PAUL / JOHNSON 2012

[ProBlue33]

Now that I have had some time to digest the utter futility and stupidity of the GOP/RNC.
I am convinced the title of this thread must happen.
Now Ron Paul said during the primary that he didn't want to run third party, but he also said he didn't like giving a 100% absolute no I will not run third party if I lose, and I actually agreed with him on this IF and it was a huge if, if this happened.

1)IF Ron was respected at the RNC.
2)IF Ron's delegates were respected, they worked so hard to get were they were.
3)IF Democratic fraud never happened on such a massive scale from primary states right on in to the RNC convention.
4)IF he was allowed to give his rightful unedited speech at the RNC.
5)IF the GOP at the RNC would have allowed all the rightful delegates to be publicly counted.
6)IF the RNC didn't change the rules right at the end of the game. (it was like being like 4th and 1 at the 10 second mark of the 4th quarter on the goal-line for the touchdown and the head referee says we are rolling you back to the 25th yard because we don't want you to win)
7)IF that damming video of pure bullshit going at at the RNC didn't exist to prove it all.
9)IF Romney hadn't of said he would destroy Ron Paul privately in a PR campaign as per Doug Wead during the primary.
10)IF everybody in the GOP and RNC just played fair and Ron Paul still lost.

Then I would say yes Ron Paul gave it his all and should do as he said and retire.
BUT because of the 10 point above I think Ron Paul should run at the head of the Libertarian party, Johnson would have to be willing to step one notch down for the good of liberty. As for Rand after what the RNC rules did, I don't know if he even has chance in 2016, so screw it.

Would you not agree that everybody that has been wanting to OFFICIALLY vote for Ron Paul since 2008 would jump at this come November. This would screw Romney and after what he and his team did at the RNC and his threats during the primaries, this would be justice on that fool.

Ron Paul could announce and site political "blowback" is happening based on the 10 points mentioned above.

 

[RickyJ]

Now Ron Paul said during the primary that he wouldn't run third party

No, Ron never said that.

 

[kathy88]

Would you not agree that everybody that has been wanting to OFFICIALLY vote for Ron Paul since 2008 would jump at this come November. This would screw Romney and after what he and his team did and the RNC and his threats during the primaries, this would be justice on that fool.

I know a TON of people who do not vote in primaries that would gladly vote for him in the general.

 

[1stAmendguy]

No, Ron never said that.

Yes, he never said he wouldn't in absolute terms.

 

[ProBlue33]

No, Ron never said that.

Good point, I changed it. Thanks

 

[nobody's_hero]

I don't say this as someone who is defending the Libertarian party, campaigning for them, or someone who says this egotistically,

but.

It isn't really fair to the Libertarians who went through the process of nominating Gary Johnson and Judge Jim Gray to suddenly rush back to the LP and expect them to toss out/rearrange their nominees.

The Libertarians held a fair nominating convention.

The GOP did not.

Just consider my point, please.

I would happily vote libertarian at this point, with their current nominees. There *can* always be a place for Ron Paul in a Libertarian administration. The problem is, Ron Paul is right on pretty much everything, so would you put him as Sec. of State? or Treasury?, or Homeland Security?, etc. etc. etcetera, lol.

 

[ILUVRP]

to me a Paul/Johnson ticket would be perfect.

i will never vote for romney or obama.

 

[Eire4RonPaul]

Let's be realistic here for a second...

I think we need to come back down to Earth. It's been one hell of a ride these last few years but I don't think we should be grasping at straws any longer. As much as I love Ron, we need to understand that he is not going to sacrifice his sons political aspirations. And for what? His own ego? He's not that kind of guy - all he wants now is to retire with a bit of peace. He's in his 70's for Christ sake. But we're young - we're the one's that have to carry the torch. This phenomenon is not about one man - it never was. It's about economic and social freedom - a free world. Ron Paul was just one bolt in the car of which there are and have been many - Ludwig von Mises, Frederic Bastiat, Carl Menger, Murray Rothbard - all contributed, in their own small way, to advancing a free world.

I'm not too informed on the rules of Paul entering another campaign but the way I see it is that J.Jim Gray will not give up his spot as VP (is this even possible?) I do know that if we split the vote, we're already dead in the water. By writing in Ron Paul, you're effectively contributing ZERO to liberty or Ron Paul. You're not having your disent registered, simple as that. Leaving the ballot box, no matter how much money you donated, with a smile on your face is not going to advance our goals. We need to get behind Gary for 3 months. Even if he doesn't win, (well with an attitude like that who would) we can still get him into the debates. And that would be a huge accomplishment. It's clear the GOP fear Gary. They're trying to get him off the ballots.

 

[UtahApocalypse]

Sore loser laws.

 

[69360]

No, Ron never said that.

