POLITICO: Ron Paul aides ponder ‘frustrating’ race

[John F Kennedy III]

PFFTTT. Vote fraud, dude. That's all it is.

This. Period. If anyone wants to believe there hasn't been massive fraud that has cost us several states I ask you to kindly take your nutjob conspiracy theories somewhere else.

 

[John F Kennedy III]

With all the

Secret votes
Missing vans with ballots
Closed caucuses because of a slightly windy day
The powers that be saying "we will not let him win" or "if ron paul wins iowa...we just...take it out...take it out and look at the second"

Thats just a taste of it, there is so much fraud at every single state, you got newt having dead people vote for him, you have a guy on fox saying that the santorum and romney guys "came to an agreement on who won"

ALL of that and you guys STILL HAVE TO ASK?

I am a logical level headed guy, RP is being fucking CHEATED.

+rep for truth.

 

[John F Kennedy III]

I can't believe people are even falling for the idea that this is somehow the campaign's fault. We have mathematical proof of vote fraud now, and you people still want to play the blame game. We should all be united in deriding the establishment for stealing this election. This would be a runaway victory for Paul if the elections were fair and Paul were treated fairly by the media.

Owe +rep for truth

 

[Tyler_Durden]

Fraud so blatant it brings a tear to Putins eye....

 

[Lovecraftian4Paul]

Overwhelming, proven fraud, from the media to the GOP. The campaign hasn't been perfect, but it has been run pretty well. The enthusiasm is there.

I only fault the campaign slightly for refusing to aggressively call out the fraud and bias when it's so up front. It's as if they think people aren't ready to hear that we are living in an authoritarian hellhole.

 

[DerailingDaTrain]

People show up at the rallies to have their own talking points and beliefs shouted from a lectern. Makes 'em feel good about themselves...

Then they go home to watch Alex Jones clips, look up the latest conspiracy theories, and ignore the FACT that they have to get off their bums and vote. So many of Paul's supporters are all talk and no action. It's not Ron's fault that while the youth is ideologically "waking up", their physical bodies are lazy, and fast asleep.

I'm young and I'll be voting. My physical body isn't lazy and I'm wide awake. Asshat

 

[Maltheus]

Sounds like the campaign isn't going to stop targeting young people though.

Yeah, I don't get this. Pretending like they can just change the "young people" dynamic is delusional. And it wasn't just the voters. All the campaign staff in my state were fresh out of college and from out of state. They were nice people, but not very detail oriented and they never showed up either. When they did, they hurt us, more than they helped (other than bringing campaign materials). Enthusiasm is not what this campaign needs more of. Experienced people with connections are what help us the most.

All that being said though, and unlike in '08, I feel that it was more the grassroots that let the movement down, whereas the official campaign (despite a few missteps) was mostly on its game. I laugh at people who think that we can win this country back through a revolution when we can't even get people to show up for their caucus.

 

[roversaurus]

Well many here realized this long ago. Young people DO NOT vote.

Sounds like the campaign isn't going to stop targeting young people though. It's a shame that we could have won all of those states that the campaign secretly expected to win. Could have been the frontrunner for the nomination by now.

You keep saying that. The young people at Paul's Rallys DO VOTE. There just aren't enough of them. When you have a rally of 3000 people and it takes 40,000 votes to win you don't have enough votes.

The young people who DON'T go to a Paul rally aren't voting for him ... but the OLD PEOPLE who don't go to a Paul rally aren't voting for him either.

 

[tttppp]

I can't believe people are even falling for the idea that this is somehow the campaign's fault. We have mathematical proof of vote fraud now, and you people still want to play the blame game. We should all be united in deriding the establishment for stealing this election. This would be a runaway victory for Paul if the elections were fair and Paul were treated fairly by the media.

I agree 100%. I believe there should be transparent audits of these elections. The fact that there is no audit tells me they are up to something. I see no legitimate reason why they don't audit something as important as elections. Oh wait, they don't audit them because they aren't really counting our votes.

