Rand issues 1/6/21 statement:

[Matt Collins]

From a press statement moments ago:

Dr. Rand Paul: ‘We Simply Cannot Destroy the Constitution, Our Laws, and the Electoral College in the Process’​

WASHINGTON, D.C. – The following is a speech U.S. Senator Rand Paul (R-KY) will be giving today from an undisclosed location:

“I wrote a speech today.

“I was planning to say I fear the chaos of establishing a precedent that Congress can overturn elections.

“Boy, was I right.

“Chaos. Anarchy. It’s wrong and un-American.

“The vote we are about to cast is important.

“Now more than ever.

“The question is:

“Should Congress override the certified results from the states and nullify the states’ right to conduct elections?

“The vote today is not a protest; the vote today is literally to overturn the election!

“Voting to overturn state-certified elections would be the opposite of what states’ rights Republicans have always advocated for.

“This would doom the electoral college forever.

“It was never intended by our founders that Congress have the power to overturn state-certified elections.

“My oath to the Constitution doesn’t allow me to disobey the law. I cannot vote to overturn the verdict of the states.

“Such a vote would be to overturn everything held dear by those of us who support the rights of states in this great system of federalism bequeathed to us by our founders.

“The electoral college was created to devolve the power of selecting presidential electors to the states.

“The electoral college is, without question, an inseparable friend to those who believe that every American across our vast country deserves to be heard.

“If Congress were given the power to overturn the states’ elections . . . what terrible chaos would ensue.

“Imagine the furor against the electoral college if Congress becomes a forum to overturn states’ electoral college slates.

“It is one thing to be angry. It is another to focus one’s anger in a constructive way. That hasn’t happened today, to say the least. We simply cannot destroy the Constitution, our laws, and the electoral college in the process. I hope as the nation’s anger cools, we can channel that energy into essential electoral reforms in every state.

“America is admired around the world for our free elections. We must, we absolutely must, fix this mess and restore confidence and integrity to our elections.”

 

[Invisible Man]

Come on Rand. Why did you have to tarnish Anarchy's good name by mentioning it there?

 

[familydog]

This is why Rand failed to take over his father's movement. This is why he is a failed presidential candidate. This is why he will forever be irrelevant in the grand scheme of American politics. A defender of liberty with no teeth. He is useful toady for the Establishment and he will remain that forever.

 

[Ender]

Come on Rand. Why did you have to tarnish Anarchy's good name by mentioning it there?

True.

But other than that- he's right on.

 

[CaptUSA]

I don't see anything wrong with that statement. I mean, he's right.

I guess he could have been stronger at laying the blame at the "mess" and the needed "electoral reforms" and lack of "integrity" of the process that created this anger. But he's correctly calling out Congress's role.

 

[Invisible Man]

This is why Rand failed to take over his father's movement. This is why he is a failed presidential candidate. This is why he will forever be irrelevant in the grand scheme of American politics. A defender of liberty with no teeth. He is useful toady for the Establishment and he will remain that forever.

What part of what he said (aside from throwing the word anarchy in there) do you think Ron wouldn't have said?

 

[familydog]

What part of what he said (aside from throwing the word anarchy in there) do you think Ron wouldn't have said?

Perhaps we will find out on the Liberty Report. We don't have to speculate.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

Perhaps we will find out on the Liberty Report. We don't have to speculate.

They agree with Massie.

Ron Paul weighs in. Go to 14:00 mark.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_vfbJ2KyW4

 

[familydog]

They agree with Massie.

Fair enough. Perhaps lack of fight is why his movement dried up and got replaced with what we see now.

 

[dannno]

//

 

[CaptUSA]

They agree with Massie.

Man, almost every time. He sees the world like I do.

 

[Matt Collins]

​

 

[Okie RP fan]

Can someone summarize what Rand is saying or has been playing at lately?

Is he parroting the ol' "we need to use the existing structures in place to make our changes?"

If so, nah. We're beyond that. One thing I learned this year, and I thank Michael Malice for this, is that the left doesn't play by rules and when we do, we automatically lose. Shoot, it goes beyond just the left. The entire American system is corrupt to the core. And he wants to get huffy puffy towards people who finally had enough and stormed a taxpayer funded building? Same question goes to others of you thinking that way.

It's time for conservatives, libertarians, and constitutionalists to get mean and angry. What is the alternative?

 

[Aratus]

From a press statement moments ago:

Hi Matt

 

[CultureCurage]

​

Leaders need to speak out about how to sort the problem. However, they seem all silent. What are they waiting for?

 

[SpiritOf1776_J4]

Can someone summarize what Rand is saying or has been playing at lately?

Is he parroting the ol' "we need to use the existing structures in place to make our changes?"

If so, nah. We're beyond that. One thing I learned this year, and I thank Michael Malice for this, is that the left doesn't play by rules and when we do, we automatically lose. Shoot, it goes beyond just the left. The entire American system is corrupt to the core. And he wants to get huffy puffy towards people who finally had enough and stormed a taxpayer funded building? Same question goes to others of you thinking that way.

