Social Security is not “Insurance”

[erowe1]

SSi is not an entitlement program.

I have been paying into the program for over 30 years.

When I retire, I damn well better get that investment back.

What you paid all those years was paid out to the people who were receiving SS at that time. And what you receive when you retire (assuming you live to see it) will be paid by future taxpayers. It's welfare.

But you're right. It's not an entitlement. Nobody is entitled to other peoples' money.

 

[AxisMundi]

How is thievery ever a good idea no matter how noble the intentions? I will be showing up at your house in a week, armed to the teeth, to confiscate (sorry, your 'social obligation'), your labor and money to give to another individual who I deem is 'needy'. Since people are unable to help these people by themselves (says I - the Government), I will demand this tribute in the name of the troubled, slice off half of it for myself and other petty bureaucrats, and then by my good natured self, give them what is left over of the tribute. After-all, I the Government and the socialist will decry everyone who is against State-Welfare to be against helping people! I presume that only the Government and the State can ever do anything, for I am the quintessential socialist du jour.

Welfare was never a good idea, and it didn't go bad, at least not for the State. It served its purpose. To grow the State, bring in more revenue, and make people dependant. You are mistaken if you even believe for a second that Welfare was ever supposed to help the troubled, seeing as the troubled were all ready being helped by individuals, mutual aid societies, and all sorts of voluntary charitable associations, as well documented here:

http://www.amazon.com/Mutual-Aid-We...8417/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1293748533&sr=8-1

PS: Social Security presumes that as individuals we are too stupid to take care of ourselves (If you believe the motif the Government sells you). Personally, the Government can fuck off.

You appear to mistake my stance on Welfare and indulge quite freely in counter-productive and juvenile insulting language.

You also apparently don't fully understand what socialism is either, and also freely indulge in neocon rhetoric.

 

[silverhandorder]

You appear to mistake my stance on Welfare and indulge quite freely in counter-productive and juvenile insulting language.

You also apparently don't fully understand what socialism is either, and also freely indulge in neocon rhetoric.

Troll more. What is your basis for calling him a neo con?

Your stance on welfare is simple you do not think it is morally revolting. Says enough about you.

 

[Brooklyn Red Leg]

You also apparently don't fully understand what socialism is either

Oh, I gotta hear this. Please, explain to us retard Austrian School people exactly what Socialism is and is not.

 

[silverhandorder]

Oh, I gotta hear this. Please, explain to us retard Austrian School people exactly what Socialism is and is not.

You see people like axis think that mixed economies are kosher.

 

[AxisMundi]

What you paid all those years was paid out to the people who were receiving SS at that time. And what you receive when you retire (assuming you live to see it) will be paid by future taxpayers. It's welfare.

But you're right. It's not an entitlement. Nobody is entitled to other peoples' money.

Yes, all the above is fully understood.

Did you have a point?

 

[silverhandorder]

Yes, all the above is fully understood.

Did you have a point?

For all its worth I support paying those back who paid into SS.

 

[AxisMundi]

Troll more. What is your basis for calling him a neo con?

Your stance on welfare is simple you do not think it is morally revolting. Says enough about you.

1. Feel free to show where I call the other poster a neocon.

2. I'm not so locked into a political ideology that it blinds me to simple facts. A rational welfare policy serves this Nation.

Today's style of welfare is hardly rational, however.

 

[AxisMundi]

Oh, I gotta hear this. Please, explain to us retard Austrian School people exactly what Socialism is and is not.

Which socialism? The neocon fear mongering version or the real world version?

You see people like axis think that mixed economies are kosher.

Yes, they are. The United States has always been a mixed economic model, that is what drove our Nation to it's former heights. Any well run Constitutional Republic has some level of socialism inherent within it's structure. The Constitution is filled with it.

Unfortunately, the Democratic Party leans too far towards socialism, and the Republican Party advocates Supply Side Economics, a failed economic theory based on another failed economic theory, the keynesian model.

 

[ARealConservative]

1. Feel free to show where I call the other poster a neocon.

what a mealy-mouthed reply.

you didn't call him a neocon, you simply accused him of using neocon talking points.

 

[AxisMundi]

Axis,

I can see you are still learning. So am I. But the difference is I can see these programs for what they are, and you still don't.

BTW, if these programs are good for the people, then why were they not instituted at the founding of our country?

I'll give you a hint, it has to do with the constitution.

At half a century of life, I am proud to state I am still learning. Even death is but a change in life's curriculum.

However, there were no provisions for a standing army at our inception either, and our Founding Fathers could hardly anticipate that electronic communications would be covered by the 4th Amendment either.

Such programs as SSi, welfare, and even unemployment insurance provide this Nation with important services vital to not only from a moral viewpoint, but an economic one as well. SSi assists our Elders during their latter years, the other programs keep people down on their luck spending.

Unfortunately, as with many other g'ment programs, these are abused heavily and need to be restructured to bring them back in line with their intended and proper original purposes.

 

[Brooklyn Red Leg]

Which socialism? The neocon fear mongering version or the real world version?

Answer the fucking question.

 

[AxisMundi]

No, it was not. Even if you don't accept AED's argument that its purpose was the expansion of the state, it was a naive and utopian idea at best. The fraud, abuse and long-term moral hazards SHOULD have been foreseen. It will be a "good" idea when people stop being people.

Absolutely agreed, except it's intentions where in the best interest of this Nation.

A homeless person does not contribute to the economy. They do not pay rent, buy groceries, clothing, shoes, etc.

Beef and Brogans, as I like to say, the foundation of Supply and Demand economics.

However it does indeed need a major overhaul, that I certainly agree with, and advocate as well. There is certainly no rhyme or reason to multiple generations of welfare recipients living in the same household.

 

[AxisMundi]

Answer the fucking question.

Let me know which question to answer.

 

[Brooklyn Red Leg]

Let me know which question to answer.

Teflon much, or did you go to professional troll school?

You said:

You also apparently don't fully understand what socialism is either

That implied YOU know what socialism is. So, oh great and powerful Oz, tell us poor shit covered peasants just what Socialism means to YOU.

 

[AxisMundi]

Teflon much, or did you go to professional troll school?

You said:

That implied YOU know what socialism is. So, oh great and powerful Oz, tell us poor shit covered peasants just what Socialism means to YOU.

Again, which socialism would you like me to explain, the neocon fear mongering version or the real kind of socialism?

 

[ARealConservative]

someone clearly doesn't know what the term neocon means

 

[AxisMundi]

someone clearly doesn't know what the term neocon means

Neoconservativism. Quick and dirty, someone who holds onto traditional religious/cultural ideals while taking a more leftist approach to economics, ie supporting a limited welfare State. Neocons are also much more willing to go to war to support geopolitical alliances and National policy enforcement.

 

[Brooklyn Red Leg]

Again, which socialism would you like me to explain, the neocon fear mongering version or the real kind of socialism?

Christ, you're going to give me ulcers. The fucking 'real' kind wiseass. I already know what the fucking neocon version is, thank you very much.

 

[AxisMundi]

Christ, you're going to give me ulcers. The fucking 'real' kind wiseass. I already know what the fucking neocon version is, thank you very much.

Obviously you know what the neocon fear mongering kind is, since you used their version of socialism in your post.

Quick and dirty as it pertains to this subject (socialism is a complicated system with many types addressing economic, political, and social concerns), "real socialism" is the collection and redistribution of a limited amount of the accumulated wealth of the US citizenry for the purposes of social programs/institutions crafted for the betterment of society. IE public schools, military, roads, etc.