John Stossel: The Stupidity of "Buy American"

[Krugerrand]

I think it makes perfect sense to buy apple juice from China. If our local orchards can't compete, too bad.

Think of how much our lifestyles will improve when 85% of the capital previously spent on apple juice is in China and 15% is saved to be invested in other things here in the US.

Don't worry for the slightest moment when those inefficient orchards are torn out and replaced with surplus housing. The dollar will never collapse. Chinese apple juice will always be cheaper (or even at least affordable). A time will never come when you cannot afford to buy apple juice from China and will need to grow apple trees for juice. And, fear not, if that unthinkable, impossible scenario did happen, you can trust that apple trees can produce juice in about two weeks after planting. (Fortunately, you can always count on that surplus housing to increase in value so that you can magically buy that Chinese apple juice.)

Also, don't worry about Sovereign Trust Funds. You need not worry about foreign entities owning your country. They'll always put your best interest first.

 

[specsaregood]

I think it makes perfect sense to buy apple juice from China. If our local orchards can't compete, too bad.

Think of how much our lifestyles will improve when 85% of the capital previously spent on apple juice is in China and 15% is saved to be invested in other things here in the US.

Don't worry for the slightest moment when those inefficient orchards are torn out and replaced with surplus housing. The dollar will never collapse. Chinese apple juice will always be cheaper (or even at least affordable). A time will never come when you cannot afford to buy apple juice from China and will need to grow apple trees for juice. And, fear not, if that unthinkable, impossible scenario did happen, you can trust that apple trees can produce juice in about two weeks after planting. (Fortunately, you can always count on that surplus housing to increase in value so that you can magically buy that Chinese apple juice.)

Also, don't worry about Sovereign Trust Funds. You need not worry about foreign entities owning your country. They'll always put your best interest first.

I think that is the argument (the non-sarcastic version) that most of the "protectionists" here are making.

 

[heavenlyboy34]

You mean Ron Paul is a control freak like John Stossel who is trying to tell people not to buy American? Yeah I said it. John Stossel is being a control freak. It's one thing to say "get rid of tariffs and let people trade with who they want". It's another to verbally attack people for making the choice to buy American. And for the idiots that say "Buy American means subsidizing inferior products", all I have to say is "poison led paint toys from China" and "acid filled drywall from China". Our own economy sucks because it is over-regulated, over-taxed and over-subsidized. But that doesn't mean those who say "To hell with globalism and the literal garbage we are sold" are wrong. I tell you what. Maybe people should "Watch Russian (as in Russia Today) so that John Stossel will be out of a job".

I didn't get the impression that Stossel was speaking in the imperative ("Don't buy American"). I got the impression that he was saying that the "Buy American" schtick is overrated and impractical.

One sign of economic ignorance is the faith that "Buy American" is the path to prosperity. My former employer, ABC News, did a week's worth of stories claiming that "buying American" would put Americans back to work.I'm glad I don't work there anymore.
"Buy American" is a dumb idea. It would not only not create prosperity, it would cost jobs and make us all poorer. David R. Henderson, an economist at the Hoover Institution, explained why.
"Almost all economists say it's nonsense," he said. "And the reason is: We should buy things where they're cheapest. That frees up more of our resources to buy other things, and other Americans get jobs producing those things."
This is what people always forget. Anytime we can use fewer resources and less labor to produce one thing, that leaves more for other things we can't afford. If we save money buying abroad, we can make and buy other products.

This is being a "control freak"? Hmm...I don't think so.

 

[Krugerrand]

I think that is the argument (the non-sarcastic version) that most of the "protectionists" here are making.

Well, as jmdrake's rep-worthy response above pointed out - Stossel was attacking the idea that there is ANY MERIT to supporting local business. That is beyond any idea of tariffs or trying to prevent your industry from being artificially undercut - his attack goes beyond "protectionism."

 

[heavenlyboy34]

n/m

 

[heavenlyboy34]

Well, as jmdrake's rep-worthy response above pointed out - Stossel was attacking the idea that there is ANY MERIT to supporting local business. That is beyond any idea of tariffs or trying to prevent your industry from being artificially undercut - his attack goes beyond "protectionism."

No, he wasn't.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

Don't worry for the slightest moment when those inefficient orchards are torn out and replaced with surplus housing.

That's exactly what has happened in California. Some of the world's best farmland, paved over and covered in cheaply made cookie cutter houses on postage stamp lots. Plus the environmental extremists in government shut off irrigation water to orchards, so that eliminated even more production.