 

[Johncjackson]

Young people don't vote and old people don't vote for Ron Paul. Sometimes it seems like the best hope is for certain blocks to ..uh, die off, and that today's young people will keep their ideals as they become tomorrow's voters, but it doesn't seem to work that way. Something has to be done to end that cycle.

 

[Johncjackson]

Yeah, I don't get this. Pretending like they can just change the "young people" dynamic is delusional. And it wasn't just the voters. All the campaign staff in my state were fresh out of college and from out of state. They were nice people, but not very detail oriented and they never showed up either. When they did, they hurt us, more than they helped (other than bringing campaign materials). Enthusiasm is not what this campaign needs more of. Experienced people with connections are what help us the most.

All that being said though, and unlike in '08, I feel that it was more the grassroots that let the movement down, whereas the official campaign (despite a few missteps) was mostly on its game. I laugh at people who think that we can win this country back through a revolution when we can't even get people to show up for their caucus.

The Children Are the Future, man. He does not appeal well to certain blocs, including older voters, certain income and educational levels. These people are set in their ways for the most part. Their political ID and attitudes/non-attitudes are formed. The young still might have a chance before they turn into their statist parents/grandparents, and maybe they can keep some of their pro-freedom beliefs as they transition to adulthood. This is where change happens, and regardless of the message appealing to the "Old Right" or the Founders/Classical thinkers, embracing Ron Paul's message does require change from the current status quo.

 

[Give me liberty]

People show up at the rallies to have their own talking points and beliefs shouted from a lectern. Makes 'em feel good about themselves...

Then they go home to watch Alex Jones clips, look up the latest conspiracy theories, and ignore the FACT that they have to get off their bums and vote. So many of Paul's supporters are all talk and no action. It's not Ron's fault that while the youth is ideologically "waking up", their physical bodies are lazy, and fast asleep.

Sadly i agree with you, even though i doubt some of those people really do support Ron Paul because if they did he would be at least winning and would have won one single state.

If those people at the rallies were true supporters of Ron Paul they at least would have pushed him in there own states, to make sure we would win at least one state.

But i guess such rallies are a waste of Money and frustration.

Ron Paul should have done more time with the real voters like this

-Going to TownHalls
-Going to malls, meeting with the actual voters, sitting down with them, talking with them.

-Walking around in there state cities holding outdoor rallies for Free, but giving out campaign materials to the actual voters on sight rather then college kids who honestly dont seem to care at all on what happens.


-Do what John McCain did in 08 by sending out an internet Ad to voters in one state where like he won.


Well i guess its to late now.

 

[nedomedo]

edit:

posted in wrong thread

 

[ssjevot]

I know for a fact that over 50% of the voters we ID'd in Washington didn't vote (not all of which were young people by the way, thought the majority were), but when I point this out I get attacked for not embracing the delusional conspiracy theory vote fraud mindset that is so pervasive here. Get out there and actually canvas and call people and you will see most people don't support Paul, and of those who do most don't show up to vote. It's reality, and we all need to accept it if we want this movement to go anywhere. Screaming vote fraud is just an excuse so you can feel good about not having done anything to ID voters, because anyone who has been involved in voter ID in their precinct knows the truth. Most don't show up, end of story.

 

[Lord Xar]

So, you take the time to drive to a rally and participate yet you don't vote? Does not make an ounce of sense. A person who goes to a rally understands the value of a vote. They are NOT gonna show up at a rally and then assume "ahhh, someone else will make up for my lack of a vote.." No.

The same formula can be seen in numerous races.. Ron polls high, beating expectations YET as the night wears on, he plummets and someone else benefits. ~2500 at rally, and only ~450 votes for RP. Really?

Fraud is not gonna be served on a silver platter for you to digest and analyze. It is done in dark cold places owned by dark people who will try to make you feel like a "crazy person" for suggesting such....

I think there is rampant voting fraud.

