So I just discovered this about Islam

[anaconda]

I guess the biggest one I have is that in Islam, killing vermin is of no sin or consequence, yet killing an infidel (read: a human being made in the image of God) promises great riches and rewards. Seem like humans are not only included in the list of living beings as 'acceptable kills', but in a sick and twisted way is in a category all by itself.

Christians have a long history of murdering the godless.

 

[Miss Annie]

Christians have a long history of murdering the godless.

History is not the present. We are talking about what is going on in the present.

 

[Muwahid]

I guess the biggest one I have is that in Islam, killing vermin is of no sin or consequence, yet killing an infidel (read: a human being made in the image of God) promises great riches and rewards. Seem like humans are not only included in the list of living beings as 'acceptable kills', but in a sick and twisted way is in a category all by itself.

We must look at Islamic doctrine through general principles first, before applying special cases and scenarios, in any case this verse sums up the concerns you may have:

5:32 من قتل نفسا بغير نفس او فسادفي الارض فكانما قتل الناس جميعا ومن احياها فكانما احيا الناس جميعا (Whoever kills someone not out of retaliation for murder, or against a transgressor* then it's as if he killed all of humanity, and anyone who saves a person, it's as if he saved all of humanity)

This is the general picture Islam gives regarding life and death of not only believers but 'an-naas jamee3an' all of humanity. I gave an asterisk to transgressor, because this means someone who is waging war in the land, an enemy to the people.

Another powerful hadith in my opinion is when a funeral procession was passing by the prophet Muhammad ص and he stood out of respect. His companions informed him that it was a jewish funeral, not a Muslim, and he rebuked them saying 'a-laysaa nafsan?', meaning, Is he not a human being?

The reward in jihaad comes from defending your family, land, religion, etc. There's great honor in standing against people who intend harm upon your people. And I believe the highest honor should go to those who died in the front lines defending their people. It needs to be put into perspective, there's nothing admirable about invading lands and oppressing people, but the true interpretation of Islamic jihaad is not about invading and oppressing.

 

[TER]

Christians have a long history of murdering the godless.

Christians have done this either due to spiritual delusion or for selfish gain (the two major reasons I believe Muslims kill the infidel) and decisively NOT because the revealed Father in Heaven has promised eternal riches and rewards for the murder of His children. That may be the lie they tell themselves, but the Suffering Servant and crucified Christ testifies against them.

 

[Miss Annie]

We must look at Islamic doctrine through general principles first, before applying special cases and scenarios, in any case this verse sums up the concerns you may have:

5:32 من قتل نفسا بغير نفس او فسادفي الارض فكانما قتل الناس جميعا ومن احياها فكانما احيا الناس جميعا (Whoever kills someone not out of retaliation for murder, or against a transgressor* then it's as if he killed all of humanity, and anyone who saves a person, it's as if he saved all of humanity)

This is the general picture Islam gives regarding life and death of not only believers but 'an-naas jamee3an' all of humanity. I gave an asterisk to transgressor, because this means someone who is waging war in the land, an enemy to the people.

Another powerful hadith in my opinion is when a funeral procession was passing by the prophet Muhammad ص and he stood out of respect. His companions informed him that it was a jewish funeral, not a Muslim, and he rebuked them saying 'a-laysaa nafsan?', meaning, Is he not a human being?

The reward in jihaad comes from defending your family, land, religion, etc. There's great honor in standing against people who intend harm upon your people. And I believe the highest honor should go to those who died in the front lines defending their people. It needs to be put into perspective, there's nothing admirable about invading lands and oppressing people, but the true interpretation of Islamic jihaad is not about invading and oppressing.

Jihad is to further the cause of Allah.
Also, under Sharia, a Christian must convert, pay Jizya, leave or die. It's really that simple.

