SCOTUS legalizes Gay Marriage - 10th Amendment Obliterated

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What a slap in the face to traditional Christians. I do not see how they expect to hold the country together when they have been effectively as of late running around spraying gasoline while holding a match.

Wonder how that's going to play with the black church crowd that voted for Obama. Most of them are very anti gay marriage.
 
So long as people have to go begging governments for permission to marry, there will be discrimination. It is inevitable and axiomatic. The ONLY solution is to ban the licensure of marriage altogether.

Yep. Licensure to marry is a carry over from British law.
 
Wonder how that's going to play with the black church crowd that voted for Obama. Most of them are very anti gay marriage.

Obama supported legalizing same-sex marriage when he first ran for the Illinois and it did not stop him. I suspect that if Satan was a black man running as a Democrat, 90% of the black church crowd would still vote for him.
 
Except I claim no such thing.

Perhaps you should go back and look up the definition of "non sequitur" again, because that is the term YOU used.

Except I claimed no such thing.

You claim that you did not accuse me of racial bigotry, by likening me to those who opposed Brown v Board. LOL okay. :rolleyes:

My point was that your hysterical predictions of "federal hate speech laws requiring the States to punish people for unpopular opinions, and the advent of true thoughtcrime laws" is just as hysterically silly as the predictions of the segregationists. In no way did I suggest you shared their views regarding race.

As long as the Court is willing to protect the loathsome speech of cretins like the members of the Westboro Baptist Church (see Snyder v. Phelps, 562 U.S. ___ (2011)), you have little to worry about the institution of thought crime laws.

I would say "good luck with that," but you will obviously be on the side of the oppressors, and will therefore have no need for luck.
 
Fine. You aren't a libertarian. Just admit it and move on:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?477390-The-License


If you've read any of my other posts in this thread you'll see that I would prefer no license. If that is not possible, then licenses should be as equitable as possible. Too often in this forum people have argued that gay marriage licenses should not be granted because that is a step towards more licenses rather than less. I wholeheartedly disagree with that argument.


Again, what effect does a gay marriage license have upon you?
 
Then you're not a statist or hypocrite, unlike many in this thread who desire to have the government enforce their beliefs upon others.

There seems to be fewer such people every day. Most folks, eventually, do encounter a Ring of Power that they actually want.
 
If you've read any of my other posts in this thread you'll see that I would prefer no license. If that is not possible, then licenses should be as equitable as possible. Too often in this forum people have argued that gay marriage licenses should not be granted because that is a step towards more licenses rather than less. I wholeheartedly disagree with that argument.


Again, what effect does a gay marriage license have upon you?

Marriage licensure has had an effect on all of us, because licensure is used to track free people and coerce them through confiscation. As a practical statist, you accept this.

Then also, you say want your state-given "rights" to be equal for everyone, but in reality you don't really mean that, because the law just created several new groups that it is discriminating against.

Statism is dark, dark thing. Most people never unlearn it.
 
Marriage licensure has had an effect on all of us, because licensure is used to track free people and coerce them through confiscation. As a practical statist, you accept this.

Then also, you say want your state-given "rights" to be equal for everyone, but in reality you don't really mean that, because the law just created several new groups that it is discriminating against.

Statism is dark, dark thing. Most people never unlearn it.


You have an astounding ability to respond to posts without reading them.
 

Let me just focus on the issue of marriage licenses. The article you referred to stated,

How about a marriage license? That's something everybody really needs. How many times has a business asked you to show them your marriage license? What is this? Of course, in legal disputes it serves as a record of marriage, an implied contract, but what's to keep couples from making explicit contracts that could be used in private arbitration of disputes? It wouldn't be romantic, I suppose, but then waiting in line at the county clerk's desk isn't terribly romantic either. Neither is divorce court.

Yes, couples could make explicit contracts and have divorce conducted through private arbitration. But what if it's something other than divorce? Suppose a couple enters into a marriage contract but neglects to specify where their respective property goes if one of them dies? You may think this is highly unlikely, but you'd be surprised at how many people die without a will (many don't want to think about their own mortality, so they keep putting off writing a will).

So we have a situation where someone's dead and there are various claimants to his or her property. In your ideal anarchic society, how is the ownership of the property to be determined? It's no answer to say that the couple could or should have included testamentary provisions in their contract -- the fact is, they didn't. So who gets the property?

In the real world every state has intestacy laws that provide who takes the property -- usually the surviving spouse and children. But presumably you don't want government to be involved in such things. So who decides what happens to the property? Do the claimants battle it out in an Iron Cage Match (think 50's and 60's TV wrestling)?*

What I'm suggesting is that in certain circumstances it will be necessary for some rule to be applied by the government to determine such matters, and if the rule is going to say that the "surviving spouse" gets the property it'll be necessary to have some way of determining just who that is. If your answer is that the couple can simply file a copy of their contract with the government, how does that really differ from a marriage license? In other words, if the government will recognize someone as a "spouse" only if a copy of a contract is filed, is this any different than saying that the government will recognize someone as a "spouse" only if a marriage license has been issued?


* In all seriousness, in a purely anarchic society who gets an intestate's property?
 
Perhaps you should go back and look up the definition of "non sequitur" again, because that is the term YOU used.

