Spanking

[pinkmandy]

I decided I would try a much different approach. I wanted my children to make their own choices about things and suffer the consequences or reap the rewards. I wanted them to know the truth and not be afraid to tell me when they were in trouble. All my kids knew they would be in serious trouble with me if they lied and I found out about it.

They made mistakes and so did I and I am sure I will again and they will too. At my house we all own what we do and don't blame someone else.

I have seen somethings that have shaped my views. I do swim against the tide of what society thinks I am a rebel in every since of the word. I got kicked out of Sunday school when I was 3 for confessing that I procrastinated. I still do Nothing would really surprise me.....

Ditto that. I was six when I was kicked out of Sunday School, though. I was asking questions that apparently shouldn't have been asked.

 

[asimplegirl]

I like your story, but if you're using it to make the case for spanking in particular, I think you're missing part of the bigger picture: Those kids in the restaurant were not bratty because they weren't spanked. They were bratty because their parents completely tolerated the bratty behavior, as if there was nothing wrong with it. Their parents could have used your advice not to think their kids are perfect...they were definitely in need of discipline that night, and their parents honestly should have nipped it in the bud much earlier than that night...but did they need to use spankings in particular? Not necessarily. I've seen lots of kids who act like that, and the common thread is that their parents simply shrug it off and let it pass, and they don't address the behavior with any level of seriousness.

I like how you mentioned that some kids have an iron will and a rebellious streak and might need spankings, too...but coming from my own experience of having been one of those kids: When your kids do show an iron will, it's worthwhile to assess whether they might actually be in the right in the first place. If they are in fact on the right side of the confrontation, it would be wrong to force them into submission simply because you're bigger than they are and you can. It's probably very unlikely for a six-year-old to be in the right, but...as kids grow up, it might become more common.

Now, the "Do not speak unless you are spoken to" and "Children are meant to be seen, not heard" rules, on the other hand...I've always considered those ones to be pretty fascist, because they're predicated on the assumption that children not only have nothing worthwhile or interesting to say, but that they're literally less important than adults and unworthy of interaction. In general, adults who have that particular rule are selfishly using their authority as parents to subjugate their kids, just because it suits them. "Might makes right," I guess. If the point is just to keep kids from being boisterous, a better rule might be, "Do not be loud and inconsiderate, do not whine, etc.."

I will say that agree with all that you said- I do. I agree that there are other ways of disciplining... and I never made an argument FOR spanking, but DID make an argument that people come from all ways of life, and can still turn out good kids. I also was trying to point out that some of us don't notice things that others do...and that people just DO NOT see their own kids as wrong alot of the time- that was it.

I didn't like the only speak when spoken to thing, either, that was only to point out that though those things were said about my cousins, who were not spanked, they were also said about us, who were...it was merely a matter of commentator's opinion.

I also agree about maybe hearing them out when they have an "iron will", and have said that I allow the punk to defend himself, or I should say dh does. He can explain exactly what he sees wrong with the situation, he can tell us why if he disagrees, or he can just explain if things didn't happen as we thought... we have no qualms about that, but if we still see what he did as wrong, he WILL get punished for it... and as for those kids that cannot be reasoned with, we have got one... I could give you examples.... he is mature enough for many things, but he is not mature enough to reason, we have tried. When there are things to say, though, he can say them and HOW he wishes, we want to know EXACTLY how he feels. We never want to guess, and we have a big open door policy. He actually has a rule that if he does something he knows we will not agree with, if he sits with us beforehand, and tells us, and explains his actions, he usually will just get talked to a bit, and we will discuss it. I believe moderation is the key pretty much everything.. I will not only spank, but I also will not only reason.

The thing is, I just wanted to point out that judging what people do that are different than you...that is also a view point we pass onto our children.

 

[asimplegirl]

While you may believe children are unaware I have never thought that of my children or anyone else's for that matter. I don't believe I could have hidden anything from them if I wanted to. They called me out on my stuff too and we laughed my issues away.

I did get whipped fort not believing in Santa Claus and not wanting anything and my mom believed I was trying to make her crazy. My mom was very violent but that is the way she was raised. Later in life she apologized to me. She is my mom and I do love her. You know what I am glad too that I was raised the way I was raised because as hard headed as I am I may have pushed against being treated gently. I don't know...

I decided I would try a much different approach. I wanted my children to make their own choices about things and suffer the consequences or reap the rewards. I wanted them to know the truth and not be afraid to tell me when they were in trouble. All my kids knew they would be in serious trouble with me if they lied and I found out about it.