He said there was a 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999% chance he would NOT run third party.

So of course on here...

 

[ProBlue33]

Sore loser laws.

If this is REALLY against the law, then why is there talk about a third party run ?

I guess we need to clear the air whether he can legally run third party?

 

[Smitty]

he is not going to sacrifice his sons political aspirations.

,...and that's where the liberty movement finds itself at the end of the primary.

Rand Paul's position in the establishment GOP is holding the liberty movement hostage.

 

[69360]

,...and that's where the liberty movement finds itself at the end of the primary.

Rand Paul's position in the establishment GOP is holding the liberty movement hostage.

Hostage? You have free will. If you don't want to support Rand, then don't.

 

[ProBlue33]

SUMMARY OF RNC CHEATING TACTICS AT THE TAMPA CONVENTION:

Below is a list of tactics implemented by the RNC to censor and prevent a nomination of Ron Paul:

1. Illegally removed duly elected Maine delegates and replaced them with Romney “scab” delegates.
2. Stole delegates from Louisiana, Oklahoma and Massachusetts because they would not vote Romney.
3. Indefinitely detained Ron Paul delegates on buses using armed guards to delay and prevent them from voting on rules in the convention.
4. Indefinitely detained Morton Blackwell on a bus preventing him from filing a minority report opposing new oppressive rule changes.
5. Drove Virginia rules committee chairmen in circles around the convention center to prevent them from voting on rules thus allowing the RNC to vote in their stead.
6. Refused to ackn
owledge nomination papers from six states where a five state minimum was required.
7. Changed rules on the spot from five state minimum to eight state minimum when they realized Ron Paul would be nominated.
8. Denied Ron Paul a floor speech prior to the vote unless it endorsed Romney.
9. Declared unbound Ron Paul supporters as bound votes for Romney.
10. Boehmer ignored clear opposition to the rules vote that would prevent a Maine delegation from being seated.
11. Turned off microphones in the Ron Paul delegate section to prevent “division” or “point of order” calls from being heard even after 10 minutes of booing in protest.
12. Seated Ron Paul delegates in the nose bleed section to prevent them from being heard BEHIND territory delegates.
13. Passed rules allowing the RNC committee to choose and approve delegates rather than the states.
14. Refused video equipment in the convention center to allow undocumented cheating.
15. Ron Paul delegates were not allowed to bring signs, but Romney supporters were.
16. Cut off microphones anytime delegates cheered for Ron Paul.
17. Called out votes for Romney as Romney votes, but called out Ron Paul as “other”.
18. When Ron Paul won the majority of delegates in Iowa , Nevada and Minnesota, they only called out the few minority votes for Romney.

This list does not include all of the fraud and deception that has occurred across the nation during the primaries and state conventions.


POLITICAL BLOWBACK
too all this is a third party run !

 

[69360]

Below is a list of tactics implemented by the RNC to censor and prevent a nomination of Ron Paul

But in the end it didn't matter. He did not have the numbers to win. You can fume about it or move on to the future. It was a dick move but it's over and done with. We're still outnumbered 9 to 1, we can play nice and get somewhere or always be the red headed step child of the GOP.

 

[affa]

Sore loser laws.

You've posted this in at least one other tread, but didn't seem to read the threads beforehand, because it had already been brought up and discussed. You also don't seem to read threads after you post, because you were responded to in that thread.

Anyway, I don't know all the facts, but I do know the general response to this is that sore loser laws do not apply to presidential elections.

someone else can be more specific.

but seriously, stop spamming this if you're never even going to to discuss it afterwards.

 

[Smitty]

Hostage? You have free will. If you don't want to support Rand, then don't.

I was responding to this statement:

"he is not going to sacrifice his sons political aspirations."

I absolutely will not support Rand. But my support isn't the issue.

The issue is,..the well being of the liberty movement is being sacrificed to protect Rand's reputation in the establishment GOP.

 

[Smitty]

Rand's position in the establishment GOP is secure only as long as he does nothing which will directly benefit the liberty movement.

In fact, he's only there in order to deliver liberty movement votes to Romney.

 

[69360]

I don't know any RP primary voters who are going to Romney. Do you? Everyone I know is going Johnson and I've read about a lot of write ins.

How is anything being sacrificed. You're an individual do as you please. If Ron is protecting his son's future so what?

 

[Galileo Galilei]

Rand's position in the establishment GOP is secure only as long as he does nothing which will directly benefit the liberty movement.

In fact, he's only there in order to deliver liberty movement votes to Romney.

not true. pretty much everything Rand has done for the past 18 months has been anti-estalblishment. he has voted in the minority, he has introduced bills never seen before, he has filibustered, he has a unique budget ignore by Ryanrom, he gives radical floor speeches, and has a radical book coming out on Sept. 11.