Laws, laws and more laws...

Freedomseeker

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Joined
May 1, 2009
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New here and hopefully not stepping on anyone's toes with this thread (maybe it has been brought up before, or recently).

I have tried, time and again, to find a group of people I can talk with about my concerns and questions, without it being out there and extreme. Feel like I have here...

I have a few questions about some things. I have researched this idea of "sovereignty", although there are some pretty radical people out there, who practice it and go way over (would rather find people who are practical about it all).

Here is my question. Is it possible to be a "sovereign citizen" as our founding fathers had in mind, and yet live within the laws we have, or is it impossible? Here is one shining example of my feelings and frustrations.

We take tents camping, and so we do go to parks where there are some amenities. We pay our share to use the park (I am ok with this for the idea of maintenance). We are of limited income, and with two kids who look forward to this, it is our one way to have some enjoyment. When we arrive, the first order is to find some firewood....

NO!! Park people have a fit and say you can't collect firewood, you have to buy it from them (OK, like I said, we live in the Pacific NW and it is FULL of dead wood, EVERYWHERE). This is state parks and also other.

As I said, we have limited funds and cannot keep putting $$$ out to buy this and buy that when we get there. I attempt to explain this, but they are really unreasonable about it (we have had to get a refund, pack up and leave for another spot due to the stinking rules!).

Another example. Where the heck have all the open spaces gone to all of the sudden? We live near a river in the NW and went to pick up a few buckets of sand (this is along a volcano drainage, and has umpteen feet of sand in every direction) to try to amend soggy soil for a vegetable garden (we want to be independent by doing something for ourselves), we cannot "buy" sand. As well, we BBQ by wood fire and wanted some of the washed down storm wood for it, and neither can be collected per the "rules" of this park, although this wood impeded beach goers in the summer (we felt we were doing a bit if a service by helping clear the rivers beach).

As I said, we live with a smaller income right now, and simply want to use the resources around us only for our own personal use, not to financially benefit, and find it outrageous that there is no such thing as an open space where one can collect wood, sand, rocks or such.

Why the HUGE amount of rules and laws, which makes it impossible for people like ourselves to do stuff that could better our lives and maybe just lift the financial burden on our limited budgets?

We love this country and all it was...seems that what it is now is not something we love at all. Can we Americans use the resources around us without impediment (life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness...), or do we have to fight for that now?
 
Hi and welcome. :)

"Is it possible to be a "sovereign citizen" as our founding fathers had in mind, and yet live within the laws we have, or is it impossible?"

I don't think it is possible, because of the laws we have.
 
Being a sovereign individual is to practise individual liberty - to be able to do anything, as long as it does not infringe upon someone else's rights. You "make your own laws" to govern your own life. It's really about self-ownership and self-responsibility.

If you can't even put up a shed in your own back yard without requiring a permit from the government, you cannot be a sovereign individual.

If you can't choose not to pay income taxes, you cannot be a sovereign individual.

If you can't choose to use holistic medicine or a drug because the FDA has criminalised it, you cannot be a sovereign individual.

If you can't claim the right to privacy on your own property without fear of a warrantless wiretap, you cannot be a sovereign individual.
 
Freedomseeker, how dare you attempt to steal from the Kings forest. You should know by now that the forests, rivers and beaches do not belong to the citizenry. The forests, rivers and beaches that have not been give to the U.N. for "Heritage" sites belong to our rulers and we should feel privileged to even be allowed to look at them.
 
Welcome to the board. You are not alone. No we are no longer sovereign
 
I'm aware that he wishes to become a sovereign. The sad fact is he is already a sovereign but is not allowed to act as one because the government is into control. My previous statements were meant as a light hearted attempt at saying the government believes it owns everything including us.
 
So much noise. Yes the courts are corrupt. But you can be sovereign in many ways. It gets harder everyday, but many of us are fighting the good fight. Stand up, or you are standing down.
 
Welcome aboard, I love the part about getting the sand for your garden. You know what your taxes are probably paying the army corps of engineers to excavate the sand fro the river bed somewhere.
A little story from around my area. Almost 30 years ago small gold miners could run their suction dredges on the rivers without permits. Then the state decided to institute a $5 permit fee to pay the DFG to see if dredging harmed the fisheries..
What does a dredge do? It sucks up the gravel on the river bed runs it through a sluice box and redeposits it on the river bed. The gravel is loosened and some of the silt is washed away. The fish love it and form schools around dredging operations to feed on the aquatic life dredged up.
The salmon runs were determined to be declining but not because of dredging, but the 500 foot dam the federal government put in, restricting the annual flooding. Now I must thank all of you for paying the the 10 of millions congress appropreated to hire contractors to rip out the trees along the river banks and rip up the gravel to loosen the streambed. River restoration it is called. It is the same thing dredgers were doing for free.

By the way Dredgers pay over $100 a season now for a dredge permit.
 
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