They made mistakes and so did I and I am sure I will again and they will too. At my house we all own what we do and don't blame someone else.

I actually stated that I do not think children are unaware... and I do not believe in hiding ANYTHING from them. I do not hide anything and neither does dh.. he actually probably knows more than he should because of this.

I agree that your parents did wrong with what they spanked you for.. but that is not the issue..we aren't speaking of spanking for nothing..we are talking about spanking when needed...not for having an opinion.

As I said before, other than this, we agree...

I also think some people over-use spankings.
I also think that we should try and reason when we can.
I also believe that sometimes children can be lead without any physical "punishment".
I also believe that there should be an open door to discuss things, and that parents should not be untouchable.


And, whether you believe it or not, I too, parent the way I do so that I am not like my parents.

 

[Working Poor]

so why are you so on the defensive? ((((asimplegirl)))))...


I am no doubt much older than you all of my kids are grown. I like to discuss things. I feel I have put off communicating with others for a very long time.

I don't think you have to agree with me or be defensive.
Discussing things on line is different than being face to face. We can't see one another's expression or body language so we must learn to take everything with a grain of salt.

 

[Mini-Me]

I will say that agree with all that you said- I do. I agree that there are other ways of disciplining... and I never made an argument FOR spanking, but DID make an argument that people come from all ways of life, and can still turn out good kids. I also was trying to point out that some of us don't notice things that others do...and that people just DO NOT see their own kids as wrong alot of the time- that was it.

I didn't like the only speak when spoken to thing, either, that was only to point out that though those things were said about my cousins, who were not spanked, they were also said about us, who were...it was merely a matter of commentator's opinion.

I also agree about maybe hearing them out when they have an "iron will", and have said that I allow the punk to defend himself, or I should say dh does. He can explain exactly what he sees wrong with the situation, he can tell us why if he disagrees, or he can just explain if things didn't happen as we thought... we have no qualms about that, but if we still see what he did as wrong, he WILL get punished for it... and as for those kids that cannot be reasoned with, we have got one... I could give you examples.... he is mature enough for many things, but he is not mature enough to reason, we have tried. When there are things to say, though, he can say them and HOW he wishes, we want to know EXACTLY how he feels. We never want to guess, and we have a big open door policy. He actually has a rule that if he does something he knows we will not agree with, if he sits with us beforehand, and tells us, and explains his actions, he usually will just get talked to a bit, and we will discuss it. I believe moderation is the key pretty much everything.. I will not only spank, but I also will not only reason.

The thing is, I just wanted to point out that judging what people do that are different than you...that is also a view point we pass onto our children.

Don't worry, I wasn't criticizing you (even if it sounded like it). I just wanted to share my thoughts on what you said.

 

[asimplegirl]

oh, I don't think anyone has criticized me, or that I am being defensive...

I just simply feel strongly about this... and from your posts, Working Poor, it did feel for awhile that you were being very judgmental and felt as if those that spanked their children were somehow disdain to you.... I never once felt mad or like I had to defend myself merely explain... actually dh asked me wth I was laughing about. If anything your posts gave me one heck of a laugh.

sorry..does that answer both posts?lol

This is what happens when there are no real people, save you SO to speak to. Too much time and too many ways to talk to people who don't know you and may take what you say differently than you mean.

 

[Working Poor]

Being a foster parent and knowing what some of these children have been thru I am very concerned for children who get punished often times for just being a child.

There a great need for foster parents. If you love kids and feel you could handle getting attached and them leaving I urge you to do so. Also, there are many children who could be adopted. There are foster children who are very disturbed but the majority of them just need stability and love and understanding. There are many children who's parents are in prison for drug offenses and were not abused or neglected and the parents are very appreciative of knowing their child is safe and being well cared for.

When your heart and mind is open love can take over and nothing is better than love.

 

[asimplegirl]

this was almost my point exactly....tangents that have nothing to do with spankings..

If this did in your opinion relate to spankings, let me tell ya...the worst a child in home has been through is not getting a toy he wanted just out of the blue.

Also, mini me, I hope you didn't think I was offended or trying to offend you.. never was.

 

[Mini-Me]

this was almost my point exactly....tangents that have nothing to do with spankings..

If this did in your opinion relate to spankings, let me tell ya...the worst a child in home has been through is not getting a toy he wanted just out of the blue.

Also, mini me, I hope you didn't think I was offended or trying to offend you.. never was.

Not at all!