. This purportedly shows real world applications of "mind-hacking." There's nothing requiring a "universal energy." Further, there's no links to evidence, either that this is actually used (believable), or that it's clinically effective.

4. Again, real-world mind-hacking. The placebo effect and positive thinking are, according to all evidence, INTERNAL phenomena. They are ways that the mind can influence it's own body's functions. There, again, is no need for "universal energy" and there's actually evidence that positive thinking/prayer can't influence the healing/functioning of others, showing that any benefit from positive thinking is internal to the thinker.

The objective was to show that the mind can't tell the difference between a real situation happening and visualizing it. You're misapplying the concept of universal energy. They are two different issues that become related when applying the law of attraction.

5. "biggest factor in healing"? That's a pretty big claim. What are the measures for determining this "biggest factor?" Medicine can re-attach limbs, can use micro-radiation to combat cancer cells, and can even alter the chemistry of the brain through pharmaceuticals. Certainly these procedures are bigger factors in healing than "positive thinking" in many, if not an overwhelming super-majority, of cases of healing.

You're making an equally "big claim".

6. Appeal to authority/antiquity. Doesn't prove effectiveness or that there's anything beyond the mundane effects of positive thinking.

I never claimed it did. I only proved that "authority/antiquity" used and believed in the concept as well. Indisputable.

7. Does an arrow "attract" a target? Do you "attract" your workplace to your car? I agree with the Ford quote here, but again, that's due to an INTERNAL effect of attitude. If I'm not aiming my arrow at a target, I'm going to miss it when I shoot the arrow. Aiming and visualizing helps me, internally, do what is needed to hit the target, to not do those things that keep from hitting the target, and to focus on the task at hand. The target is not being "attracted" to my arrow the longer I visualize, it is an inanimate object. I am simply controlling my body in a very conscious way so that the actions that I take will produce the outcome that I want.

Ultimately it comes down to agency. You have to take the actions that will produce the outcomes that you want. And meditation, positive thinking, visualization, and meticulous planning are great tools to focus on a clear goal and deduce a realistic action plan. But you can't control those things that are outside your self. You might have the best plan, the most positive thinking, and the best visualization, but a bus crashes through your front window and you die or a contractor that you've counted on to build your new office skips town with your money or a bird flies through the path of your perfectly planned fast ball or a boulder falls on the expressway causing an hour back-up and making you miss a flight to an important business meeting, costing you a huge account and ruining your business.

There are an infinitude of things that can ruin the best laid plans, and positive thinking can't prevent those risks. All that planning and visualization can do is prepare you for contingencies, so that you, yourself, can avoid the more likely ones or make plans to work around them

You're entitled to your opinion, but the LofA has been applied, and spoken of for thousands of years. You don't have to believe it. Your life is the result of it just the same.

 

[Deborah K]

Whoever rated my thread as bad probably has a shitty life! ROFL!

 

[CaptUSA]

To say that there is some abstract quality called "energy" is a metaphysical conclusion. It can't be strictly proven or disproven.

Not true. Unless you don't agree with Isaac Newton. He proved that mass cannot move without a force acting upon it. Objects at rest, and all. Even Nikola Tesla tried to measure the amount of energy that existed in a man, but was unable to measure it because the energy level can change. Even given the same exact food, two men can have quite different energy. You know even your own metabolism changes over time... What's to say it doesn't also change based upon your mood? And if changing your mood draws more energy to you, doesn't that give you pause to think that there maybe something to this? Even if it doesn't work for you, wouldn't it be nice to feel good for awhile?

You'd be amazed how good you feel after feeling good for awhile. And when you feel good, you start making wiser decisions. Napoleon Hill took it to the next level by giving specific directions to make it work for you, but the "Secret" certainly gives you a glimpse.

And yes, Napoleon Hill also believed that the universe would mold to fit you. It meant more than just "Do the right things and you'll be lucky". Remember, Hill's was a scientific expedition commissioned by one of the richest men to have ever existed. (And he was rich in more ways than just money.) When Hill began to understand it, he was amazed.

