Rand Paul's presence-and-jobs amnesty -- WITHOUT E-Verify

[Carson]

Rand Paul's presence-and-jobs amnesty -- WITHOUT E-Verify

By Roy Beck, Tuesday, March 19, 2013, 5:14 PM EDT

Whether or not you admire the bold individualistic leadership of Rand Paul (R-Ky.) on other issues, I know you will be disappointed and maybe even shocked by the immigration platform he outlined this morning before the Hispanic Chamber of Commerce.



KEY POINTS OF THE RAND PAUL AMNESTY

* The 11-19 million illegal aliens would get to live permanently in the United States.
* One year after passing the amnesty, illegal aliens can start getting work permits to compete directly in the legal job market with Americans.
* New illegal aliens who are enticed by the amnesty will continue to have a relatively open access to U.S. jobs because Sen. Paul opposes mandatory E-Verify and other means to keep employers from hiring illegal aliens.
* Sen. Paul will force American workers to compete with far more new legal immigrant workers in the future.

Nowhere in his long speech did Sen. Paul indicate any concern for the 20 million Americans who can't find a full-time job or for the taxpayers who have to support them in myriad ways while 26 million legal and illegal foreign-born workers hold U.S. jobs.

Instead, Sen. Paul emphasized the need for even more foreign workers as if there can never be a downside of too much immigration. He called for a:

. . . dialogue that shows that the GOP sees all immigrants as assets. . . . The Republican Party must embrace more legal immigration.

Nonetheless, Rand Paul outlined his amnesty with enough ambiguity to give some hope that Kentuckians can rescue him -- and the country -- from disastrous leadership on this issue.


Snip...

https://www.numbersusa.com/content/nusablog/beckr/march-19-2013/rand-pauls-presence-and-jobs-amnesty.html

 

[BAllen]

I don't understand why Libertarians support endless immigration policies, when other areas of the market are too restrictive to balance the equation of free market labor. The other side of the coin is, that if all were legalized, residents would take up arms and beat and kill immigrants to drive them out of this country. There would be nothing holding them back, since they would be competing for the same jobs as Americans. Right now, they mostly take under the table jobs.

 

[BAllen]

Another thing to consider. Why would he support unchecked immigration when these people do not vote for freedom candidates? They vote for the freebies offered by the Dems. That's like cutting your own throat.

 

[cheapseats]

Another thing to consider. Why would he support unchecked immigration when these people do not vote for freedom candidates? They vote for the freebies offered by the Dems. That's like cutting your own throat.

1.) To "broaden the tax base", rather than hike taxes on millionaires AND BILLIONAIRES.

2.) Cheap labor. Roll tape from QE1 days, to hear Helicopter Ben Bernanke stress the importance of reducing "PER UNIT LABOR COSTS."

 

[BAllen]

1.) To "broaden the tax base", rather than hike taxes on millionaires AND BILLIONAIRES.

2.) Cheap labor. Roll tape from QE1 days, to hear Helicopter Ben Bernanke stress the importance of reducing "PER UNIT LABOR COSTS."

Then why not simply eliminate the minimum wage?

 

[The Gold Standard]

I don't understand why Libertarians support endless immigration policies, when other areas of the market are too restrictive to balance the equation of free market labor. The other side of the coin is, that if all were legalized, residents would take up arms and beat and kill immigrants to drive them out of this country. There would be nothing holding them back, since they would be competing for the same jobs as Americans. Right now, they mostly take under the table jobs.

What Americans are competing with the illegals for their jobs? Do you know any unemployed Americans that would shovel cow shit for 12 hours a day?

 

[eating_nachos]

What Americans are competing with the illegals for their jobs? Do you know any unemployed Americans that would shovel cow shit for 12 hours a day?

This is such a fucking myth. The majority of illegals do not work in agriculture. Most illegals work in construction, manufacturing and in the service industries. All jobs that were once occupied by Americans. So the idea that Americans are all lazy and don't want to work these jobs and therefore we need illegals here is pure propaganda.

 

[NCGOPer_for_Paul]

This is not good.

 

[The Free Hornet]

Another thing to consider. Why would he support unchecked immigration when these people do not vote for freedom candidates?

"unchecked immigration"? That is your statist spin on the speech. People with my lily white skin and British ancestry do not vote for freedom candidates. It would have take a PATHETICALLY small percentage of the vote to get Ron Paul the nomination. That didn't happen because people who look like you and me are just as big of assholes as everyone else.

That's like cutting your own throat.

