My Neighbors Just Ate their Dog (Seriously). What is the libertarian stance on this?

We are not way different than a Bonobo chimpanze (our closet living relative). They have distinct personalities, heightened emotions... happiness, sadness, even known to commit suicide... They have sex for pleasure and for conflict resolution, this was once thought a human only trait. They have the intelligence of a approximately a four year old or higher.

Bonobo's are very aware of themselves... there are many good documentary on the Bonobo chimp which are different than regular chimpanze.

All guilty of using confirmation bias. For instance, why do they quantify a bonobo's intelligence in terms of human years? Maybe chimp intelligence is nothing like human intelligence. Saying that something was "once thought a human only trait" does not mean anything. It just means our understanding has developed, not that the bonobo has developed. They can have all these things and still be a bonobo chimp. This is a far cry from evidence that we and the bonobo chimp have a common ancestor. You are purposefully using human traits to qantify a chimp's intelligence and characteristics because you have a specific goal in mind: justifying an evolutionary like between the two. This is called confirmation bias.
 
Thanks for the idea. The wife said I could make them again in the future. :)
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Ha! Awesomeness! If my gf hadn't decided on eggs benedict with real Canadian ham I would have had it this morning myself.
 
Well, yes, but it would violate the principles that so many anarchists and Paul supporters in general believe in. If we are no better than serial killers and would just prefer to not let them do what they feel is right, then we are initiating unjust aggression on them. I mean, it's fine if you think morality is subjective, I just want you to realize that you are no better than anyone else if you really believe this. It completely justifies the use of government force. There is nothing wrong with it. It's just that we would prefer that society be made up of people like us. Sound familiar? Hitler thought the same thing. It's not that we don't want authoritarian government, it's just that we want authoritarian government to display our moral principles. In your worldview, everyone is right. It's just that we would prefer our subjective moral standards be enforced and others not enforced.
And there-in lies the rub and justification for my words.

LAWS are created by man, and man is capable of error.

And within this we find many who will not leave others alone, and instead choose to stick their noses into the affairs of others while using the rule of LAW to force their "moral standards" upon others.

 
All guilty of using confirmation bias. For instance, why do they quantify a bonobo's intelligence in terms of human years? Maybe chimp intelligence is nothing like human intelligence. Saying that something was "once thought a human only trait" does not mean anything. It just means our understanding has developed, not that the bonobo has developed. They can have all these things and still be a bonobo chimp. This is a far cry from evidence that we and the bonobo chimp have a common ancestor. You are purposefully using human traits to qantify a chimp's intelligence and characteristics because you have a specific goal in mind: justifying an evolutionary like between the two. This is called confirmation bias.
Piltdown Man comes to mind ... We can justify what we wish to agree with, and find fault in what we disagree with, but neither resolution will fit the needs of everyone.
 
Also, I went through high school with much the same mentality, but I like to think I grew out of it.

Sarcasm I now see to be, in general, the language of the devil; for which reason I have long since as good as renounced it.
-Thomas Carlyle

Insults are not argument.
 
Sarcasm I now see to be, in general, the language of the devil; for which reason I have long since as good as renounced it.
-Thomas Carlyle

Insults are not argument.

Not an insult, nor is it sarcastic. I was being completely, genuinely serious.
 
All guilty of using confirmation bias. For instance, why do they quantify a bonobo's intelligence in terms of human years? Maybe chimp intelligence is nothing like human intelligence. Saying that something was "once thought a human only trait" does not mean anything. It just means our understanding has developed, not that the bonobo has developed. They can have all these things and still be a bonobo chimp. This is a far cry from evidence that we and the bonobo chimp have a common ancestor. You are purposefully using human traits to qantify a chimp's intelligence and characteristics because you have a specific goal in mind: justifying an evolutionary like between the two. This is called confirmation bias.

How else do you describe intelligence? Our only frame of reference is the human mind.

The fact that Bonobo's and Homosapiens have sex for pleasure is important... and this is just the tip of the iceburg with human-like traits. Don't get me wrong though, there is a chance that it could be just a coincidence, but it seems very unlikely to me.

If you think you can discount everything I just said by saying "confirmation bias" you are wrong. Because I looked at this issue objectively, seeking the truth, always to the best of my ability. I will be the first to admit that evolutionary theory is not 100%, especially a lot of the homonid discoveries, it seems like many of the skulls are similiar when they classify them as different species.

Watch the documentary on the Bonobos if you have an open mind about it, because seeing is believing... and then theres faith...
 
I feel sorry for the dogs. That neighbor is crazy. I would be worried what the guy may do if you challenge him. You may just want to move ASAP. Hope you move to a safer place for humans and pets.
 
I would be pretty mad if my supper got stolen by a neighbor...




In my opinion it's always good practice to kill animals as humanely as you possibly can, simply because there is no reason to cause suffering other than the desire to be cruel. Only cruel people hurt animals unnecessarily. However, I have no problem with anyone killing and eating a dog (or cat, or any other animal) and I think some people need become more accepting of other cultures.
 
since ron paulites are all for quoting gandhi when it seems necessary,let me add this quote "The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated."
 
since ron paulites are all for quoting gandhi when it seems necessary,let me add this quote "The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated."

precisely why I don't quote a pacifist who lived in the 20th century.
 
I would be pretty mad if my supper got stolen by a neighbor...
In my opinion it's always good practice to kill animals as humanely as you possibly can, simply because there is no reason to cause suffering other than the desire to be cruel. Only cruel people hurt animals unnecessarily. However, I have no problem with anyone killing and eating a dog (or cat, or any other animal) and I think some people need become more accepting of other cultures.

