Motivation for Russian Invasion of Georgia.

[Fox McCloud]

There's a couple here (and on a radio program I listen to), also someone on Alex's show, and even a friend or so who thinks that this is a secret deal between Russia and the US, as in "we let you go after South Ossetia/Georgia and we won't interfere directly, but we will condemn you, if you'll let us go into Iran where you condemn us, but you don't directly intervene".

Who knows, at this point....that said, if we attack Iran within the next month, I'd say the plausibility of this situation just went way up.

That said, I'd still be worried about Russia suddenly saying "how dare you do this!" then directly intervene anyway.

 

[youngbuck]

That is an interesting theory, Fox.

I'm still leaning towards the idea that it was just a big mess up on part of the US using Georgia to indirectly attack Russia, and then blame it on Russia. Idk...

Right when I thought I was starting to understand the situation, Russia starts to pull out.

 

[heavenlyboy34]

Re: russia/Georgia conflict

Hello, all.

The misinformation campaign around this event is staggering. I have a close friend from Yelets, Russia. I'll quote you what she wrote to me about it and you can decide for yourself. (excuse the grammar-english is her second language):

"This is the chronology and you are to make conclusion yourself.

At the beginning of August Georgia, Soutn Osetia and Russia decided not to use force.

In Osetia there were only Russian peace keepers (not from other countries)

At night of August,7 (Mark: before the Olimpic Games) Georgia fired the capital of Osetia Tshinvali from all possible guns, mortars and other weapons WITHOUT any notifying and bombed the town all the night.

During only this night about 2000 civil people were killed and the city was practically destroyed.

Russia did not do any military actions. On August, 7 on Russian initiative they called UN Security Council, but it could not decide any thing. And during this time Georgia damaged 10 ossets villages.

In the afternoon Ossetia and Russia asked Georgia to allow humanitarian corridor for civil people but Georgia refused. Russia still did not do any military actions.

By the end of the day about 35,000 refugees left Ossetia under bombing and firing. Humanitarian corridor was not opened by Georgia.

In the evening August, 7 Russia announced that it will compel Georgian to peace with its military troops. Only at this moment Russian military troops began to enter Ossetia (by the way, not more than it was written in the treaty between Georgia and Russia about the number of Russian peace keepers). And they began to fight with Georgian troops.

It was all the night, but losses of Georgian civil people are close to none because the Russians attacked only military objects.

On August, 8 Security Council was summoned on Georgian initiative and again in didn't decide anything.

On the August, 9 it called the third time and decided to send observers to the zone of conflict. Only after that Georgia opened humanitarian corridor.

Many volunteers from Abkhazia, Chechnya and Russia want to go and help the Ossets. Besides Chechnya already sent its military troops to help the Ossets.

During 10-11 of August Georgian military troops were forced out from Tshinvali and villages.

On August, 11 Saakashvili had to sign stopping of firing, but the Georgian still fired till August, 12.Oficcial information says that Ossetia lost more than 2000 civil people, and Georgia's losses are minimal (by the way even BBC World does not give the number of Georgian civil people lost).

Today French President came to Russia and proposed a variant of adjustment, Russia signed it and tomorrow Sarkazi will take it to Georgia.

And now something from history of these peoples when they were in Russian Empire. In the 19 century the Georgians all the time tried to assimilate the Ossets and even Russian tsar had to confirm Ossetic national identification and forbade Georgian to do it.



I saw on TV the conference of the UNO. Almost all the members, how their countries, accuse Russia of attack of Georgia, all say as if to our government came into the head intervene in the territory of Georgia having for the object effect for Georgia. All the world community says that and seems that the West doesn't know that Russia isn't the initiator or doesn't want to. It was about two days ago. But now the situation hasn't changed much, I think.



The thing is that America accuses Russia of intervention in Georgia but all the conflict looks as if America is on Georgian side, strictly speaking Georgia on American side and under American influence and Saakashvili never would have done all this without US' backing him.

This is what I can say of this conflict. As you see it's not simple.



I think in the USA it looks the wrong side out. "

 

[DAFTEK]

^I'm just amazed that CNN is not covering this and just lying to the American people with fake videos and making Georgia the victim here, it's so easy to blame big Russia the bully and the world will buy it like some brainwashed people even here on RPF sadly!

