lester1/2jr
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alot of different groups ancaps, libertarians, paleo cons and leftists agree on being anti war. at the end of the day there is not an awful lot besides that we agree on
Noam Chomsky on Ron Paul & his supporters
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True!
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Socialism is a conjob, Chomsky is a conman.
bruce leeroy
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his momma must've really hated him naming im noam
charrob
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-the thread is rather long, so haven't read thru all the posts, but just wanted to post this from Justin Raimondo at antiwar.com.
-i'm from the left and still have many tendencies as such. BUT Ron Paul has enough there that I'd switch party to vote in the republican primary should he decide to run in 2012.
-i will never be a republican, but i can accept a libertarian president.
-there are many disenfranchised leftists right now. And, NO, the antiwar movement has not completely gone away- there is still a small little group kicking and screaming. (For anyone in the D.C. area, there's a meeting this Sunday at 'Busboys and Poets', 5th & K street to discuss trying to grow the peace movement as well as this supposed "end" to the iraqi war. Iraqi Veterans Against the War will be there, as well as others. It's open to the public.)
As Justin Raimondo states in the quote below, Kevin Zeese is one of those leftists really trying to come together on just the shared issues that are agreed upon. How else can we grow the movement to end the wars?
-perhaps this is the wrong place but for what it's worth: i'm from a family of Sarah Palin, Glen Beck loving neocons who are angry as hell about the mosque in N.Y. and hate all muslims. [yes i know- how the hell was i born a liberal
?] Anyway, yesterday at a family picnic i gently discussed Ron Paul's view points and they absolutely hate him. There's no convincing. I can't stress this enough: if the wars are still going on in 2012, you've got a much better chance on converting prior leftists like myself than you're ever going to have with brainwashed neocons. -that's all i'll say.Below is Justin Raimondo's hope of bringing the two sides together on just the issues we agree on:
As Justin Raimondo states in the quote below, Kevin Zeese is one of those leftists really trying to come together on just the shared issues that are agreed upon. How else can we grow the movement to end the wars?
-perhaps this is the wrong place but for what it's worth: i'm from a family of Sarah Palin, Glen Beck loving neocons who are angry as hell about the mosque in N.Y. and hate all muslims. [yes i know- how the hell was i born a liberal
Below is Justin Raimondo's hope of bringing the two sides together on just the issues we agree on:
Thanks for sharing. I too was raised, not in a neocon family, but in a very conservative family along the lines of Barry Goldwater. My dad liked the early Ronald Reagan, not the President Reagan. When we dropped out of the religious cult we were in, I went the other way and become very much to the left. Now, I'm kind of caught in the middle, but I am not a statist. I am 100% anti-war, and I agree with you that it is impossible to talk to neocons about Ron Paul. They hate him. Yet the liberal dems who I have talked to about him (who at one time didn't like his message) now agree with most of what he stands for.
Old Ducker
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As a former Democrat I completely agree. The way to get liberals to begin to see the light is to show them that we have a common enemy which is corporatism and the only solution is the free market. Government will always be the tool of the power elite
-the thread is rather long, so haven't read thru all the posts, but just wanted to post this from Justin Raimondo at antiwar.com.
-i'm from the left and still have many tendencies as such. BUT Ron Paul has enough there that I'd switch party to vote in the republican primary should he decide to run in 2012.
-i will never be a republican, but i can accept a libertarian president.
-there are many disenfranchised leftists right now. And, NO, the antiwar movement has not completely gone away- there is still a small little group kicking and screaming. (For anyone in the D.C. area, there's a meeting this Sunday at 'Busboys and Poets', 5th & K street to discuss trying to grow the peace movement as well as this supposed "end" to the iraqi war. Iraqi Veterans Against the War will be there, as well as others. It's open to the public.)
As Justin Raimondo states in the quote below, Kevin Zeese is one of those leftists really trying to come together on just the shared issues that are agreed upon. How else can we grow the movement to end the wars?
-perhaps this is the wrong place but for what it's worth: i'm from a family of Sarah Palin, Glen Beck loving neocons who are angry as hell about the mosque in N.Y. and hate all muslims. [yes i know- how the hell was i born a liberal
Below is Justin Raimondo's hope of bringing the two sides together on just the issues we agree on:
Glenn Beck is poison, and that is why they hate Ron Paul. I have not seen one shred of evidence that Glenn Beck has brought people over here.
I am seriosuly starting to see the credibility in Gerald Celente's predictions of a progressive libertarian party. I thought it sounded far off at first but now I think it's going to happen, and may counter the tea parties which will be entirely neoconned and ready to declare war on liberals, muslims, and progressives...because of Beck's brainwashing.
There is no doubt that more war is on the horizon. There is no doubt that there will be more civil liberties abuses.
We really should get ahead of the game now, and be ready for this new movement, but have a written list of principles in advance this time.
Count me in. I like this guy. From wiki:
An article in the Washington Times has claimed "Celente's accurate forecasts include the 1987 stock market crash, the collapse of the Soviet Union in 1991, the 1997 Asian currency crash" and "the 2007 subprime mortgage scandal."
His forecasts since 1993 have included predictions about terrorism, economic collapses and war. More recent forecasts involve fascism in the United States, food riots and tax revolts.
