John Stossel: The Stupidity of "Buy American"

[torchbearer]

China is in a massive bubble right now, and will likely see economic stagnation in the future, for the record.

China labour costs soar as wages rise 22% October 25, 2011
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/25f1c500-ff14-11e0-9b2f-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1cyZVM11P

they also have a minimum wage that applies only to foreign companies.

 

[torchbearer]

China Credit Squeeze Prompts Suicides Amid Offer to Sever Finger
http://www.businessweek.com/news/20...mpts-suicides-amid-offer-to-sever-finger.html

 

[jmdrake]

people started making their own clothes were started to produce their own wealth. step one.
of course the technical/mechanical skills for complex devices and vehicles were missing for most- so the options were limited.
go with what you are good at.
instead of admitting we are in a system that destroys/steals wealth from the productive- we focus on what china is doing.
i think we should get the log jam out of our eye before we start talking about the splinter in theirs.

Mmmm....okay. I was talking about Kenya, but okay. You are 100% correct that will live in a system that destroys/steals wealth from the productive. A good example is what happened to small U.S. toy manufacturers in the wake of the China lead paint toy scare. Congress passed a law requiring all toys be tested for lead paint. Only you can't buy lead paint in the U.S. so it was only a problem for imported toys. Small domestic toy makers asked for an exemption because they said the new regulation would put some of them out of business. That exemption was denied. Mattel, however, got an exemption even though they were the company that imported the lead paint tainted toys from China in the first place. There's a lesson in there somewhere.

 

[torchbearer]

Mmmm....okay. I was talking about Kenya, but okay. You are 100% correct that will live in a system that destroys/steals wealth from the productive. A good example is what happened to small U.S. toy manufacturers in the wake of the China lead paint toy scare. Congress passed a law requiring all toys be tested for lead paint. Only you can't buy lead paint in the U.S. so it was only a problem for imported toys. Small domestic toy makers asked for an exemption because they said the new regulation would put some of them out of business. That exemption was denied. Mattel, however, got an exemption even though they were the company that imported the lead paint tainted toys from China in the first place. There's a lesson in there somewhere.

sorry, the context of my reply was in the entire context of my posts in this thread, not geographical response to your quote.

i mean, we still buy chocolates produced from slave labor. but i don't see anyone really upset outside the really informed which is <1%.

 

[Anti Federalist]

the goal of life is not to work. i don't want a job- i want to produce wealth. china doesn't keep me from doing that with their wall.

Real wealth is produced by making.

Real wealth is not made by deficit spending, lawyering, and printing money.

We're sitting around selling off 200 years of innovation and hard work, for pennies on the dollar and thinking we're rich.

It's like somebody's who has lost their job, on the brink of foreclosure, thinking they have found a bunch of wealth by selling all their shit on e-bay.

 

[torchbearer]

Real wealth is produced by making.

Real wealth is not made by deficit spending, lawyering, and printing money.

We're sitting around selling off 200 years of innovation and hard work, for pennies on the dollar and thinking we're rich.

It's like somebody's who has lost their job, on the brink of foreclosure, thinking they have found a bunch of wealth by selling all their shit on e-bay.

i guess i'm just privileged to have a functioning body and some basic capital tools at my disposal.
everyone else acts like china keeps them from wealth.

 

[Anti Federalist]

i guess i'm just privileged to have a functioning body and some basic capital tools at my disposal.
everyone else acts like china keeps them from wealth.

I'm not particularly upset at China.

They are following a plan in their best interests.

The same as the Germans, Koreans, Norwegians, Japanese and all the rest of the nations around the world that have not gone insane, like we have, running around blowing up places trying to kill bad guys that we created, they enact and follow policies that work in their best interest.

 

[specsaregood]

Real wealth is produced by making.
Real wealth is not made by deficit spending, lawyering, and printing money.

which category does making your living by selling "guaranteed" annuities fit into AF?

 

[Anti Federalist]

which category does making your living by selling "guaranteed" annuities fit into AF?

I suppose that is part of the making process, in that the annuities are raising capital for new operations.

 

[specsaregood]

I suppose that is part of the making process, in that the annuities are raising capital for new operations.

good answer.

on a side note, in my business 75% of our new customers this quarter have been foreign.....we're helping take down that trade deficit!

 

[chadhb]

the goal of life is not to work. i don't want a job- i want to produce wealth. china doesn't keep me from doing that with their wall.

Pathetic.

 

[Cutlerzzz]

Pathetic.

What's pathetic?

 

[anaconda]

I don't think we want all of the manufacturing jobs to return to the U.S. We should prefer to innovate, build early prototypes, then outsource the manufacturing. We need to innovate and train for new jobs, not protect the fading old ones. I am always amused when the politicians talk about bringing the manufacturing jobs back to America. This would be a sure path to third world status.