 

[DAFTEK]

Personally i believe these events and all the events of this year that has been constant 24/7 news on CNN like Issue #1 your money, high gas prices, the housing collapse, financial collapse are just smoke screens to get ready for the war with Iran, it started all with 9/11-Afghanistan-Iraq-Russia/Georgia-China/Burma-Kosovo/Serbia-Israel/Iran/USA? i don't know but it all smells, too many huge events in the past few years and especially 2007/2008

 

[Sarge]

I think there is more to this all, then meets the eye.

Note the following,

"The attacks originally starting to take place several weeks before the actual “intervention” with Georgia President’s web site coming under DDoS attack from Russian hackers in July, followed by active discussions across the Russian web on whether or not DDoS attacks and web site defacements should in fact be taking place, which would inevitably come as a handy tool to be used against Russian from Western or Pro-Western journalists."

Why was this taking place several weeks ago? Did they know something?

Just google to read about the cyber attack.

 

[KewlRonduderules]

I have been reading here about how the Georgians were at fault for the attack and how they were backed by the US. I know there is a lot of anti- US foreign policy out there for valid reasons given our fiascos in Iraq and Afghanistan. However, I think we need to be cautious about WHO started this mess.

On one side it is alleged that the Georgians started this by invading South Ossetia back by USA or Israeli interests. However, I am not entirely convinced that is true. Moreover, there has been a cyber warfare campaign to put Russia as the innocent justic seeker out there. I personally don't buy it.

There is also another side something which many people want to disregard and I think it is due to the anti-US foreign policy attitude out there (Note: I am definitely no fan of US foreign policy either- we should be minding our own business but since I've noticed so much information in favor of Russia, I thought I should comment).

I have personal contacts from Georgia. What you are not hearing is that a lot of this conflict started in the last few weeks and months prior to the invasion. South Ossetian rebels had been firing on Georgian villages. The Georgian president did indeed attempt to negotiate a cease fire but South Ossetia backed out. Meanwhile, they continued to bomb Georgian villages. And he was quoted as saying just prior to the invasion that he had no intention of invading South Ossetia. However, the attacks continued to escalate to the point of war. At which point, he had no choice but to invade as a desperate attempt to curtail the violence.

This is the bait Russia needed in order to invade Georgia. The South Ossetian rebels are directly funded by Russia. So in this sense, they were acting as pawns and Georgian forces fell right into the trap.

I personally don't buy that the US was involved in any invasion. The US is stretched thin with limited resources spending it all in Iraq and Afghanistan. So my question is how can the US financially and militarily support another conflict. They can't! And Russia knows this and used this as an opportunity to to reclaim its power in the region. They felt threatened by Georgia given that they wanted to join NATO and more importantly, to ensure their grasp of the region's oil production. That is why they did what they did.

The article below was written just prior to the Georgian offensive in South Ossetia- hopefully, you will see that there is more to the story than meets the eye:

OSSETIAN SEPARATISTS ARE PROVOKING A MAJOR RUSSIAN INTERVENTION

By Pavel Felgenhauer

Thursday, August 7, 2008


Military tension in Georgia's separatist region of South Ossetia has been building up for several months. In June the head of the OSCE Mission to Georgia Teri Hakala told me in Tbilisi that military clashes were happening on an almost daily basis, that OSCE monitors are also being attacked and that the "sides are not speaking." Since then the situation has gotten worse. Last week the tension escalated into clashes that left at least six Ossetians dead and dozens of Ossetians and Georgians wounded (Interfax, August 1). Further shooting incidents have been reported. The Georgians say the Ossetian claims are exaggerated, but all agree that tension is high and further escalation is possible (RIA-Novosti, August 5, 6).

The latest outbreak of hostilities began on July 31 after two roadside bombs hit a Georgian police Toyota SUV near the Georgian village of Eredvi. Six Georgian policemen were wounded (Interfax, August 1). Russian peacekeepers, according to the Russian Defense Ministry, discovered that the bombs were made out of 122 mm artillery shells (www.mil.ru, August 2). The road leading to Eredvi was built by the Georgians to bypass Ossetian roadblocks near the South Ossetian capital of Tskhinvali. Last November I traveled that road in a similar Toyota to visit the Georgian-controlled part of South Ossetia. This road has been a thorn in the side of the Ossetian separatists for some time. On July 4 a car with the pro-Georgian leader of South Ossetia Dmitry Sanakoyev, whom the separatists consider a renegade, was hit by a roadside bomb and shot at on the same road in almost the same spot. Three bodyguards were wounded, but Sanakoyev was unhurt. A surge of tension followed the attack (RIA-Novosti, July 4; Kommersant, August 4).