Well, I have done some local research and apparently the Government of Guam is in a state of total fucked-upness on this one which isn't surprising considering my experience here. They recently passed "tough" new laws on animal cruelty, making it a felony and encouraging citizens to report cases of abuse (apparently so they can ignore the reports). However, this did have the effect of getting them off the list of "Top Places to be an Animal Abuser" without actually doing anything or incurring any costs:

“Through the recent strengthening of its animal protection laws, Guam joined the list of U.S. jurisdictions with felony animal abuse penalties,” the release stated. “The new felony penalty applies to not only cases involving cruelty, but also neglect of an animal which results in his or her serious physical injury or death. In addition, Guam’s new law made animal abandonment a misdemeanor; authorized the law enforcement seizure of mistreated animals; and adopted robust standards of care for animals.”

http://mvguam.com/local/news/21976-guam-improves-in-animal-protection.html



However, if you want to eat your pet, while it is generally frowned upon, apparently there is no law preventing you from doing so. As far as laws against inhumane slaughter, there is total confusion/indifference within the local law enforcement and government which also is not surprising considering it takes the local police 20+ minutes to respond to an active shooter (ended up being a double murder-suicide) on an island 30 miles x 4-12 miles with of 1/3rd if that being within DoD bases and not covered.

http://mvguam.com/local/news/17550-killing-eating-of-stray-dogs-tackled.html

“We never got anybody to admit doing it and we sort of tried to research the law, which does not allow you to kill a dog unless it’s your dog. You can only kill a strange dog if that dog is in the act of attacking someone or destroying your property, the law does allow that,” he said.

“As I read it, unfortunately I don’t see anything there that prohibits you from consuming your own dog,” he added. “However, the laws do require humane slaughter, and that’s very hard to do with a dog.”

Animal ownership as far as dogs here is also a gray area. You have roaming packs of boonie dogs, friendly neighborhood pets that are fed but not "owned", actually owned and cared-for pets, and everything in between. In case "your" animal ever attacked and injured anyone, you could just say it was a stray and kill it with no legal accountability or keep what for all purposes is a pet, until you decide to eat it, in which case it becomes livestock with such a loose interpretation of what is considered a "humane slaughter," that it is not worth even enforcing in the eyes of local agencies.

In retrospect, had I known the obscurity of the law out here and that the animals were being eaten and were probably not even legal property of my neighbors (meaning that when they strayed onto my yard they were as much mine as theirs unless they were able to produce documentation to the contrary), I could have done things differently and those animals would have ended up at the animal shelter. If they were able to produce documentation that they owned the pets, I would also be able to report the abuse of the animals. That way, their right to eat what they assert is their property is maintained, while I can still exercise my right to catch and turn in what are for-all-purposes are strays to the animal shelter or report animal cruelty or inhumane slaughter if they maintain that they do in fact own it.
 
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I don't understand. Did you steal a dog and then called the cops on yourself? I'm glad your neighbor didn't press charges.
 
How else do you describe intelligence? Our only frame of reference is the human mind.

The fact that Bonobo's and Homosapiens have sex for pleasure is important... and this is just the tip of the iceburg with human-like traits. Don't get me wrong though, there is a chance that it could be just a coincidence, but it seems very unlikely to me.

If you think you can discount everything I just said by saying "confirmation bias" you are wrong. Because I looked at this issue objectively, seeking the truth, always to the best of my ability. I will be the first to admit that evolutionary theory is not 100%, especially a lot of the homonid discoveries, it seems like many of the skulls are similiar when they classify them as different species.

Watch the documentary on the Bonobos if you have an open mind about it, because seeing is believing... and then theres faith...

Just because the human mind is our only reference, doesn't mean that is THE only reference. This is a very narrow-minded approach. Even with your excuse, it still uses the confirmation bias by ignoring other possible frameworks for interpreting information that does not indicate in any way that your preconceived notions about the origins of human life are, in fact, true.

Your use of the word "coincidence" is misleading since it suggests there was a relationship in the first place. There are two ways to interpret the fact that humans and animals have similar traits. One is that they were all sprung from the primordial ooze, the other is that the same guy made them, God. Confirmation bias is a big problem because it encourages the use of facts that may not have anything to do with what you think it does in reality. Confirmation bias is a serious issue that has permeated and affected science and scientists for years. Good scientists know to avoid it, but evolutionary interpretation of fossils and geologic records basically requires it. The use of the world "species" in your post is also telling because it is a clear demonstration that you are putting these animals into categories, but you never stopped to think who is deciding what separates these stories, or maybe you do know and you just agree. In either case, it is a fatal conceit that also demonstrates confirmation bias.

It doesn't matter how objectively you think you are looking at an issue. If you interpret things with a preconceived notion that they happened a certain way, then you will come up with evidence that fits your theory when, in fact, it may suit a thousand different theories as well.

ETA: The confirmation bias doesn't just affect scientists... it affects everyone in almost every facet of life, and it has affected everyone since the beginning of our existence.
 
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since ron paulites are all for quoting gandhi when it seems necessary,let me add this quote "The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated."

That is a terrible quote. Gandhi doesn't know what he's talking about.
 
This is very telling. Mass murderers make up their own rules as they go along, too. Who are you to tell them that what they are doing is morally wrong? You can say it violates logical principles, but that doesn't make it wrong.

Well there's your problem right here.

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Hey, if your religion keeps you from becoming a mass murderer then please stick with it.
 
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