Celente has long predicted global anti-Americanism, a failing economy and immigration woes in the U.S. In December 2007 Celente wrote, "Failing banks, busted brokerages, toppled corporate giants, bankrupt cities, states in default, foreign creditors cashing out of US securities ... whatever the spark, the stage is set for panic in the streets" and "Just as the Twin Towers collapsed from the top down, so too will the U.S. economy ... when the giant firms fall, they’ll crush the man on the street." He has also predicted tax revolts.
In November 2008 Celente appeared on Fox Business Network and predicted economic depression, tax rebellions and food riots in the United States by 2012. Celente also predicted an "economic 9/11" and a "panic of 2008."
In 2009 Celente predicted turmoil which he described as "Obamageddon" and he was a popular guest on conservative cable-TV shows such as Fox News Sunday and Glenn Beck's television program. In April 2009 Celente wrote, "Wall Street controls our financial lives; the media manipulates our minds. These systems cannot be changed from within. There is no alternative. Without a revolution, these institutions will bankrupt the country, keep fighting failed wars, start new ones, and hold us in perpetual intellectual subjugation."
He appeared on the Glenn Beck show and criticized the U.S. stimulus plan of 2009, calling government controlled capitalism "fascism" and saying shopping malls in the U.S. would become "ghost malls."Celente has said, "smaller communities, the smaller groups, the smaller states, the more self-sustaining communities, will 'weather the crisis in style' as big cities and hypertrophic suburbias descend into misery and conflict," and forecasts "a downsizing of America."
Revolution in the USA
In Russia Today, he predicted that the USA would be facing a revolution.
Neosurvivalism
Celente's website has stated that:
“In 2010, survivalism will go mainstream. Unemployed or fearing it, foreclosed or nearing it, pensions lost and savings gone, all sorts of folk who once believed in the system have lost their faith. Motivated not by worst-case scenario fears but by do-or-die necessity, the new non-believers, unwilling to go under or live on the streets, will devise ingenious stratagems to beat the system, get off the grid (as much as possible), and stay under the radar. ”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_Celente
Lord Xar
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Why do you all feel that the "neo-cons" absolutely hate Ron Paul?
Is there a religious component? A zionism component? A media manipulation component? A 'the right is the party of war' component?
I think sometimes breaking it down makes it easier to see the evil of the sum.
Is there a religious component? A zionism component? A media manipulation component? A 'the right is the party of war' component?
I think sometimes breaking it down makes it easier to see the evil of the sum.
I think the biggest reason is because people like Hannity tell them to hate Ron Paul. I find that the majority of neocons can't think for themselves. The other reason they hate Dr. Paul is because of his foreign policy of non-intervention, and no more foreign aid, which means no aid to Israel.
Old Ducker
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The following quote illustrates what we're up against these days as far as the rank and file GOP goes:
"It's always been my understanding that Neocons are simply Conservatives who believe that the United States is in fact the "shining beacon on the hill" in that we are an example for the rest of the world to follow-- but also that we have the moral imperative to help the rest of the world to attain what we have. By proactively helping to liberate the people of the world, we are satisfying the highest calling of a true democracy, and also reflecting the absolute best parts of the Christian mission in the world."
Lord Xar
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Right.
But your idea that they can't think for themselves is not completely true. I have a close 'leftist' who watches Maher/Colbert and listens to all that shit about teabaggers are racists etc... and truly believes it. I think there is a deeper issue.
I believe the divide that is created between the left/right becomes soooo deep and wide that even when a wise thought comes thru, it can't breach that divide.
For instance, the Mosque debate. Such a small matter becoming HUGE NEWS. Deepening and widening the divide further till the truth is not even what matters.
Also, "No aid to israel". I am sure jewish voters make up a very very small pool for repubs compared to other voting pools.. so if it is "his foreign policy". Who drives this and associates this "aid" to the right?
It's completely media manipulation. They do not understand history, and are too lazy to look up information on their own. The information is spoonfed to them - garbage in, garbage out!
They see the real evil in society as being liberlism/progressivism, and have been trained to think that the liberals are not strong on national defense because deep down liberals want America to self destruct for their own selfish reasons.
The Hannities and Limbaughs make them feel patriotic by denouncing liberalism, and then playing clips of liberals sounding "anti-american, and anti-troops".
they then mix in alot of truth about conservative economics which makes their listeners trust them even more.
Then a guy like Ron Paul comes around, and says alot of the same things that liberals say. So the conditioned response is emotional, illogical, and full of vitriol. Ron Paul actually offends them on some level.
As long as they trust these establishment right wing media whores, it does not matter who is right and wrong, their brains have been wired to react a certain way whenever someone says something like "bring the troops home", or "they attack us over here because we attack them over there".
low preference guy
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flagged.
charrob
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-thanks so much all for writing. I had no idea Gerald Celente predicted this and found a youtube on DailyPaul after doing a search. That's amazing and really interesting to find out, and totally agree about being prepared with a list this time. Here's the youtube found on DailyPaul:
YouTube - Gerald Celente The Next American Revolution 13 aug 2009
The majority of Jews have voted Democrat, but Jews will support through the 1200 different Israeli PAC's a candidate from either party if that candidate will give 100% unconditional support for Israel. A breakdown of the neocons and how the Israel Lobby operates is explained in the book: "The Israel Lobby and U.S. Foreign Policy".
http://www.amazon.com/Israel-Lobby-U-S-Foreign-Policy/dp/0374177724
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