 

[nobody's_hero]

in a free market, a lost job is a natural resource reallocation.

No disagreement there. But what do you do when lost jobs are a byproduct of government policies?

Sorry, but I'm getting sick and tired of people thinking that we're witnessing some free market shift.

If you had to pay 50% more to sell a product to me, and I didn't have to pay anything to sell a product to you, it's no freaking wonder I could sell stuff cheaper. This goes for horses and buggies or automobiles. Textiles. Tech.

You can't advance your way out of a rigged system.

 

[torchbearer]

No disagreement there. But what do you do when lost jobs are a byproduct of government policies?

Sorry, but I'm getting sick and tired of people thinking that we're witnessing some free market shift.

If you had to pay 50% more to sell a product to me, and I didn't have to pay anything to sell a product to you, it's no freaking wonder I could sell stuff cheaper. This goes for horses and buggies or automobiles. Textiles. Tech.

You can't advance your way out of a rigged system.

the answer would be to change the congress to one that supports the constitution. the answer is not impose tariffs. that just give the corrupt gov. more money.
job loss in a unfree market is due to massive misallocation of resources. the job loss will be greater and more permanent.

 

[Krugerrand]

I didnt see any posts talking about voluntary choices by consumers. This thread reached 19 pages because it's obviously talking about the government stepping in....why would you think libertarians would argue over whether or not consumers have buying choices?

If someone wants to foolishly spend their money that encourages ineffiency that decreases wealth, that's their perogative.

It's been pointed out, but worth repeating. You look exceedingly foolish when you toss around insults based on what you believe people to have posted without actually reading what they post.

 

[Krugerrand]

the goal of life is not to work. i don't want a job- i want to produce wealth. china doesn't keep me from doing that with their wall.

Your means of producing wealth may very well end up impacted when China drops its dollar peg and the people to whom you would typically sell your goods or services can't afford to buy anything from you. Not to mention, it's mighty difficult to envision what the country will look like when foreign nationals own everything.

It's one thing to say that you are prepared for that. That's great for those who are. I find it exceedingly fair to want to try and preserve our country without it falling to pieces.

 

[torchbearer]

Your means of producing wealth may very well end up impacted when China drops its dollar peg and the people to whom you would typically sell your goods or services can't afford to buy anything from you. Not to mention, it's mighty difficult to envision what the country will look like when foreign nationals own everything.

It's one thing to say that you are prepared for that. That's great for those who are. I find it exceedingly fair to want to try and preserve our country without it falling to pieces.

i already have barter arrangements with many of my clients. one of the many ways to avoid taxes.

 

[Anti Federalist]

School and reality disconnect again.

Mainstream Economists: Ron Paul Is 'Dangerous'

Posted by Bill Anderson on November 9, 2011 11:20 AM

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/98471.html

To get a sense of just how intellectually and morally bankrupt mainstream academic economics has become, this article tells all, however unknowingly, since the author believes the quoted economists are correct:

Another professor who teaches at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, Michael Salemi, was able to identify statements from six candidates that "would earn failing grades in my Econ 101 class."

Salemi called Ron Paul's rationale for returning to the gold standard "one of the most dangerous ideas put forward by a politician in recent years." (emphasis mine)

All in all, the economists quote the Keynesian line as though it were Absolute Truth. One professor, for example, actually believes that Obama's "green energy" proposals are sound (although he admits they won't make for a good "jobs program.")

As one who has taught college economics for nearly 25 years, I can say that the mainstream approach is so preposterous and so skewed that it is unsalvageable. The college texts so revered in this article teach that competition is based upon homogeneity and any time there are similar but somewhat heterogeneous goods sold, that situation is a "market failure" that needs to be "corrected" by government. Furthermore, we are supposed to believe that there is no need for entrepreneurs, as government regulators are blessed with perfect information and always can arrive at "optimal solutions," as long as they seek the help of academic economists.

And notice the absolute reverence these people have for the Federal Reserve System. Yeah, it is quite rich to see clueless academic economists accusing Ron Paul of being "dangerous" because he wants sound money.

 

[Kregisen]

The free-trader argument is:

"Tariffs hurt the economy."

China is not hurt.

Questions?

This is the most ignorant post I've seen on RPF in months. Incredibly lacking in logic...

How do you know China isn't hurt?

Virtually all tariffs hurt the countries that impose them.

What you are saying is "tariffs decrease your score by 10 pts, but China has 100 pts, therefore tariffs dont decrease your score by 10 pts"

No, what that means is, China would be at 110 pts if it wasn't for tariffs. If this is the logic you're gonna be using, then this conversation is over. How can I expect you to go take an economics class when you can't even grasp 2nd grade logic?

As for the rest of you, I encourage you all to take economics classes or study it online.