myths about the federal reserve

By having a mandate for inflation, you've steadily robbed those who've expected to receive a rate of return on their federal reserve notes held as deposits at the member banks.

The real rate of return on savings right now is negative. The Fed's policies loot savers in preference to debtors.

no system is perfect, but a small annual inflation rate can be beneficial to many people

banks don't generally want much inflation, they make money by lending it and collecting it back later, with interest, if loans are paid back in money worth less than the original loan, then banks lose out
 
i don't hate capital savings, but i think deflation is more problematic than inflation
Slow, gradual deflation over time is NOT problematic at all. It simply results from increased production and abundance leading to greater buying power of money. Borrowers don't get screwed paying back in more valuable money, because all the other money they're making still has greater purchasing power than before. The ONLY kind of deflation that is problematic is a swift and precipitous destruction of the money supply...which is only realistically possible with central banking. Of course, other coordinated actions with no counterbalance (e.g. government actions, like the Civil War ;)) can inflict this kind of thing too, to a lesser degree, but government is still the common denominator.


here's a short article explaining why the gold standard is obsolete:

http://investorcentric.blogs.nuwireinvestor.com/2009/12/why-gold-standard-is-obsolete.html

The "gold standard" mentioned in the article IS obsolete, because the author is referring to pegging the dollar to gold rather than actually using gold as currency. They're two OPPOSITE things. Pegging the dollar to gold is in fact just setting a price control on gold, which would be disastrous. In contrast, introducing a new currency gradually (and allowing private companies to do the same), which is denominated in actual weights of gold, would allow people to gradually adopt that currency as a pricing standard. Increased use would gradually make the value of the currency go up until it accurately reflected the buying power of a gold currency with respect to all the other goods and services on the market.

The same applies to any number of freely competing currencies, e.g. silver. After all, gold would become too valuable under a free market gold standard to actually be carried into groceries in physical form; hell, it's too valuable today. Paper certificates of ownership, checks, and electronic debit/credit would still exist though, and banks would just make sure to frequently adjust physical possession of gold (in their own self-interest) to reflect transfers between accounts at different financial institutions. Anyway, another metal, e.g. silver or something else, would still probably end up filling any remaining "supermarket cash" void left by gold alone.
 
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By having a mandate for inflation, you've steadily robbed those who've expected to receive a rate of return on their federal reserve notes held as deposits at the member banks.

The real rate of return on savings right now is negative. The Fed's policies loot savers in preference to debtors.

Exactly, people used to come out AHEAD on savings.. because it was borrowed by banks for exanding the economy. Then interest used to offset inflation for a time, so you could break even, and now savings is punished with net negative returns.
 
what about small annual deflation!

Deflation is what enables people to enter the workforce when productivity gains are realized... Inflation forces people out.
 
By stability, do you mean a steady 96% decline in the value of the dollar from its value in 1913, when its buying power in 1900 was nearly the same as that in 1800?

the average american worker today is some 36 times richer than his or her counterpart was back in 1895

a zero inflation monetary policy is likely to lead to unpredictability and instability, a 2% inflation rate policy that maintains a constant rate of inflation, allow firms to make reasonable prediction in the future about price and wage levels

no inflation raises the risk of our economy slipping into deflation or a deflationary spiral; decreases in prices causes wages to fall and less goods to be produced, which causes prices to fall further causing further decreases in wages, goods production and employment
 
no system is perfect, but a small annual inflation rate can be beneficial to many people

banks don't generally want much inflation, they make money by lending it and collecting it back later, with interest, if loans are paid back in money worth less than the original loan, then banks lose out

...not if high inflation rates lead to steadier business for the banks. ;)
 
no system is perfect, but a small annual inflation rate can be beneficial to many people
"Many" being a few thousand at the expense of billions.

banks don't generally want much inflation, they make money by lending it and collecting it back later, with interest, if loans are paid back in money worth less than the original loan, then banks lose out
An asset based monetary system is honest and liberating, while the banker's debt based fiat monetary system is dishonest and enslaving.
 
the average american worker today is some 36 times richer than his or her counterpart was back in 1895
Yes, and if not for inflationary monetary policy, the technological and infrastructural developments responsible for that would have made that number much higher than 36. We have become wealthier despite, not because of, the Fed and inflation...or at the very least, any benefits that WERE due to them (e.g. our trade deficit) have been fleeting, because they're about to come crashing down on us like a trillion ton asteroid straight out of China.

a zero inflation monetary policy is likely to lead to unpredictability and instability, a 2% inflation rate policy that maintains a constant rate of inflation, allow firms to make reasonable prediction in the future about price and wage levels
I'm not seeing the whole "unpredictability and instability" thing, myself.

no inflation raises the risk of our economy slipping into deflation or a deflationary spiral; decreases in prices causes wages to fall and less goods to be produced, which causes prices to fall further causing further decreases in wages, goods production and employment
You're putting the cart before the horse here. First, explain how your hypothetical deflationary spiral begins (without a central bank creating an unstable credit environment, please), and then someone can explain why it would end rather than turn into a perpetual spiral at all.
 