 

[Lord Xar]

I know for a fact that over 50% of the voters we ID'd in Washington didn't vote (not all of which were young people by the way, thought the majority were), but when I point this out I get attacked for not embracing the delusional conspiracy theory vote fraud mindset that is so pervasive here. Get out there and actually canvas and call people and you will see most people don't support Paul, and of those who do most don't show up to vote. It's reality, and we all need to accept it if we want this movement to go anywhere. Screaming vote fraud is just an excuse so you can feel good about not having done anything to ID voters, because anyone who has been involved in voter ID in their precinct knows the truth. Most don't show up, end of story.

Perhaps because the same microscope you require of others, you don't require of yourself. "I know for a fact...." Really? How do you know as a fact? Maybe they did turn out.... and maybe vote flipping took place. Maybe paper ballots were miscounted etc...

And it is true, the burden of proof is on those who believe fraud took place. And that is the funny thing about vote fraud, SO HARD TO PINPOINT AND PROVE.... so I don't think you'll ever be satisfied.

 

[mport1]

I can't believe people are even falling for the idea that this is somehow the campaign's fault. We have mathematical proof of vote fraud now, and you people still want to play the blame game. We should all be united in deriding the establishment for stealing this election. This would be a runaway victory for Paul if the elections were fair and Paul were treated fairly by the media.

It is not the campaigns fault, though I'm sure they could have done things better in retrospect. I place the blame on the media for their blackouts and biased reporting, the GOP establishment for rallying against Ron, and most of all the voters for not embracing the ideas of liberty (though who could blame them after the heavy indoctrination we have all received from the government for our whole lives). However, there is no solid evidence of voter fraud.

 

[WD-NY]

I know for a fact that over 50% of the voters we ID'd in Washington didn't vote (not all of which were young people by the way, thought the majority were), but when I point this out I get attacked for not embracing the delusional conspiracy theory vote fraud mindset that is so pervasive here. Get out there and actually canvas and call people and you will see most people don't support Paul, and of those who do most don't show up to vote. It's reality, and we all need to accept it if we want this movement to go anywhere. Screaming vote fraud is just an excuse so you can feel good about not having done anything to ID voters, because anyone who has been involved in voter ID in their precinct knows the truth. Most don't show up, end of story.

Ok, but what's their fucking excuse?

And why doesn't/didn't the campaign do anything to address whatever it was that was keeping them from showing up?

This is the age of inexpensive web apps + game theory at scale. I'm quite certain that tools could've been built that would've improved our gotv rates. And no, phone from home is not it.

 

[ssjevot]

So, you take the time to drive to a rally and participate yet you don't vote? Does not make an ounce of sense. A person who goes to a rally understands the value of a vote. They are NOT gonna show up at a rally and then assume "ahhh, someone else will make up for my lack of a vote.." No.

The same formula can be seen in numerous races.. Ron polls high, beating expectations YET as the night wears on, he plummets and someone else benefits. ~2500 at rally, and only ~450 votes for RP. Really?

Fraud is not gonna be served on a silver platter for you to digest and analyze. It is done in dark cold places owned by dark people who will try to make you feel like a "crazy person" for suggesting such....

I think there is rampant voting fraud.

Two people in my precinct went to a rally and didn't vote. One went to two rallies. Both didn't get registered to vote in time despite repeated reminders and offers to drive them to the elections office myself. It was extremely frustrating and when I see those people I want to ask them "WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU?", but this is just the reality of getting people to actually vote. When push comes to shove most people just don't put the work in and I'm not sure what we can do to change that.

There is no (large scale) voter fraud, just voter apathy.

 

[ssjevot]

Perhaps because the same microscope you require of others, you don't require of yourself. "I know for a fact...." Really? How do you know as a fact? Maybe they did turn out.... and maybe vote flipping took place. Maybe paper ballots were miscounted etc...

And it is true, the burden of proof is on those who believe fraud took place. And that is the funny thing about vote fraud, SO HARD TO PINPOINT AND PROVE.... so I don't think you'll ever be satisfied.

In a caucus state it's pretty hard to turnout to your caucus location and not be seen, since you all vote in the same place at the same time.