MAJOR ANNOUNCEMENT: Lawyers for Ron Paul Lawsuit NOTE: Having the lawsuit not up 4 debate

[SteveT1736]

I didn't know about Daily Paul until a couple weeks ago. I'm not aware of a legal site that discusses cases like this.

My original thought was that I could provide some legal perspective on what was happening.

I've become more emotionally engaged the more I've seen the distance between what Mr. Gilbert claims and what I'm seeing in the Court filings/docket. I really don't understand why he is doing what he is doing. I don't get the motive.

 

[sailingaway]

I don't get his motive entirely either, but I've stopped trying to figure it out because there was nothing I could do about it.

 

[SteveT1736]

On a more positive note, I had a chance this evening to read the Maine complaint. The draft is much stronger than Mr. Gilbert's efforts. At least I can say that I don't see any obvious procedural defects.

 

[SteveT1736]

I was just sent Mr. Gilbert's tweets. Essentially, he claims this all part of some master plan to get the Judge to expedite the case.

That is pretty inaccurate. None of this really has to do with getting a faster decision. He is battling (and has placed himself at considerable disadvantage) to stay before the Court.

 

[sailingaway]

I was just sent Mr. Gilbert's tweets. Essentially, he claims this all part of some master plan to get the Judge to expedite the case.

That is pretty inaccurate. None of this really has to do with getting a faster decision. He is battling (and has placed himself at considerable disadvantage) to stay before the Court.

I evaluate what happens in court not in his tweets. He wouldn't be the first person in the world to say he'd planned whatever occured, and that is neither here nor there regarding what happens tomorrow.

 

[sailingaway]

On a more positive note, I had a chance this evening to read the Maine complaint. The draft is much stronger than Mr. Gilbert's efforts. At least I can say that I don't see any obvious procedural defects.

Why did you read it?

 

[SteveT1736]

I was sent the link. That complaint is structured correctly. Pleads facts that, if accurate, would arguably be grounds for a decision. Outlines legal grounds that could result in a favorable decision.

 

[devil21]

No way the RNC gets legal fees. Judge would have to rule the case itself frivolous and that's not going to happen. Judge knows there's merit to the case. Whether Gilbert is a good attorney or not doesn't negate the merits of the case itself.

Definitely curious to see what happens tomorrow.

 

[SteveT1736]

devil21 -- There is some authority for the proposition that a complaint that can't provide facts sufficient to survive a motion for dismiss is inherently frivolous.

Remember that the case right now is at the stage where the plaintiffs have to plead sufficient facts to justify further inquiry into the facts alleged. Judge Carter dismissed previously because he only saw one alleged fact that was in itself insufficient. The current version has no alleged facts at all.

Only after this stage does the Court begin looking at whether the facts are accurate or not.

 

[sailingaway]

I was sent the link. That complaint is structured correctly. Pleads facts that, if accurate, would arguably be grounds for a decision. Outlines legal grounds that could result in a favorable decision.

but only addresses one state not the pattern and practice across the nation. whatever, we will see what happens.

 

[RonRules]

Couple more Gilbert Tweets:

USA_Patriot_Press ‏@USA_Free_Press
Yes we are taking big time risks. We always knew that!


USA_Patriot_Press ‏@USA_Free_Press
If someone has the minute order then they also can see my Response. What does it tell you that they are not disclosing my Response?

 

[RonRules]

Just because the RNC did not submit a reply to the 2nd amended complaint, I will now entertain intentional sabotage conspiracies.

Seems like the RNC already knows it's not even worth replying. Why would they know that? Why was the 2nd complaint cleared of all facts, when the judge expressly requested more facts? Why was the appeal filed forcing Gilbert in a corner?

It's starting to get a bit too much for me.

 

[RonRules]

Couple more Gilbert Tweets:

USA_Patriot_Press ‏@USA_Free_Press
Yes we are taking big time risks. We always knew that!

That particular Tweet is what pissed me off. He continually said early on that there was NO RISK.

 

[sailingaway]

That particular Tweet is what pissed me off. He continually said early on that there was NO RISK.

I never set expectations based on the tweets. I would have gone a different direction from day one, for a variety of reasons, but this guy brought a suit to court and no one brought the fraud/abuse/make them live by their rules, dammit, case to court that I invisioned. However, we will find out soon enough where this is going and there is no use either way second guessing it at the moment, imho.

 

[ord33]

That particular Tweet is what pissed me off. He continually said early on that there was NO RISK.

Yep, I remember him saying in an interview that this preemptive appeal was a way of essentially hedging his bets and trying to make sure the case moved forward quickly. He made it sound like it was the prudent, normal, and justifiable thing to do at the time of the interview. He definitely didn't portray it at the time as "taking big time risks".

As far as Mr. Gilbert's second tweet you posted, didn't SteveT say that the Response was in fact posted? If so, what in the world is Gilbert talking about. For reference, see SteveT's post: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...-up-4-debate&p=4591068&viewfull=1#post4591068

 

[libertylastchance]

His reply is that the judge doesn't understand court filings.. it's a writ of appeal... and the higher court needs to tell the lower court what to do!

 

[libertylastchance]

Good summary...

 

[sailingaway]

His reply is that the judge doesn't understand court filings.. it's a writ of appeal... and the higher court needs to tell the lower court what to do!

the question is whether you need a final judgment to file a writ from.

We'll see what happens.

 

[CPUd]

____

USA_Patriot_Press ‏@USA_Free_Press

The plan has been execututed with precision. Either we get a date for Final Argument or we get dismissed not by the RNC but by the Judge.

 

[devil21]

devil21 -- There is some authority for the proposition that a complaint that can't provide facts sufficient to survive a motion for dismiss is inherently frivolous.

Remember that the case right now is at the stage where the plaintiffs have to plead sufficient facts to justify further inquiry into the facts alleged. Judge Carter dismissed previously because he only saw one alleged fact that was in itself insufficient. The current version has no alleged facts at all.

Only after this stage does the Court begin looking at whether the facts are accurate or not.

I disagree that it has no alleged facts. The alleged facts are the VRA and the RNC counsel's own admission that they dont have to follow it. Whether thats a convincing argument for his honor is a different issue entirely. Fees are awarded usually when a suit is frivolous on its face. There's a genuine point of law here and the judge knows it. No fees will be awarded even if dismissed. I dont get Gilberts writ but Im not an attorney, i just play one on tv.

That particular Tweet is what pissed me off. He continually said early on that there was NO RISK.

A lawyer may have lied? No way I dont believe it. That never happens.


sorry for clogging up thread with this stuff