Mises Caucus Coup D’Etat

[The Northbreather]

Mises Caucus Coup D’Etat

There’s rumblings about a takeover of the L.P. by the Mises Caucus/Ron Paul types. Many of the people with large followings and influence are talking about starting up the Ron Paul Revolution 2.0.

They seem to be tired of the LP pandering to the left and trying to win influence by adapting to the current system. They’re all about purging the so called “left libertarians” and restoring an idealistic plank. They haven’t said exactly what the plan is but have mentioned that something big is in the works.

End the lockdowns
End the Fed
End all corporate Welfare
End the warfare state etc

Dave Smith is in,
Pete Quinones
Eric July
Angela McArdle

I’m guessing Tom Woods and Jeff Diest are advising as well?

If anybody has more info on who or what is going on please clue us in and I’ll add the info to this post.

 

[r3volution 3.0]

There’s rumblings about a takeover of the L.P. by the Mises Caucus/Ron Paul types. Many of the people with large followings and influence are talking about starting up the Ron Paul Revolution 2.0.

They seem to be tired of the LP pandering to the left and trying to win influence by adapting to the current system. They’re all about purging the so called “left libertarians” and restoring an idealistic plank. They haven’t said exactly what the plan is but have mentioned that something big is in the works.

End the lockdowns
End the Fed
End all corporate Welfare etc

Dave Smith is in,
Pete Quinones
Eric July

I’m guessing Tom Woods is advising as well.

If anybody has more info on who or what is going on please clue us in and I’ll add the info to this post.

If this is a fight between thick and thin libertarians, then viva la thin libertarians.

But, if this is just a fight between different kinds of thick libertarians, left and right....



Wake me when they get their heads out of their asses.

 

[The Northbreather]

If this is a fight between thick and thin libertarians, then viva la thin libertarians.

But, if this is just a fight between different kinds of thick libertarians, left and right....



Wake me when they get their heads out of their asses.

I’ve listened to thousands of conversations and interviews with these people and they are aligned at least with my philosophy.

They may be considered radical by many who claim to be libertarian because they actually believe in and promote liberty..

Like myself they’ve been avoiding the LP for some time now because it’s been such a letdown and embarrassment.

 

[jmdrake]

If this is a fight between thick and thin libertarians, then viva la thin libertarians.

But, if this is just a fight between different kinds of thick libertarians, left and right....



Wake me when they get their heads out of their asses.

What is a "thick" or "thin" libertarian?

 

[jmdrake]

There’s rumblings about a takeover of the L.P. by the Mises Caucus/Ron Paul types. Many of the people with large followings and influence are talking about starting up the Ron Paul Revolution 2.0.

They seem to be tired of the LP pandering to the left and trying to win influence by adapting to the current system. They’re all about purging the so called “left libertarians” and restoring an idealistic plank. They haven’t said exactly what the plan is but have mentioned that something big is in the works.

End the lockdowns
End the Fed
End all corporate Welfare etc

Dave Smith is in,
Pete Quinones
Eric July

I’m guessing Tom Woods is advising as well.

If anybody has more info on who or what is going on please clue us in and I’ll add the info to this post.

Post 2008 the rallying cry was "take over the GOP." Now post 2020 it's "take over the LP." Sights lowered much?

 

[Invisible Man]

Post 2008 the rallying cry was "take over the GOP." Now post 2020 it's "take over the LP." Sights lowered much?

Yeah, the phrase coup d'etat loses a lot of its punch when the etat in question is just the LP.

This is probably on a similar level with getting Ron Paul to win a straw poll, and not the Iowa one, a lesser one.

 

[jmdrake]

Yeah, the phrase coup d'etat loses a lot of its punch when the etat in question is just the LP.

This is probably on a similar level with getting Ron Paul to win a straw poll, and not the Iowa one, a lesser one.

Like Ron Paul winning the CPAC straw poll is 2011?

https://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/13/us/politics/13cpac.html

 

[trey4sports]

I just had a phone conversation on Friday with a well-known LP activist who told me about the plan for 2024. He did ask that I not breathe a word of what I was told and I will honor that. In the past couple of weeks I have bought memberships in both the national and state LP as well as joined and donated to the Mises Caucus. I would recommend that anyone interested in libertarianism do the same.

 

[The Northbreather]

Post 2008 the rallying cry was "take over the GOP." Now post 2020 it's "take over the LP." Sights lowered much?

No.

Talking about reclaiming the name and philosophy and party.

Bringing back hard dissent and ideas the will be considered seditious by the status quo.

 

[Occam's Banana]

What is a "thick" or "thin" libertarian?

A "thin" libertarian is one who thinks that libertarian theory should be kept as minimal (and hence, as "thin") as possible. This is to be done by restricting the body of libertarian theory itself to the most basic and fewest necessary axioms, along with the "theorems" (such as the Non-Aggression Principle) which can be derived from that minimal set of basic axioms.

A "thick" libertarian, on the other hand, is one who thinks that libertarian theory should be expanded (and hence, "thickened") to formally include things like opposition to racism and support for "equality" (whatever that might mean).