Get a clue. The Republicans offer a similar if not equal number of freebies. The recipient names may change, the graft does not.

 

[The Free Hornet]

This is such a fucking myth. The majority of illegals do not work in agriculture. Most illegals work in construction, manufacturing and in the service industries. All jobs that were once occupied by Americans [seriously? Do you even know what "American" means? Or "all"? Perhaps the Irish were more American than Mexicans in your twisted view.]. So the idea that Americans are all lazy and don't want to work these jobs and therefore we need illegals here is pure propaganda.

What is the evidence that we need you here? What would be the cost of forcing you to leave? Are you not as "illegal" with your 3 felonies a day like everyone else? It is time you cease the social re-engineering of peoples often native to the Americas or brought here against there will. A fence works both ways and it would be my preference if we could come and go freely without passports and begging governments to travel. You'd rather live in a cage.

 

[eating_nachos]

What is the evidence that we need you here? What would be the cost of forcing you to leave? Are you not as "illegal" with your 3 felonies a day like everyone else? It is time you cease the social re-engineering of peoples often native to the Americas or brought here against there will. A fence works both ways and it would be my preference if we could come and go freely without passports and begging governments to travel. You'd rather live in a cage.

Oh, I see you're a liberal. No point in arguing with you then.

 

[erowe1]

What do the people who oppose Rand on this really want?

Deporting people isn't an option. Regulating whom employers can and can't hire isn't an option. NumbersUSA wants to do both of those.

What's left?

 

[eating_nachos]

What do the people who oppose Rand on this really want?

Deporting people isn't an option. Regulating whom employers can and can't hire isn't an option. NumbersUSA wants to do both of those.

What's left?

Who said they're not options? You?

E-Verify is already being used in over a dozen states and is a part of Rubio's plan.

You take away the incentive to be here and they'll leave on their own.

 

[erowe1]

Who said they're not options? You?

E-Verify is already being used in over a dozen states and is a part of Rubio's plan.

You take away the incentive to be here and they'll leave on their own.

They're not options.

Do you have the right to make me tell you whomever I want to hire to work for me and get your permission? If so, where did you get that right. If not, then how can the government have it?

And really, if you're that much of a statist, I don't see why you wouldn't want more statist voters to elect the kind of despots you want ruling us.

 

[eating_nachos]

They're not options.

Do you have the right to make me tell you whomever I want to hire to work for me and get your permission? If so, where did you get that right. If not, then how can the government have it?

And really, if you're that much of a statist, I don't see why you wouldn't want more statist voters to elect the kind of despots you want ruling us.

If you're goal is to screw over American citizens then yes I do.

Like it or not we live in a nation state and the state has the right to protect it's sovereignty. If that means restricting the unscrupulous than so be it.

 

[FSP-Rebel]

The plan doesn't offer amnesty. It focuses on border security as a first priority and must be proven so by a federal agency a la DHS or ICE and then must be voted on in Congress every year for up to 5 years. It offers a permanent work visa program iirc yet allows those that do want to become citizens a window of opportunity to indicate such and then must get to the back of the bus behind all those currently undergoing the process. Those that fail to go through either of the aforementioned procedures are still illegal and liable for deportation if found. So, this raises more tax money from millions of under the table workers and demands border security up front instead of the wait and see approach that comes with the amnesty packages from Rubio and Bush. This forces the democrats' hands on security instead of giving them extra voters up front with no security in return. Kinda like allowing them to raise the debt limit with promises for cuts down the line that doesn't ever happen.

 

[erowe1]

If you're goal is to screw over American citizens then yes I do.

You do have the right to interfere with my hiring of someone to work for me if my "goal is to screw over American citizens"?

How do you go about determining that's my goal? And what other thought crimes do you think you have the right to punish?

Like it or not we live in a nation state and the state has the right to protect it's sovereignty. If that means restricting the unscrupulous than so be it.

The unscrupulous = anybody who supports anything like E-Verify.

 

[eating_nachos]

You do have the right to interfere with my hiring of someone to work for me if my "goal is to screw over American citizens"?

How do you go about determining that's my goal? And what other thought crimes do you think you have the right to punish?



The unscrupulous = anybody who supports anything like E-Verify.

You're not Socrates. So if you have a point to make, just make it.

 

[itshappening]

Why do you support a massive Federal database that could be used to deny people jobs?

It's also expensive.

 

[erowe1]

You're not Socrates. So if you have a point to make, just make it.

Obviously, you don't have that right.

If you really think you do, then you're the one with the explaining to do.