Our Iowa folks don't seem to be turning out to all the County GOP elections right now

[sailingaway]

And Iowa Republican is crowing over it: http://theiowarepublican.com/2013/r...air-races-former-paul-backers-thwarted-again/

 

[FSP-Rebel]

The vote totals weren't even close and the turnout from the RP people was embarrassing. I'm getting the impression the organizational aspect has either completely failed or RP regulars are just one trick ponies. Show up for one convention and then never exert effort again. This is where the establishment is smart, just wait out the noobs and they'll go back to bed. With Woods' tour coming up he can inspire the ideas of liberty but hopefully C4L will be there steering these recruits into action. My only downside to this tour and Paul's campus appearances is that while there are orgs there to sign people up to get engaged, a hearty portion of each speech on the issues needs to stress that the ideas of liberty are meaningless w/o organizational mobilization.

 

[sailingaway]

Or they could individually turn out when there is a cause they consider worth the effort. Not seeing someone on the horizon they personally find worth the effort does not make you a one trick pony.

I agree that we have to stay engaged so when those candidates come up who WOULD be good we have impact, but it is harder to motivate to that. People have to get motivated, though, if we want to move forward.

It is always harder in off years, except for those perpetually going for their personal power, and that doesn't describe most of our people.

This seems to have been a really large drop off, though.

 

[lib3rtarian]

This is typical of RP folks - all talk, no action. We expected a flood of liberty folks in the Wake County, NC convention this year, but right at the precinct meeting level itself, I could count the number of liberty folks I saw in my hand. (To go to the county convention, you need to attend the precinct meeting first.) Even the folks who showed up last year didn't come. So goes Wake, so goes the rest of the NC. Gunny is running for NCGOP vice chair, so a show of force in Wake was very crucial.

 

[mz10]

The vote totals weren't even close and the turnout from the RP people was embarrassing. I'm getting the impression the organizational aspect has either completely failed or RP regulars are just one trick ponies. Show up for one convention and then never exert effort again. This is where the establishment is smart, just wait out the noobs and they'll go back to bed. With Woods' tour coming up he can inspire the ideas of liberty but hopefully C4L will be there steering these recruits into action. My only downside to this tour and Paul's campus appearances is that while there are orgs there to sign people up to get engaged, a hearty portion of each speech on the issues needs to stress that the ideas of liberty are meaningless w/o organizational mobilization.

You are so right, if I could give you 10 +reps for this I would. Speaking for us here in MA, it is extremely frustrating how, apart from our "inner circle" of loyal activists, most liberty people don't show up to anything that doesn't have Ron Paul's name attached to it. It seems like they were so stuck in this idea that Ron Paul was the only person who could restore our liberty and now that he lost the world is over. It's amazing how much this movement can accomplish when we are motivated, but we need to get away from this hero-worshipping bullshit and start mobilizing on the local level.

We need to start helping liberty people understand this. Any thoughts on how that can be done effectively?

 

[sailingaway]

Were they aware of the fact that Gunny was running?

 

[FSP-Rebel]

Or they could individually turn out when there is a cause they consider worth the effort. Not seeing someone on the horizon they personally find worth the effort does not make you a one trick pony.

This seems to have been a really large drop off, though.

I get the whole individualist mentality turn out routine but staying engaged is a must especially if one is an educator first and foremost. Events like these are when ideas are showcased and spread to others of like minds. Spreading libertarian ideals to those that aren't engaged is less meaningful than doing so to those that are. People can preach on about how tight their libertarian chastity belt is but if they don't show up nothing matters. That's why sometimes the sentiment comes across that the libertarian engaged politicos must network w/ teocons and social conservatives over their purified brethren because you have to formulate a winning plan w/ those that are likely to show up and get busy. The establishment of both parties is the enemy but certain elements of the purified it seems would rather be at odds with their politico cousins instead all in the name of keeping the message pure. I suppose there's value in the that to some extent but if that's the end-all be-all to that element's pursuit, then it becomes worth less (not worthless). I didn't really want to go here but in the end, couldn't avoid it. So I'll close with: ideals w/o mobilization to activism are worthless.