The roadside bomb attack on July 31 was followed the next day by bloody clashes. Both sides accused the other of initiating the fighting. The Ossetians admitted six dead and 15 wounded, many hit by sniper fire. The Georgians admitted nine wounded. Both sides accused the other of using mortar fire. The Ossetians announced that 29 Georgian solders had been killed but did not substantiate the claim (RIA-Novosti, August 4). The Ossetians began an evacuation of women and children to North Ossetia (a Russian autonomous republic), called for volunteers from the North Caucasus to join the fight against Georgia, and threatened to attack Georgian cities and to cleanse the Georgian forces out of South Ossetia. The South Ossetian President Eduard Kokoity claimed that Georgians living in South Ossetia were begging to be "liberated" from the forces of the regime in Tbilisi (RIA-Novosti, August 2, 3, and 4).

Kokoity has announced that some 300 volunteers have arrived in South Ossetia to fight the Georgians and that more are coming (www.newsru.com, August 5). Most of the “volunteers” seem to be South Ossetians that were serving in police and other militarized formations in North Ossetia and were sent south as reinforcements. Kokoity has ordered that these “volunteers” be integrated into the South Ossetian Interior Ministry forces (RIA-Novosti, August 6). Yesterday the Ossetians were reporting fierce battles with Georgian forces, while Georgian authorities and Russian peacekeepers reported only shooting incidents in which no one was injured (Interfax, August 6).

The Ossetian authorities have announced the cancellation of a planned meeting with the Georgian side in Tskhinvali on August 7, while the Russian Foreign Ministry said that it believed the meeting had to go ahead (RIA-Novosti, August 6). Russian peacekeepers say that after the initial flare up of fighting on August 1, the situation in South Ossetia has somewhat calmed. The Ossetians insist that it is getting worse (Interfax, August 6). High-ranking Russian officials, including President Dmitry Medvedev and Prime Minister Vladimir Putin, have remained silent about the conflict in South Ossetia.

A public gap has opened between the Ossetian and Russian authorities. The South Ossetian spokeswoman Irina Gagloyeva has publicly expressed dismay: "War is coming, but everyone, including Russia, is turning a blind eye. Russian statements are not helping us" (Kommersant, August 5).

Moscow may have been considering supporting a limited operation against Georgian forces (say, in the Kodori Gorge in Abkhazia) that would undermine the present Georgian government of President Mikheil Saakashvili but could be presented to the world as Abkhaz separatist forces acting on their own (see EDM, May 2). In South Ossetia, no limited action is possible. The Georgians are holding back from outright offensive action, but if the Ossetians succeed in provoking a major confrontation, they will be in trouble. Tskhinvali is semi-surrounded by Georgian positions and is virtually indefensible. To prevent the fall of Tskhinvali thousands of Russian troops with hundreds of pieces of armor must invade South Ossetia through the Rokki tunnel and be rushed forward. High casualties are possible and this would be a clear act of aggression.

Kokoity and other Ossetian officials seem to be bent on provoking a major Russian intervention, but apparently not everyone in Moscow is ready to plunge headlong into war.

http://www.jamestown.org/edm/article.php?article_id=2373294

 

[brandon]

It looks like they almost have them surrounded

 

[ARealConservative]

South Ossetia is only a part of Georgia because Stalin made it so - likely to help thwart future separatist movements by forcing divisive ethnic groups into the national makeup.

The bottom line is they are fighting a war over boundaries put in place by a brutal communist regime.

95% of South Ossetians don't want to be Georgian, and they are only Georgian because Stalin made them a part of Georgia.

Seems like a simple solution - allow for self determination to win out.

 

[DAFTEK]

Michael Saakashvili secret weapon? CNN News! I hope Russia stands firm on this and take him down! This puppet murdered people in South Ossetia and our Media is just as guilty for not reporting this! SHAME CNN!