 

[green73]

I don't know if many remember but for the longest time Josh had this video posted at the bottom of the site. Mind you, it's about this topic and from 1950!



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62DqsD2s5V8

 

[Deborah K]

I don't know if many remember but for the longest time Josh had this video posted at the bottom of the site. Mind you, it's about this topic and from 1950!



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62DqsD2s5V8

Yep, I remember this. It's awesome. And it's probably more the speed people around here would accept. I think maybe 'The Secret' comes off a little hokey to many of the no-nonsense, naturally suspicious-of-everything types. Same message though.

 

[green73]

Yep, I remember this. It's awesome. And it's probably more the speed people around here would accept. I think maybe 'The Secret' comes off a little hokey to many of the no-nonsense, naturally suspicious-of-everything types. Same message though.

I think it's great too. I especially like the references to the bible. Somebody above complained 'the secret' doesn't tell you how to put it into action. Well this video definitely does!

 

[jllundqu]

I take issue with people trying to use it for monetary gain. I'm all about thinking positive, but 'wishing' to be rich is kinda missing the point. Just be a positive thinker and follow your dreams... that simple.

 

[green73]

I take issue with people trying to use it for monetary gain. I'm all about thinking positive, but 'wishing' to be rich is kinda missing the point. Just be a positive thinker and follow your dreams... that simple.

I think rather than "wishing" to be rich, you need to feel like you all ready are. At the very least not let financial worries overwhelm your psyche.

 

[Deborah K]

I take issue with people trying to use it for monetary gain. I'm all about thinking positive, but 'wishing' to be rich is kinda missing the point.

Why? What's wrong with using it for monetary gain? As long as you don't have an attitude of : "I'll be happy once I'm rich." That goes against the whole purpose. In the film they talk about how important it is to always attempt to keep yourself in the frame of mind of feeling good and being grateful.

People often think, 'well, when I get that big promotion - or - when I lose those 30 lbs - or - when I get married, etc., etc., - THEN I'll be happy'. This film and other films and books attempt to explain that you shouldn't wait for things to happen before you allow yourself to be happy - get into the habit of putting yourself in that frame of mind WHILE you are intending for certain things to happen. In other words: Be happy NOW.

Just be a positive thinker and follow your dreams... that simple

Yep. But easier said than done for most people, because they unintentionally attract bad shit into their lives by focusing on what they DON'T want to happen. And they don't fulfill their dreams because they concern themselves too much with HOW their wish is going to manifest.

 

[dannno]

2. You don't know what "frequency" means.

I'm pretty sure she does, actually. Don't you know that certain frequencies resonate and can affect other frequencies and energies?

All science says is that this is POSSIBLE for our thoughts to affect outcomes because our thoughts are made of energy, everything is made up of energy and waves that vibrate and resonate with other frequencies. To deny and say that it isn't true because science says so when science does in fact give the possibility and doesn't answer the question definitively either way is not a very responsible answer.

Someone saying it definitely works may be reasonable in their view if they understand the science and/or have seen enough anecdotal evidence in their own life, then they act as a conduit to communicate their views and if others see enough happening then they can begin to judge how it works in their own life. It might not be proof, but if you are looking for proof about how life works you are going to be very limited in your idea of how life could work because we really don't know much for sure.

 

[osan]

My sister got into this and it nearly ruined her life. I'd caution anyone against such new-age practices.

Care to elaborate?

 

[dannno]

Elliot Rogers, the virgin shooter who went after blond women read this book and some other related books and was really into it.

He went as far as to make 10 hour+ drives to a different state to purchase thousands of dollars of high jackpot lottery tickets...so he could get laid....when he lived in an apartment in a small town with literally thousands and thousands of beautiful girls his age all around him who are generally fairly generous with their sexuality..

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...-to-UCSB-Virgin-Shoots-Up-Sexually-Attractive

 

[Deborah K]

Read what book, Danno?