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"Many" being a few thousand at the expense of billions.


An asset based monetary system is honest and liberating, while the banker's debt based fiat monetary system is dishonest and enslaving.

it didn't work like that throughout history, the 19th century economy in the usa was erratic

economic instability as a result of gold and silver imports from the americas, in the 16th and 17th century, lead to the downfall of spain as a leading world power
 
Yes, and if not for inflationary monetary policy, the technological and infrastructural developments responsible for that would have made that number much higher than 36. We have become wealthier despite, not because of, the Fed and inflation...or at the very least, any benefits that WERE due to them (e.g. our trade deficit) have been fleeting, because they're about to come crashing down on us like a trillion ton asteroid straight out of China.


I'm not seeing the whole "unpredictability and instability" thing, myself.


explain how your hypothetical deflationary spiral begins

people are less likely to spend a dollar if they know it will be worth more in the future
 
it didn't work like that throughout history, the 19th century economy in the usa was erratic

economic instability as a result of gold and silver imports from the americas, in the 16th and 17th century, lead to the downfall of spain as a leading world power

I'm rusty. This was probably due to slow, inefficient, and infrequent delivery of gold reserves to reconcile trade deficits, right? (That's a genuine question). In any case, do note that I don't advocate a government-run gold standard, like the gold standards of old. They are indeed problematic (even if not so much as the current fiat system).
 
people are less likely to spend a dollar if they know it will be worth more in the future

That means they're more likely to save it, and savings provide the capital for new businesses to start. The savings provide capital for just the right number of new businesses, in fact, rather than a glut of businesses during booms, which all have the same idea and then crash and burn in a huge cluster. (This is due in large part to there not being enough room for all of them to start up and make their way at once, due to a limited number of consumer dollars and a limited labor pool.)

In any case, the only dollars people will not spend are discretionary dollars. They still have to eat, and they still have to fill their tank, and they're still probably going to pay their utility bills and rent/mortgages (unless they own outright), and they're still going to buy consumer necessities. They might eat a little less, or a little thriftier, but they're still going to pay to eat (and keep the farmers producing ;)).

It's only luxury items that people will hold out on, and even that is pretty hypothetical. Do you know why? It's because we already have a test case in the real world, right now: Look at the technology industry. Because it is not highly regulated, it has not stagnated, and it's progressing fast enough to defy even inflation. Consumer tech devices become more capable and less expensive every single year. Look at hard drive prices, memory prices, processor prices, etc. They all keep going down, but people keep buying them. Until the recession, we had a nonstop consumer spending spree on items that endlessly went down in price (actually, buying is picking back up again, although I really think people should be saving still...). Do you know why? It's because people have time preferences, and not everyone is going to sit around and endlessly wait for things to get cheaper and cheaper and cheaper if they want/need something now. Especially if people know their wages/salaries will be worth more next year, they're not going to be extraordinarily tight with their money.

Also, note that technology prices go down DRAMATICALLY every year. In contrast, price deflation in other sectors (due to gradually increasing production) would be more on the order of a few percent. Given that, the technology industry already has far "worse" price deflation than the more gentle economy-wide deflation that a steady monetary base would create...yet it hasn't created a deflationary spiral of non-spending. ;)

Still, what if it really did happen, and people suddenly engaged in disproportionate saving? Well, first, interest rates would drop, which would reduce some incentives for that. Anyway, if people do decrease their spending, demand for luxury products goes down, and there's no sense in continuing to produce more than demand allows. What's wrong with that though? The reduction in supply begins to increase prices again, which encourages people to say, "Oh crap, I'd better spend my money now before it's worth nothing" according to your mental model...although really, I'd say it encourages people to say, "Meh. I'll wait for prices to go down again," and continue saving. Maybe they'll eventually buy the same luxury products again, or maybe not (in which case, were they really all that necessary? ;)). Either way, the increased savings lead to capital investment and people being able to realize new companies to produce goods/services that are or will be in high demand (and those new companies can reduce the unemployment caused by the downswing in demand for another company's product).
 
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no inflation raises the risk of our economy slipping into deflation or a deflationary spiral; decreases in prices causes wages to fall and less goods to be produced, which causes prices to fall further causing further decreases in wages, goods production and employment

Can you please site one time that this has happened?(without a totally credit/fiat based currency)

Thanks.
 
???

In 1895 I could go to the tailor and buy a nice suit for an ounce of gold.
I can do the same today. Just harder to save up that much money today.

As I look around and see all this cheap shit made in china full of toxic chemicals...
We are not richer, commodities are price controlled, oil prices subsidized, and we live in an world full of fancy electronics made cheap by moore's law.