It's time for conservatives, libertarians, and constitutionalists to get mean and angry. What is the alternative?

It's difficult to see how the American revolution ever started following such strict construction for sure.

Congress has a duty to see that these votes were submitted by the State legislature from electors they choose, and the candidates are valid, and are not a two year old i.e. who is ineligible for office (no, States can't submit anyone they choose, and Congress is responsible for checking that).

People are playing with words here, and possibly to deceive - which means it's malicious. No, States don't choose electors, in the constitution, only state legislatures do. These electors objected to were not chosen directly by the legislatures, or by their direction under law (an extension to the constitution that is thought to be valid, but doesn't have to be). While it may be true states are responsible for investigating their fraud, that isn't what is going on.

Instead, election officials broke the laws the state legislatures passed, made new ones, bypassed the legislative approval, even preventing them from meeting, and submitted electors on their own accord. Not state legislatures.

Congress can't rightfully accept any electors, only electors from the state legislature. Since these are not that, Congress should do the right thing and simply send it back to the state legislatures to get their approval.

Congress also can't rightfully accept any vote - even a state legislature can not submit a vote through their electors for a candidate not eligible to office. (Harris in this example isn't eligible). These are both things Congress is suppose to do.

What many people in congress are proposing to do right now is election fraud of the same type that we just had occur on the local scale. Not checking that the votes are VALID ballots (of legal candidates instead of legal voters - Harris isn't eligible), and that only legal electors are voting (electors not chosen under state legislature direction are not legal). So Congress wants to count every vote - legal and illegal, just like we just had occur on the individual sale. Total corruption, not even checking if state legislatures are ok with it by vote, or the vote is proposing to vote a legal vote (as opposed to a vote for mickey mouse). "If a state votes for mickey mouse, we must accept it - even though mickey mouse isn't eligible to office".

I have to guess that the only reason people would not conduct elections in Congress honestly is if they themselves were not honestly elected. What is coming out about black box voting (computerized), and who is running the companies that make them and how the elections are conducted, seems to make that a real possibility. Certainly it has extended beyond this years president's race. Black box voting is a hallmark of communist countries, to have show elections.

If Congress wants to do the right thing, and I hope and pray they do, they should write back to the legislatures in session, and get their ok (consent) to the electors, and they should research and verify the eligibility of candidates submitted as even being legal votes. I don't know if they are capable of doing the right thing, they just put everyone on a year lockdown, allowed churches to be shut down, allowed mass suppression of free speech --, etc.

This is not the first wrong thing Congress has thought of doing. It follows a very long list of illegal, illegitimate, and unconstitutional actions, with illegitimate elections being the last - after a whole year of a grab for power that has made ever person feel like they were living under a communist country. Because of that, that I don't want America under permanent lockdown, I pray that they aren't allowed to get away with not doing the right thing.

 

[fatjohn]

I don't see anything wrong with that statement. I mean, he's right.

I guess he could have been stronger at laying the blame at the "mess" and the needed "electoral reforms" and lack of "integrity" of the process that created this anger. But he's correctly calling out Congress's role.

He is right, but he has no bite.
He is a good senator to function in a political system with decent politicians.
But in this corrupt system of crooks he is to weak and gets run over whilst his opponents kick him in the ribs.

Fuck the system, fuck the constitution.
You had a good 250 year run.
Time to water the tree or let it burn down along with everything else.

 

[Okie RP fan]

Thanks for the response, spirit.


One thing that's happening now is there's another huge chunk of people who are now disenfranchised. The GOP could be seeing it's final days and the neocons and big gov GOPers are to blame, not Trump. But even so, what happens now? This very well could have been the entire goal and I can see China as maybe having a helping hand - the Dems (and yes much of the GOP, but the GOP isn't their wagon) are in the bag with China. This was all a well played coup against U.S. institutional systems. Basically, let's screw up the election so much to where a significant chunk of people lose confidence in it and completely bow out. That leaves the good morons/useful idiots ala the Democrats to continue to mop everything else up election after election.

The only recourse at this point is some form(s) of secession. There's no going back, there's no healing wounds (barring some supernatural event), what little trust was left is shattered for tens of millions of Americans - Trump supporters, some conservatives, and since 2012 for a lot of us - libertarians.

Playing by the rules gets us nothing but so many of us insist on still trying. Why?! It's a losing strategy and has been for decades now. So, what recourse is there at this point?

 

[hard@work]

So, what recourse is there at this point?

With social media merging with the state our options are thin. What we did well in 2007 on Youtube will never happen organically again. It will happen again under the control of their algorithms. If the corporate state controls all content and communications, in addition to a new suite of propaganda tools, what exactly can a heterodox political theory do to compete?

Personally, I think it's time for a divorce. A peaceful economic and intellectual separation. Libertarians love to talk about markets. Maybe it is time to create our very own. As we are moving into an era where machines are watching and acting then I think we need to start looking there.

 

[kfarnan]

It wasn't a vote to overturn the election. It was a check and balance to verify the validity of the legislatures choice. Why are we educating politicians?