 

[AuH20]

You are so right, if I could give you 10 +reps for this I would. Speaking for us here in MA, it is extremely frustrating how, apart from our "inner circle" of loyal activists, most liberty people don't show up to anything that doesn't have Ron Paul's name attached to it. It seems like they were so stuck in this idea that Ron Paul was the only person who could restore our liberty and now that he lost the world is over. It's amazing how much this movement can accomplish when we are motivated, but we need to get away from this hero-worshipping bullshit and start mobilizing on the local level.

We need to start helping liberty people understand this. Any thoughts on how that can be done effectively?

Too many Ron Paul Only types out there. Not a good sign.

 

[sailingaway]

You are so right, if I could give you 10 +reps for this I would. Speaking for us here in MA, it is extremely frustrating how, apart from our "inner circle" of loyal activists, most liberty people don't show up to anything that doesn't have Ron Paul's name attached to it. It seems like they were so stuck in this idea that Ron Paul was the only person who could restore our liberty and now that he lost the world is over. It's amazing how much this movement can accomplish when we are motivated, but we need to get away from this hero-worshipping bullshit and start mobilizing on the local level.

We need to start helping liberty people understand this. Any thoughts on how that can be done effectively?

I disagree that it is hero worship, what I see is people motivated by any candidate with those consistent views, expressed along with the message. If there isn't a candidate there with that persona, they may not be as motivated. I think it is self defeating to beat people up as hero worshiping since they just dislike you and want to be around you even less. It is just a character attack.

Think about what might motivate them.

It isn't people's fault that they aren't motivated by McCain, or any other candidate who doesn't appeal to them.

 

[sailingaway]

I get the whole individualist mentality turn out routine but staying engaged is a must especially if one is an educator first and foremost. Events like these are when ideas are showcased and spread to others of like minds. Spreading libertarian ideals to those that aren't engaged is less meaningful than doing so to those that are. People can preach on about how tight their libertarian chastity belt is but if they don't show up nothing matters. That's why sometimes the sentiment comes across that the libertarian engaged politicos must network w/ teocons and social conservatives over their purified brethren because you have to formulate a winning plan w/ those that are likely to show up and get busy. The establishment of both parties is the enemy but certain elements of the purified it seems would rather be at odds with their politico cousins instead all in the name of keeping the message pure. I suppose there's value in the that to some extent but if that's the end-all be-all to that element's pursuit, then it becomes worth less (not worthless). I didn't really want to go here but in the end, couldn't avoid it. So I'll close with: ideals w/o mobilization to activism are worthless.

It seems easy to me if someone isn't motivating people to say it is all their fault for being too pure but it doesn't move the ball down the court.

I keep motivated with no candidate in view by looking at the next generation and thinking how it would have been for Ron if we had been in place when he came along. I don't want the next Ron Paul to have the reception he did, and meanwhile we make gains in breaking down discussion barriers being in place because they have to address our issues.

But on the day in and day out party stuff most traditionally motivate because they want power for themselves, and that isn't the message that will carry the day with our sort, imho.

The first part of what you said IS motivating, and it seems to me spreading that might help.

 

[Matt Collins]

Presidential campaigns create a lot of excitement and buzz, so its easier to turn people out for them. You always experience a loss in non-Presidential years. The lower the food chain the less people care. Everyone can tell you who the President is, no one knows the name of their city councilman or county commissioner.

 

[RockEnds]

Last I heard, my county is meeting in the next few days. I already RSVP'd that I most likely will not attend. I have surgery tomorrow. I doubt if I'll make it. It's not the only meeting I've had to miss this winter. I am hopeful that it will be the last, though.

 

[sailingaway]

Last I heard, my county is meeting in the next few days. I already RSVP'd that I most likely will not attend. I have surgery tomorrow. I doubt if I'll make it. It's not the only meeting I've had to miss this winter. I am hopeful that it will be the last, though.

That is a very different circumstance, though, and understandable.