 

[TER]

We must look at Islamic doctrine through general principles first, before applying special cases and scenarios, in any case this verse sums up the concerns you may have:

5:32 من قتل نفسا بغير نفس او فسادفي الارض فكانما قتل الناس جميعا ومن احياها فكانما احيا الناس جميعا (Whoever kills someone not out of retaliation for murder, or against a transgressor* then it's as if he killed all of humanity, and anyone who saves a person, it's as if he saved all of humanity)

This is the general picture Islam gives regarding life and death of not only believers but 'an-naas jamee3an' all of humanity. I gave an asterisk to transgressor, because this means someone who is waging war in the land, an enemy to the people.

Another powerful hadith in my opinion is when a funeral procession was passing by the prophet Muhammad ص and he stood out of respect. His companions informed him that it was a jewish funeral, not a Muslim, and he rebuked them saying 'a-laysaa nafsan?', meaning, Is he not a human being?

The reward in jihaad comes from defending your family, land, religion, etc. There's great honor in standing against people who intend harm upon your people. And I believe the highest honor should go to those who died in the front lines defending their people. It needs to be put into perspective, there's nothing admirable about invading lands and oppressing people, but the true interpretation of Islamic jihaad is not about invading and oppressing.

We will have to agree to disagree. You look at the beauty of the Islamic faith (of which I will not say it does not contain in parts), and your justifications of the evils of the Islamic faith stare straight into my human eyes and I see pure evil. To deny that one of Islam's main religious tenets is for world domination and the eradication of all other faiths even if by force is a denial from selective ignorance. All the nice parts of the Koran do not erase this major theme and the historical genocides done supposedly in the name of Allah. Are self-professed Christians innocent of such evil? No, but they cannot point to the Father revealed by Christ or the teachings of the Lord for justification for such conquest. Christ's commission was to go and baptize, not to threaten with a sword, terrorize through fear, and kill the infidel.

The charge of Christ to the Christian is to love and pray for those who persecute them, knowing love is only true and divine when in the Spirit of God. To live in Christ means to love as Christ loved, and where we stumble and are deficient, we pray for mercy and that God Who can do all things can give us the love which we lack, the mercy we keep hidden and the forgiveness we deny. And our love and our hope is not in subjugation and in tyranny of others, but in communion with God and through God all things within the eternal Kingdom of Heaven, not of this world but in the Age to come.

It is, as it will always be, much more difficult to be a Christian in a world which hates it and fights against it, and especially because of the moral code our Lord has commanded. "Turn the other cheek" "Do good to those who do evil to you". For even when it is not us but our fellow Christians who do evil, it is our commandment to rise up and denounce and protect those who suffer on account of them, regardless of the race or religion.

I accept your right to believe in the Islamic faith, please accept my right to deny it. If you can do this, then we can be friends. But please tell your like minded peaceful Muslims who focus on the good parts of the Koran and ignore the evil parts (IOW, the moderates) to be more vocal, demonstrate more disapproval as a unified voice, against the atrocities jihadists are doing in the name of Allah. Because although platitudes and statements make nice press pieces, the overwhelming silence is deafening and the passive consent does little to earn any love or respect for your religion or your Prophet.

Muwahid, I am leaving this as my last post to this thread.

 

[Kevin007]

We must look at Islamic doctrine through general principles first, before applying special cases and scenarios, in any case this verse sums up the concerns you may have:

5:32 من قتل نفسا بغير نفس او فسادفي الارض فكانما قتل الناس جميعا ومن احياها فكانما احيا الناس جميعا (Whoever kills someone not out of retaliation for murder, or against a transgressor* then it's as if he killed all of humanity, and anyone who saves a person, it's as if he saved all of humanity)

This is the general picture Islam gives regarding life and death of not only believers but 'an-naas jamee3an' all of humanity. I gave an asterisk to transgressor, because this means someone who is waging war in the land, an enemy to the people.

Another powerful hadith in my opinion is when a funeral procession was passing by the prophet Muhammad ص and he stood out of respect. His companions informed him that it was a jewish funeral, not a Muslim, and he rebuked them saying 'a-laysaa nafsan?', meaning, Is he not a human being?