 

[LibertyCola]

Georgia invaded South Ossetia, despite what the MSM would like you to believe.




P.S. Alex Jones is an incompetent pile of crap and I hope he dies a long terrible death.

 

[PatriotG]

Personally i believe these events and all the events of this year that has been constant 24/7 news on CNN like Issue #1 your money, high gas prices, the housing collapse, financial collapse are just smoke screens to get ready for the war with Iran, it started all with 9/11-Afghanistan-Iraq-Russia/Georgia-China/Burma-Kosovo/Serbia-Israel/Iran/USA? i don't know but it all smells, too many huge events in the past few years and especially 2007/2008

 

[DAFTEK]

 

[PatriotG]

This should make Russia really happy!

US and Poland sign defence deal

 

[dannno]

Georgia invaded South Ossetia, despite what the MSM would like you to believe.




P.S. Alex Jones is an incompetent pile of crap and I hope he dies a long terrible death.

Ok, so why was he one of the only media outlets in the US to report what you just said?

 

[revolutionary8]

To understand what is going in the world on just ask yourself one question: “How does this move the world towards a one world government?”


The central bank of Russia is the real ruler of Russia just as the Federal Reserve is the ruler of the US. Also every country has a central bank which controls that country including Georgia. So the bankers tell the presidents what they are going to do and they just have to do it.

Russia had been practicing war games and building up militarily for the invasion for more than 4 months. This was planned a long time ago. Also the US had especial forces training Georgian forces and providing them with weapons etc. Things like this need preparation, meaning that a plan had to be put in place, meaning that these things don’t happen spontaneously.

Just as the purpose of the economic crisis and the destruction of the dollar are to create the NAU and thus, bringing the world closer towards a one world government the coming WWIII also serves the purpose of a one world government.

When the world is devastated by the war the World Bank gang will propose a one world government to end all war over land. Also they will push a one world currency, which will be controlled by the World Bank. They will create the money and control the money supply of the whole world in a more centralized, more organized, manner.




/

I think you nailed it.
Meanwhile, we have pawns from "all sides" caught in the middle. US media demonizes Russia, Russian media demonizes Georgians/US and waaa la- WW3 instigated by propaganda.

I think it is absolutely imperative to see the propaganda coming from both sides- but see the bits of truth in the big lie. If we keep your question in mind, soon we will have a better grasp on the rolls that the character actors choose and why.
I do think there are protagonists and antagonists in every story, but regardless, it's all an act put in to production by the executive producers (Globalists)

 

[revolutionary8]

I googled Russia, Bilderberg and found this:

Tuesday, December 12, 2006
RUSSIA AND BILDERBERG
Below is a list of Russian Bilderbergers from 1991 - 2006. In all I count six individuals, one of whom, Lilia Shevtsova, has attended FOUR times. She is associated with the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace in Moscow.
(lists consulted are at Tony Gosling's Bilderberg website)


2005 Nemirovskaya, Elena; Founder and Director, Moscow School of Political Studies

2004 Shevtsova, Lilia; Senior Associate. Carnegie Endowment for International Peace
2004 Yavlinsky, Grigory A.; Member of Parliament

2003 Shevtsova, Lilia; Senior Associate, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace
2003 Margelov, Mikhail V.; Chairman, Committee for Foreign Affairs

2002 Shevtsova, Lilia; Senior Associate, Carnegie Moscow Center

2001 Shevtsova, Lilia; Carnegie Endowment for International Misery, Visiting Professor, University of California at Berkeley & Cornell University

2000 NOBODY

1999 Shevtsova, Lilia; Carnegie Moscow Center
1999 Trenin, Dmitri V.; Carnegie Moscow Center

1998 Chubais, Anatoli B.; Former First Vice Prime Minister; Chairman RAO EES

1997 NOBODY

1996 NOBODY

1995 NOBODY

1994 NOBODY

1993 NOBODY

1992 no attendee list available

1991 NOBODY

You will see that Bilderberg was not that interested in Russia in the 1990's, probably because Yeltsin was their pisshead-in-chief and was quite happy selling off Russian state assets at bargain prices for a shot of Vodka, and it would seem that Putin was also being groomed by Berezovsky.

But then Putin came to power in 2000, changed the plan, and is now taking back what was stolen.

The two organisations represented at Bilderberg are the Carnegies and the Moscow School of Political Studies.