Maybe you could get in touch with a few of your fellows and make sure they are going? You could bring up what happened in other places and say since you are having surgery you are trying to do your part in get out the vote....?

 

[mz10]

I disagree that it is hero worship, what I see is people motivated by any candidate with those consistent views, expressed along with the message. If there isn't a candidate there with that persona, they may not be as motivated. I think it is self defeating to beat people up as hero worshiping since they just dislike you and want to be around you even less. It is just a character attack.

Think about what might motivate them.

It isn't people's fault that they aren't motivated by McCain, or any other candidate who doesn't appeal to them.

But I think you're misunderstanding my point - I guarantee you there will be energy for Rand's campaign in 4 years, even in spite of the fact that there are people with objections to him (although those seem to be fading). People are mesmerized by the top of the ticket, but as soon as the "sexy" big-ticket races are over, those people disappear. The most important work is not done during the campaign, the most important work is done in the years leading up to the campaign.

 

[sailingaway]

But I think you're misunderstanding my point - I guarantee you there will be energy for Rand's campaign in 4 years, even in spite of the fact that there are people with objections to him (although those seem to be fading). People are mesmerized by the top of the ticket, but as soon as those "sexy" big-ticket races are over, those people disappear. The most important work is not done during the campaign, the most important work is done in the years leading up to the campaign.

I don't know that that is as important as people make out, the 'top' of the ticket. Particularly to our sort. If I were there I'd be trying to find a more junior person who is really engaging. What about Leah Cole?

 

[mz10]

It may well be our fault that we are not adequately communicating the importance of grassroots organizing. That's why I'm looking for ideas on how that can be improved.

 

[mz10]

I don't know that that is as important as people make out, the 'top' of the ticket. Particularly to our sort. If I were there I'd be trying to find a more junior person who is really engaging. What about Leah Cole?

Leah is great - but believe it or not, most of Leah's organization has come from the social conservatives (who in this state are our anti-establishment allies). Other than the 10 or so liberty people in this state who are really active and have been increasing our standing within the party, we have a hard time mobilizing people.

I'm not just talking about campaigns here. I'm talking about conventions and state committee meetings and things like that where we really need to make our mark.

 

[sailingaway]

Leah is great - but believe it or not, most of Leah's organization has come from the social conservatives (who in this state are our anti-establishment allies). Other than the 10 or so liberty people in this state who are really active and have been increasing our standing within the party, we have a hard time mobilizing people.

I'm not just talking about campaigns here. I'm talking about conventions and state committee meetings and things like that where we really need to make our mark.

I know what you are saying. I'm saying people might be more motivated, if you care, if you make a star of a junior candidate, who is really good. Make them the example of the change people would be creating.

--
edit, look, I don't know your situation where you are. It just seems self defeating to gripe about people not being motivated rather than to try to find the principles people were fighting for in genuine candidates at whatever level, to ask people to turn out.

 

[lib3rtarian]

Were they aware of the fact that Gunny was running?

I think so. But if you had tuned out politics from your life after Nov 2012, then I can see why you would miss that. I can see that reflected in my FB newsfeed. A lot of those otherwise regular folks who supported RP in 2012 used to post RP/liberty news and pics all the time. Now, I see pics of their dogs and daughters' dance performances. It's as if they have given up on politics. Can't say I blame them totally. I too was in a "what's the point?" mode till Rand's filibuster which kinda fired me up for now.

 

[mz10]

I know what you are saying. I'm saying people might be more motivated, if you care, if you make a star of a junior candidate, who is really good. Make them the example of the change people would be creating.

--
edit, look, I don't know your situation where you are. It just seems self defeating to gripe about people not being motivated rather than to try to find the principles people were fighting for in genuine candidates at whatever level, to ask people to turn out.

No I understand - look, again I think it's self-defeating to gripe about other people as well, I'm right there with you on that. That's why I'm looking for suggestions. Your idea is a pretty good one, to make Leah a rallying point for our movement. Certainly if she wins, there's a good chance of that happening.

I'm also talking about other states though, too, and I don't know that its feasible to have one "hero" per state. There has to be some kind of mechanism for encouraging involvement.