Suggesting as you did that agreement with yesterday's gay marriage decision means that one doesn't care about police rape is not only a non sequitur, it's incredibly stupid.
 
Let me just focus on the issue of marriage licenses. The article you referred to stated,



Yes, couples could make explicit contracts and have divorce conducted through private arbitration. But what if it's something other than divorce? Suppose a couple enters into a marriage contract but neglects to specify where their respective property goes if one of them dies? You may think this is highly unlikely, but you'd be surprised at how many people die without a will (many don't want to think about their own mortality, so they keep putting off writing a will).

So we have a situation where someone's dead and there are various claimants to his or her property. In your ideal anarchic society, how is the ownership of the property to be determined? It's no answer to say that the couple could or should have included testamentary provisions in their contract -- the fact is, they didn't. So who gets the property?

In the real world every state has intestacy laws that provide who takes the property -- usually the surviving spouse and children. But presumably you don't want government to be involved in such things. So who decides what happens to the property? Do the claimants battle it out in an Iron Cage Match (think 50's and 60's TV wrestling)?*

What I'm suggesting is that in certain circumstances it will be necessary for some rule to be applied by the government to determine such matters, and if the rule is going to say that the "surviving spouse" gets the property it'll be necessary to have some way of determining just who that is. If your answer is that the couple can simply file a copy of their contract with the government, how does that really differ from a marriage license? In other words, if the government will recognize someone as a "spouse" only if a copy of a contract is filed, is this any different than saying that the government will recognize someone as a "spouse" only if a marriage license has been issued?


* In all seriousness, in a purely anarchic society who gets an intestate's property?


It's funny you talk about property, because marriage contracts make you and your children the state's property:

“When you repeat your marriage vows, you enter into a legal contract. There are three parties to that legal contract: 1) you; 2) your spouse; and 3) the state of Ohio. The state is a party to the contract because under its laws, you have certain obligations and responsibilities to each other, to any children you may have, and to Ohio.”

SOURCE: http://www.ohiobar.org/pub/lawfacts/index.asp?articleid=14

Read this:

In 1993, parents were upset here in Wisconsin because a test was being administered to their children in the government schools which was very invasive of the family’s privacy. When parents complained, they were shocked by the school bureaucrats who informed them that their children were required to take the test by law and that they would have to take the test because they (the government school) had jurisdiction over their children. When parents asked the bureaucrats what gave them jurisdiction, the bureaucrats answered, "Your marriage license and their birth certificates." Judicially, and in increasing fashion, practically, your state marriage license has far-reaching implications.
 
Marriage is a big deal, as some people will discover. It's a messy, costly experience.
 
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Suggesting as you did that agreement with yesterday's gay marriage decision means that one doesn't care about police rape is not only a non sequitur, it's incredibly stupid.

Police violence follows from government overreach, therefore supporting government overreach is tantamount to supporting police violence. The more you continue to support government overreach, I will continue to point out the real-world consequences of the policies you support, like cops shoving their hands up your wazoo on the side of a busy interstate. You can claim that police violence does not follow from overreaches of government power until your fingers turn blue and your keyboard crumbles into dust. Your claims will not make it so.
 
It's funny you talk about property, because marriage contracts make you and your children the state's property

Bilge. The state will impose certain obligations on parents regardless of whether they're married, including supporting their children and refraining from beating the s**t out of them when they do something the parents don't like.

You didn't answer the question: in your ideal society who gets an intestate's property?
 
From other thread:

On a related note, one thing is interesting that currently there is not a single SCOTUS Judge representing Protestant Christians, the largest demographic in the US (about 50% of US population).

The table below shows the religious affiliation of each of the justices sitting as of 2014: [TABLE="class: cms_table_wikitable cms_table_sortable cms_table_jquery-tablesorter"]
[TR]
[TH="class: cms_table_headerSort"]Name[/TH]
[TH="class: cms_table_headerSort"]Religion[/TH]
[TH="class: cms_table_headerSort"]Appt. by[/TH]
[TH="class: cms_table_headerSort"]On the Court since[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]John Roberts (Chief Justice)[/TD]
[TD]Roman Catholic[/TD]
[TD]G.W. Bush[/TD]
[TD]2005[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Antonin Scalia[/TD]
[TD]Roman Catholic[/TD]
[TD]Reagan[/TD]
[TD]1986[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Anthony Kennedy[/TD]
[TD]Roman Catholic[/TD]
[TD]Reagan[/TD]
[TD]1988[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Clarence Thomas[/TD]
[TD]Roman Catholic[/TD]
[TD]G.H.W. Bush[/TD]
[TD]1991[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Ruth Bader Ginsburg[/TD]
[TD]Jewish[/TD]
[TD]Clinton[/TD]
[TD]1993[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Stephen Breyer[/TD]
[TD]Jewish[/TD]
[TD]Clinton[/TD]
[TD]1994[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Samuel Alito[/TD]
[TD]Roman Catholic[/TD]
[TD]G.W. Bush[/TD]
[TD]2006[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Sonia Sotomayor[/TD]
[TD]Roman Catholic[/TD]
[TD]Obama[/TD]
[TD]2009[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Elena Kagan[/TD]
[TD]Jewish[/TD]
[TD]Obama[/TD]
[TD]2010[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demogr..._United_States



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http://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/




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