The reason for Carnegie is self-evident in the name.

On the board of MSPS in 2005 was Mikhail Khodorkovsky before he was sent down. Sponsors of MSPS include Open Russia Foundation, which opened in 2001 in London, of all places. I wonder why London?

But who is on the board of ORF?

Mikhail Khodorkovsky
Dr Henry Kissinger
Lord Jacob Rothschild

According to the Yukos website, "The motivation for the establishment of the Open Russia Foundation was to foster openness, understanding, and integration between the people of Russia and the rest of the world."

Yeah, right!

Other sponsors of MSPS are George Soros' Open Society bollocks, and Morgan Stanley.

Another board member is Lord Robert Skidelsky at Warwick Uni, who was at Bilderberg 2005.

Today we read that Shell is being forced to sell its stake in Sakhalin-2, and there are fears at BP that it could be forced out of its Russian projects too.

And we know who controls both Shell and BP from behind the scenes, don't we?

Was Litvinenko done in to pressure Putin to stop this, and now that he isn't then the pullout is now being made to look like Russia is a thug in taking back its own natural resources?

As is reported by 2005 Bilderberg attendees to Daniel Estulin,
"A European banker pointed out that Russia could effectively devalue the dollar by re-denominating its energy trade with Europe from dollars into euros, forcing Europe's central banks to rebalance their foreign exchange reserves in favour of the euro. Jean-Claude Trichet, governor of the European Central Bank was present during the debate."

"The discussion began with a European expert on international relations pointing out that over the next several years Russia is poised to assert itself and to increasingly challenge the Bush administration's foreign policy goals. Someone openly asked the committee if the world is safer today than in 2001 and will it be safer in four years time? A Dutchman responded by saying there is little doubt that the hand of international terrorism has been substantially strengthened by the US and its heavy-handed policy in the Middle East. "

--------------------------------

One thing that does concern me though is that I think a strong Russia is required for Pike's WW3. According to Pike's plan Communism was supposed to be held in check until "the final cataclysm". I currently see Putin rebelling against the Rothschilds, the British Monarchy and their cronies. But I also see that it could also be part of the plan in strengthening Russia.

posted by TheTruthMan at 8:28 AM

http://thetruthserumblog.blogspot.com/2006/12/russia-and-bilderberg.html

AFAIK, there were no Putin reps at 2008 or 2007 Bilderberg.

 

[PatriotG]

From Pravda Online

Mr. Bush, Enough!!



Ahh yes the world loves us.

 

[Imperial]

I think you nailed it.
Meanwhile, we have pawns from "all sides" caught in the middle. US media demonizes Russia, Russian media demonizes Georgians/US and waaa la- WW3 instigated by propaganda.

I think it is absolutely imperative to see the propaganda coming from both sides- but see the bits of truth in the big lie. If we keep your question in mind, soon we will have a better grasp on the rolls that the character actors choose and why.
I do think there are protagonists and antagonists in every story, but regardless, it's all an act put in to production by the executive producers (Globalists)

I don't think it is really an act. Situations like this, historically speaking, are bound to happen. The historical reality is that the Caucasus and the Balkans are in kind of an ethnic shatter belt, something bound to happen when so many nations since the Mongol invasions have competed for places like Bosnia, Georgia, Armenia, and Serbia.

When the Ottoman Empire sponsored Islam and, more importantly, supported Muslim groups already in the Caucusus, the scene was set for distinct warfare that was inevitable, especially when Tsarist Russia entered the mix.

The fact that Russia seized on this seam is logical, because now is the perfect moment while the US is bogged down in Iraq, Afghanistan, and maintaining incendiary language at Iran.

Of course, the US has gotten the benefit of a big push on its NMD plan for Poland and Czech Republic, since you know, those countries used to be dominated like Georgia was. At least, this is because of foolish media.

Luckily for Russia, it knows the US will not, and cannot, attack it. It has extended its interests on too many fronts to be feasible. It won't make it to WWIII, b/c that is far too direct and decisive for the world system. However, multiple small conflicts and tense diplomacy creates a situation where the elite can flourish, without having to directly cooperate with each other, similar to how the free market functions but in a perverse manner.

The problem is that it will eventually explode, not in the interest of special interests, but at everybody's disadvantage.