Rand Paul: Confederate flag is “inescapably a symbol of human bondage and slavery”

[Jamesiv1]

I agree with "wise men pick their battles"

Rand wants to be president, and I *want* him to be president.

We've got a lot bigger fish to fry. If going PC on this 'flag' issue helps avoid some land mines on the way to the White House, so be it.

Sometimes you got to surrender a few battles in order to win the war.

 

[Sola_Fide]

I agree with "wise men pick their battles"

Rand wants to be president, and I *want* him to be president.

We've got a lot bigger fish to fry. If going PC on this 'flag' issue helps avoid some land mines on the way to the White House, so be it.

Sometimes you got to surrender a few battles in order to win the war.

I agree.

 

[fisharmor]

I hate to see manufactured political pressures used to erase (and eventually rewrite, most likely) history though.

History has already been erased and rewritten: notice that even in this thread we had Vanguard101 parroting the state-sanctioned history.
There is one, and only one, correct interpretation of the events of US history, just like there is one, and only one, correct interpretation of the constitution, race relations, state power, and just about everything else that matters in our lives.

This move to take down the flag is about nothing more than cementing the one and only one interpretation.
The confederate battle flag may represent slavery in the minds of some. But to those to whom it does not represent slavery, it represents the last time anyone in North America meaningfully resisted the one and only one interpretation of everything.

This move to take down the flag is about driving a nail in the coffin of the idea that there is more than one interpretation.
I feel sorry for those who cannot see this.
I will not forget those who see it and applaud.

 

[Crashland]

The swastika is an ancient Sanskrit symbol meaning "good luck" yet no one defends it's use or tries to take it back like they do with the Confederate flag. Symbols despite what their defenders would have you belief, do not acquire meaning from the intent of the person using the symbol but rather from the inference of the people who see that symbol.

There is a legal right to freedom of expression question, but that only applies to individuals not to state governments. But there is the much more important issue of humanity. We should be condemning this shitty flag. Want a state's rights flag? Use the Gasdsen. It doesn't matter what you say the Confederate flag stands for; the fact that it immediately causes most people to think the bearer is racist gives it a clear meaning.

Rand is absolutely right to condemn this embarrassing symbol. Especially since he never suggested the federal government should force them to take it down.

Yes, and there is a difference between using a swastika in other forms as opposed to actually using the Nazi flag. If Hindus use a swastika symbol in some other form it's obvious from the context that they aren't using it to endorse Nazi Germany. If a German were to fly a Nazi flag above their house, that is a different story, and they should be shamed for doing it. Very few Germans would be caught dead doing that even if the flag gives them warm fuzzy feelings inside about their heritage, because they know what it means to other people and they wouldn't embarrass themselves the way some Americans do.

 

[jj-]

If a German were to fly a Nazi flag above their house, that is a different story, and they should be shamed for doing it. Very few Germans would be caught dead doing that even if the flag gives them warm fuzzy feelings inside about their heritage, because they know what it means to other people and they wouldn't embarrass themselves the way some Americans do.

How is the U.S. flag any less embarrassing than the confederate flag?

 

[fisharmor]

How is the U.S. flag any less embarrassing than the confederate flag?

It's perfectly ok that the US invades other countries and forces them to have the government the US wants.
I mean, this was settled in 1861-65 when the US invaded another country and forced them to have the government the US wanted.

 

[Sola_Fide]

How is the U.S. flag any less embarrassing than the confederate flag?

I don't like either flag, and I link them both to idolatry and state worship.

 

[whoisjohngalt]

I don't like either flag, and I link them both to idolatry and state worship.

Agreed, the Free State of Jones is the only side that got anything right during the War for Southern Independence.

 

[KingNothing]

Republicans should line-up in favor of removing the flag, because it doesn't matter at all, and in doing so they take one potential fund-raising and rally-point away from Democrats.

It's a freaking flag. Who cares? If dropping it prevents your opposition from raising additional money and inspiring additional voters, get rid of it.

 

[Ronin Truth]

It is also "inescapably a symbol of the right of secession, states rights, independence, standing up to northern states aggression and resistance to federal tyranny".

 

[fisharmor]

Republicans should line-up in favor of removing the flag, because it doesn't matter at all, and in doing so they take one potential fund-raising and rally-point away from Democrats.

It's a freaking flag. Who cares? If dropping it prevents your opposition from raising additional money and inspiring additional voters, get rid of it.

 

[jj-]

Republicans should line-up in favor of removing the flag, because it doesn't matter at all, and in doing so they take one potential fund-raising and rally-point away from Democrats.

It's a freaking flag. Who cares? If dropping it prevents your opposition from raising additional money and inspiring additional voters, get rid of it.

Why is it that the Republicans are the ones always changing their actions to "take one potential rally-point away", but it hardly ever happens the other way around?

Maybe allowing yourself to be pushed around so easily encourages them to push more?

 

[fisharmor]

Why is it that the Republicans are the ones always changing their actions to "take one potential rally-point away", but it hardly ever happens the other way around?

Maybe allowing yourself to be pushed around so easily encourages them to push more?

No, you're missing the point. Money and votes make YOU the bigshot, and then YOU get to push people around.
And if anyone doesn't like it, you just invade their country, kill 700,000 people, and burn their cities to the ground.

 

[jj-]

Money and votes make YOU the bigshot, and then YOU get to push people around.

Even with that goal, I'm not sure the means will work. Maybe even with giving up and stuff, reps won't be elected.

 

[LawnWake]

I would have preferred no comment on it and let it go.

Which would have given the media ample opportunity to put words in his mouth.

This was the right move. Especially with how the media painted him after having made thos remarks about the Civil Rights Act.

 

[nayjevin]

Maybe allowing yourself to be pushed around so easily encourages them to push more?

It's just a universal truth that fixation on power struggle is a short-term winner and a long-term loser.

 

[jj-]

It's just a universal truth that fixation on power struggle is a short-term winner and a long-term loser.

lol, gibberish

 

[jj-]

Seriously, I think today might be the day the Republicans lost the 16 Presidential Election by showing their base they are weak.

Unless an economic collapse occurs I guess.

 

[devil21]

History has already been erased and rewritten: notice that even in this thread we had Vanguard101 parroting the state-sanctioned history.
There is one, and only one, correct interpretation of the events of US history, just like there is one, and only one, correct interpretation of the constitution, race relations, state power, and just about everything else that matters in our lives.

This move to take down the flag is about nothing more than cementing the one and only one interpretation.
The confederate battle flag may represent slavery in the minds of some. But to those to whom it does not represent slavery, it represents the last time anyone in North America meaningfully resisted the one and only one interpretation of everything.

This move to take down the flag is about driving a nail in the coffin of the idea that there is more than one interpretation.
I feel sorry for those who cannot see this.
I will not forget those who see it and applaud.

There is still a percentage of people that understand what the flag represents and it is as you describe, so there hasn't been a complete re-write done yet.

Consider Gen. Robert E. Lee's response when asked to command BOTH the Union and the Confederacy but chose the Confederacy. That sort of spirit is what is being destroyed slowly but surely.

 

[Inkblots]

I think there should be a new flag that solely symbolizes states rights and peace amongst races with an effort to make it go viral. Then those bitching about the Confederate flag would not be able to use race as an issue in the dialog over states rights.

That's a pretty good idea, actually. Although you should make it be "states' powers" – only individuals have rights.