The reward in jihaad comes from defending your family, land, religion, etc. There's great honor in standing against people who intend harm upon your people. And I believe the highest honor should go to those who died in the front lines defending their people. It needs to be put into perspective, there's nothing admirable about invading lands and oppressing people, but the true interpretation of Islamic jihaad is not about invading and oppressing.

Islam is a false religion based on the moon god. Muhammud made it up because he saw everyone else worship many gods.

 

[Kevin007]

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Pages/Myths-of-Islam.htm

I invite all non-muslims to research and this is an excellent website. Answeringislam.com also.

 

[Muwahid]

Islam is a false religion based on the moon god. Muhammud made it up because he saw everyone else worship many gods.

How did an illiterate man with no education (especially not in theology), create an entire religion, with detailed knowledge of past abrahamic prophets and messengers, how did he create a Qur'an in exquisite poetry which moved Arabs such as Umar ibn al Khattab (who was a lover of poetry), when Muhammad ص had no history of being a poet? How did he then convert the Quran into 6 different dialects for the different types of Arabs? Some companions having memorized several dialects of the Quran in their entirety?

These are questions non-believers must ask themselves.

There have yet to be any solid naturalistic explanations to how Islam itself was actually formed unless it had divine inspiration. And unlike previous religions there is historical basis for Islam, there are no gaps where historical records were non-existence (like the 100 years or so between Jesus and the gospels due to persecution of the Christians).

So the only option people who choose to remain non-believers have is, it's inspired supernaturally not by God, but by the Devil. Which is to me, a laughable assertion, since I don't see how the devil would advocate honoring your parents, giving in charity, freeing slaves, destroying the idols, fasting, sending prayers on previous prophets...

But wait, maybe the devil's inspiration was to stop people from believing in the trinity, right Kevin? To make people think Jesus was just a man when he is clearly God! But then why didn't Islam eliminate Christianity in Arabia? Why did it give special protection to Christians and Jews and preserve their ways of lives? Furthermore... it was mostly pagans who converted to Islam in the beginning, wasn't it? Arabia? The Zoroastrians of Persia? Sure there were Arab Christians in bilaadi shaam but again many remained Christian because Islam allowed it.

Just putting some ideas out there, but you don't even do the debating yourself Kevin you rely on copy and paste and posting links. I'm right here, an educated Muslim... you make a claim I have the answers, but you rather post links.

 

[Kevin007]

How did an illiterate man with no education (especially not in theology), create an entire religion, with detailed knowledge of past abrahamic prophets and messengers, how did he create a Qur'an in exquisite poetry which moved Arabs such as Umar ibn al Khattab (who was a lover of poetry), when Muhammad ص had no history of being a poet? How did he then convert the Quran into 6 different dialects for the different types of Arabs? Some companions having memorized several dialects of the Quran in their entirety?

These are questions non-believers must ask themselves.

There have yet to be any solid naturalistic explanations to how Islam itself was actually formed unless it had divine inspiration. And unlike previous religions there is historical basis for Islam, there are no gaps where historical records were non-existence (like the 100 years or so between Jesus and the gospels due to persecution of the Christians).

So the only option people who choose to remain non-believers have is, it's inspired supernaturally not by God, but by the Devil. Which is to me, a laughable assertion, since I don't see how the devil would advocate honoring your parents, giving in charity, freeing slaves, destroying the idols, fasting, sending prayers on previous prophets...

But wait, maybe the devil's inspiration was to stop people from believing in the trinity, right Kevin? To make people think Jesus was just a man when he is clearly God! But then why didn't Islam eliminate Christianity in Arabia? Why did it give special protection to Christians and Jews and preserve their ways of lives? Furthermore... it was mostly pagans who converted to Islam in the beginning, wasn't it? Arabia? The Zoroastrians of Persia? Sure there were Arab Christians in bilaadi shaam but again many remained Christian because Islam allowed it.