For example, a "thin" libertarian may hate and denounce racism and will, of course, oppose racist policies that violate the NAP. But as a libertarian, he will oppose such racist policies as "unlibertarian" because they violate the NAP - not because they are racist. He might also oppose racist policies that do not violate the NAP because they are racist, but he will consider his opposition to them to be separate from his identity as a libertarian. He is willing to consider NAP-supporting racists to be libertarians, despite the fact that they are racists.

A "thick" libertarian, on the other hand, will insist that in order to be libertarian one must always hate and denounce racism and racist ideas and attitudes. As a libertarian, he will oppose any and all racist policies as "unlibertarian" regardless of whether they violate the NAP - because they are racist. He will consider his opposition to them to be part of his identity as a libertarian. He is not willing to consider NAP-supporting racists to be libertarians, because of the fact that they are racists.

"Thick" libertarians tend to be of the leftist variety, and some of them even support things like "universal basic income" in the name of "equality."

 

[Occam's Banana]

If this is a fight between thick and thin libertarians, then viva la thin libertarians.

But, if this is just a fight between different kinds of thick libertarians, left and right....



Wake me when they get their heads out of their asses.

I don't know to what extent the "thin" vs. "thick" angle plays into this, but my impression is that the "insurgents" (the Mises Caucus, Dave Smith, Tom Woods, et al.) are motivated by impatience with the LP's attempts to win acceptance from the Cathedral (and the dubious "respectability" that comes with that acceptance). They want more of no-holds-barred, fire-breathing opposition to lockdowns, the police state, wars & foreign aid/entanglements, etc. - and less of simping milquetoastery, bland and inoffensive appeals to lowest common denominators, and the playing of footsie with things like identity politics. (Given the latter, "thick" libertarians don't seem likely to be enthused by their program, for whatever that might be worth.)

 

[Working Poor]

Like myself they’ve been avoiding the LP for some time now because it’s been such a letdown and embarrassment.

Edit: I am completely disgusted by the libertarian party. They are worse than dems and repubs. I just get so angry when I think about them. My head is hurting from clicking on this thread.

 

[Invisible Man]

Edit: I am completely disgusted by the libertarian party. They are worse than dems and repubs. I just get so angry when I think about them. My head is hurting from clicking on this thread.

Wow. That's a strong statement. What makes them even worse then the Democrats and Republicans?

It seems to me that the scarcity of Libertarian Party members in elected offices alone makes them less bad than the Democrats and Republicans.

 

[oyarde]

What is a "thick" or "thin" libertarian?

thick are leftarians . Similar to the national leadership , closet commies.. Thin would be like an Indiana libertarian.

 

[Invisible Man]

thick are leftarians . Similar to the national leadership , closet commies.. Thin would be like an Indiana libertarian.

These words are easy to equivocate though. My impression is that among the current anti-libertarian majority of this forum's membership, the label "leftarian" is used for thin libertarians, and for that matter any actual libertarians.

 

[oyarde]

These words are easy to equivocate though. My impression is that among the current anti-libertarian majority of this forum's membership, the label "leftarian" is used for thin libertarians, and for that matter any actual libertarians.

there are very few actual libertarians still active here that i notice which is probably why ordinary conservatives have found the more prevalent leftarians distasteful but i'm only guessing .I am more of an old school big tent guy , i want everyone on board who isnt a leftist because that already eliminates so many people . as far as the national libertarian party goes I think the
time has come and gone and they missed it but who knows . Where I am its at least as strong as ever .

 

[Invisible Man]

there are very few actual libertarians still active here that i notice which is probably why ordinary conservatives have found the more prevalent leftarians distasteful but i'm only guessing .I am more of an old school big tent guy , i want everyone on board who isnt a leftist because that already eliminates so many people . as far as the national libertarian party goes I think the
time has come and gone and they missed it but who knows . Where I am its at least as strong as ever .

Are there any leftarians, in the sense of thick libertarians, defined the way Occam's Banana did above, posting here? If there are, I haven't noticed.

 

[RJB]

Lol. It's like 2008 again when the Stormfronters flooded the forum and feigned innocence with, "I am not a racist. I don't see any neonazis."

Now the biggest leftarians are saying, "I am not a leftarian. I don't see any."

If you are going to be something, own it. Be honest with others and yourself. If you have to come to this forum and pretend you are not what you truly are, that's just sad.

On the other hand, there are some so indoctrinated by the SJW propaganda in academia, they may actually be clueless.

 

[Invisible Man]

Lol. It's like 2008 again when the Stormfronters flooded the forum and feigned innocence with, "I am not a racist. I don't see any neonazis."

Now the biggest leftarians are saying, "I am not a leftarian. I don't see any."

If you are going to be something, own it. Be honest with others and yourself. If you have to come to this forum and pretend you are not what you truly are, that's just sad.

On the other hand, there are some so indoctrinated by the SJW propaganda in academia, they may actually be clueless.

I'm definitely the furthest thing from a leftarian, at least within libertarian circles.

What is it that you think constitutes a "leftarian"? I wonder if your answer may prove the point I made above.

 

[Working Poor]

Wow. That's a strong statement. What makes them even worse then the Democrats and Republicans?

It seems to me that the scarcity of Libertarian Party members in elected offices alone makes them less bad than the Democrats and Republicans.

Well if they weren't screwing off they would be in office countering theses !@#$ers