I want 20 acres of land. Sorry that will cost you a few million, and if you do get it then your going to have pay up big time every year for it. Perhaps I could interest you in an ipod? YAY we're 36% richer.

So I say to you... HOGWASH. We are moving backwards.
The monetary system and the IRS that came with it have got to GO.

in 1895 it took the average worker over a month of labor to be able to buy a bicycle, now it takes a day or two

the 20th century brought vast improvements in nearly every category

i have 30 acres and i didn't pay anything near a million for it
 
people are less likely to spend a dollar if they know it will be worth more in the future

Eventually there is a point when people decide to spend that money... What good does it do a person to just keep stockpiling money forever without realizing the fruits of your labor?? Besides, if they have it in savings, that means it is being lent out to businesses to expand the economy.

You seem to base a lot of your "theories" on the foundation of a credit based system as we have today.. Obviously things are different with sound money vs a totally fiat money, but you seem to carry over these "theories" from the fiat system and think that they are applicable in a sound money system.. (like a deflationary death spiral)
I suggest you learn to "think" rather that regurgitate lies that have been cast off as "facts" these past 100 years.

*maybe you should just stick to wine*
 
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Eventually there is a point when people decide to spend that money... What good does it do a person to just keep stockpiling money forever without realizing the fruits of your labor?? Besides, if they have it in savings, that means it is being lent out to businesses to expand the economy.

You seem to base a lot of your "theories" on the foundation of a credit based system as we have today.. Obviously things are different with sound money vs a totally fiat money, but you seem to carry over these "theories" from the fiat system and think that they are applicable in a sound money system.. (like a deflationary death spiral)
I suggest you learn to "think" rather that regurgitate lies that have been cast off as "facts" these past 100 years.

*maybe you should just stick to wine*

show me something i wrote that you think is a lie
 
Myth #1: Stability.

FR Act, 1913. WWI, 1914. Along with that, the Fed Gov got the right to TAX its citizen's INCOME. America enters a world war that is none of its business for the first time.

Where did the money come from to buy all these munitions? Then as now there were, the experts agreed, three basic ways to raise the money: (1) raising taxes, (2) borrowing from the public, and (3) printing money. In the Civil War the government had had simply printed the famous greenbacks. In World War I it was possible to "print money" in a more roundabout way. The government could sell a bond to the newly created Federal Reserve. The Federal Reserve would pay for it by creating a deposit account for the government, which the government could then draw upon to pay its expenses. If the government first sold the bond to the general public, the process of money creation would be even more roundabout. In the end the result would be much the same as if the government had simply printed greenbacks: the government would be paying for the war with newly created money.

Heavy reliance on the Federal Reserve meant, of course, that the stock of money increased rapidly. As shown in Table 1, the stock of money rose from $20.7 billion in 1916 to $35.1 billion in 1920, about 70 percent. The price level (GDP deflator) increased 85 percent over the same period.

In October 1917 Congress responded to the call for higher taxes with the War Revenue Act. This act increased the personal and corporate income tax rates and established new excise, excess-profit, and luxury taxes. The tax rate for an income of $10,000 with four exemptions (about $140,000 in 2003 dollars) went from 1.2 percent in 1916 to 7.8 percent. For incomes of $1,000,000 the rate went from 10.3 percent in 1916 to 70.3 percent in 1918. These increase in taxes and the increase in nominal income raised revenues from $930 million in 1916 to $4,388 million in 1918. Federal expenditures, however, increased from $1,333 million in 1916 to $15,585 million in 1918. A huge gap had opened up that would have to be closed by borrowing.

Then the first "bubble". The roaring 20s. The Stock Market Speculation Bubble. This, of course, led to The Great Depression. Since then, on average, there has been a recession every 4.5 years.

Myth #2: Full Employment. From 1900-1913 unemployment averaged 3%. Since the FR Act, the average unemployment in the US has been 4.5%, but that's aside from the Central Bank caused inflation/recession business cycles (there were 19 business cycles during the 20th century), during which recessions, the average unemployment was 10%, which, as mentioned earlier, occurred every 4.5 years on average, and skewed by the fact that the Fed changes the way it calculates inflation and unemployment at will.

Myth #3: Low Inflation. Since the Fed was handed control of the US Dollar, it has lost 98% of its original value. From 1900-1913, inflation was less than 1%. Since then, WWI, WWII, Korean "Police Action", Vietnam "Dominoes Game" all saw high double digit inflation and debt that will never be repaid. Even with the deflation of the Great Depression, the inflation rate has averaged 5 times what it was before the FR Act.

Myth #4: The member banks don't profit from top secret foreknowledge of wars, interest rates, money supply inflation/contraction, business cycle inflation/recession, the next bubble, etc.

Well, what the fuck does one say to that sort of imbecilic bullshit? I dunno.

Myth #5: All Fed Apologists cant kiss my ass. That is patently false... kiss away.

It's Miller Time.

Bosso
 
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