Just putting some ideas out there, but you don't even do the debating yourself Kevin you rely on copy and paste and posting links. I'm right here, an educated Muslim... you make a claim I have the answers, but you rather post links.

I have studied Islam for over 5 years. I have worked with many. My boss was one. I would look at the Koran with him. I live in a city with the biggest Muslim Population in the WORLD outside of the ME.

 

[Muwahid]

Jihad is to further the cause of Allah.
Also, under Sharia, a Christian must convert, pay Jizya, leave or die. It's really that simple.

The Muslims entered conquered lands and assured the people, they did not have to convert, but did impose the jizyah tax as income for the state to pay for the garrisons which protected the non-Muslims because the non-Muslims are exempt from defending the state from attacks.

The west has chosen to make jizyah hyperbolic. They are playing on the fact Muslims don't have to pay the jizyah while ignoring the Muslims have different civic duties meaning they don't pay that tax, but pay another on religious grounds.

Furthermore the jizyah is only applied to males, or military age. You, Miss Annie would pay nothing. This enforces the point it's not a discriminatory tax, its an exemption tax for military service.

Also jihaad is also to spread Islam, you're right. But within the parameters set by Islam. You cannot invade a sovereign nation unless they transgress upon you. Even then if you conquer this land you cannot force anyone to convert under the basis of laa ikraaha fid-deen (there is no compulsion in religion), therefore Islam cannot be spread by the sword. Islam is spread peacefully, those who convert do it if they are impressed by the goodness they find in it, they cannot be forced.

 

[Muwahid]

I have studied Islam for over 5 years. I have worked with many. My boss was one. I would look at the Koran with him. I live in a city with the biggest Muslim Population in the WORLD outside of the ME.

If you've studied Islam for five years, stop posting links and debate it yourself. I'm not here to sit and refute half of Ali Sina's ridiculous website, others have already done so.

 

[Kevin007]

I have studied Islam for over 5 years. I have worked with many. My boss was one. I would look at the Koran with him. I live in a city with the biggest Muslim Population in the WORLD outside of the ME.

https://www.raptureready.com/featured/chambers/jc87.html

 

[Kevin007]

If you've studied Islam for five years, stop posting links and debate it yourself. I'm not here to sit and refute half of Ali Sina's ridiculous website, others have already done so.

. Islam is a false religion, as all are except for Biblical NT Christianity. I'm off to bed. Maybe on my day off I will go over concerns one by one.

 

[Jamesiv1]

History is not the present. We are talking about what is going on in the present.

In the present, the most powerful Christian nation on Earth is dropping bombs on brown people all around the globe.

And then claiming they hate us for our freedoms.

 

[jmdrake]

In Islam, crow is one of the five animals for which there is no blame on the one who kills them


BOOOOOOOOO

It's a good thing then that crows are hard to kill.

 

[anaconda]

History is not the present. We are talking about what is going on in the present.

They say those that pay no heed to the past are doomed to repeat the mistakes of the past. Everything up to this moment will be immediately in the past. I see no evidence that Christians in general have the slightest justification for any moral authority.

 

[anaconda]

In the present, the most powerful Christian nation on Earth is dropping bombs on brown people all around the globe.

And then claiming they hate us for our freedoms.

Indeed, the biggest terrorist organization on the planet, the U.S. government, is elected by a constituency of about 80% Christians.

 

[TN_VOL]

Indeed, the biggest terrorist organization on the planet, the U.S. government, is elected by a constituency of about 80% Christians.

80% of this country may claim to Christian, but I seriously doubt half of them are "practicing" their faith or could repeat any other verse than John 3:16. Sometimes I think a lot of them see Jesus this way

 

[pcosmar]

History is not the present. We are talking about what is going on in the present.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...kwater-boss-accused-crusade-wipe-Muslims.html
https://aftermathnews.wordpress.com...ts-templars-on-a-crusade-to-wipe-out-muslims/