 

[Krugerrand]

No, he wasn't.

This is what people always forget. Anytime we can use fewer resources and less labor to produce one thing, that leaves more for other things we can't afford. If we save money buying abroad, we can make and buy other products.
The nonsense of "Buy American" can be seen if you trace out the logic.
...
"If it's good to Buy American," Henderson said, "why isn't it good to have Buy Alabaman? And if it's good to have Buy Alabaman, why isn't it good to have Buy Montgomery, Ala.? And if it's good to have Buy Montgomery, Ala. ..."

You get the idea. You wouldn't get very good stuff if everything you bought came Montgomery, Ala.

"A huge part of the history of mankind is an increase in the division of labor. And that division of labor goes across national boundaries."
...
And here's something else: If you pay more for coffee, you'll have to buy less, or less of something else. That hurts other workers. We all should heed Henry Hazlitt's famous economics lesson: Look beyond the immediate effects and beneficiaries. You may be accomplishing the opposite of what you intend.

It sure seems like he is to me. Apparently there is value in wasted capital of goods-transportation. I think Stossel should take his own advice advice. I think what he suggests is accomplishing the opposite of what he intends.

Division of labor doesn't work if you try and divide by zero.

 

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

If the government didn't steal 3 months of our labor a year, we would have that extra 25% to buy stuff.

 

[Anti Federalist]

It sure seems like he is to me. Apparently there is value in wasted capital of goods-transportation. I think Stossel should take his own advice advice. I think what he suggests is accomplishing the opposite of what he intends.

Division of labor doesn't work if you try and divide by zero.

An excellent response.

 

[jmdrake]

I didn't get the impression that Stossel was speaking in the imperative ("Don't buy American"). I got the impression that he was saying that the "Buy American" schtick is overrated and impractical.

One sign of economic ignorance is the faith that "Buy American" is the path to prosperity. My former employer, ABC News, did a week's worth of stories claiming that "buying American" would put Americans back to work.I'm glad I don't work there anymore.
"Buy American" is a dumb idea. It would not only not create prosperity, it would cost jobs and make us all poorer. David R. Henderson, an economist at the Hoover Institution, explained why.
"Almost all economists say it's nonsense," he said. "And the reason is: We should buy things where they're cheapest. That frees up more of our resources to buy other things, and other Americans get jobs producing those things."
This is what people always forget. Anytime we can use fewer resources and less labor to produce one thing, that leaves more for other things we can't afford. If we save money buying abroad, we can make and buy other products.

This is being a "control freak"? Hmm...I don't think so.

And you're entitled to your opinion. I think you are wrong about Stossel and Stossel is wrong about "buy American". First it's a marketing slogan, not a mandate. So it can't hurt the economy the way he claims. If a consumer finds value in buying designer versus generic the consumer finds value. Similarly if the consumer finds value in buying American versus buying Chinese the consumer finds value. Second the economy doesn't operate in the free market utopia that he is imagining. Much of the money currently in the economy is fake, created by out of thin air by the government. I'm not just talking the Federal reserve, although that's a big part of it. I'm talking about the entire private/corporate welfare system. That helps keep wages artificially high so that things that might be made in America naturally are artificially overpriced. Anyhow, you're free to have your opinion, I have mine. And this isn't the first time I've felt Stossel was out to lunch.

Edit: And back to my original point. Please find me one example where Ron Paul attacked the idea of Americans encouraging (as opposed to mandating) other Americans to buy American. Because that's why I was saying Stossel's position isn't Ron's.

 

[jmdrake]

It sure seems like he is to me. Apparently there is value in wasted capital of goods-transportation. I think Stossel should take his own advice advice. I think what he suggests is accomplishing the opposite of what he intends.

Division of labor doesn't work if you try and divide by zero.

+rep

 

[jmdrake]

I think it makes perfect sense to buy apple juice from China. If our local orchards can't compete, too bad.

Think of how much our lifestyles will improve when 85% of the capital previously spent on apple juice is in China and 15% is saved to be invested in other things here in the US.

Don't worry for the slightest moment when those inefficient orchards are torn out and replaced with surplus housing. The dollar will never collapse. Chinese apple juice will always be cheaper (or even at least affordable). A time will never come when you cannot afford to buy apple juice from China and will need to grow apple trees for juice. And, fear not, if that unthinkable, impossible scenario did happen, you can trust that apple trees can produce juice in about two weeks after planting. (Fortunately, you can always count on that surplus housing to increase in value so that you can magically buy that Chinese apple juice.)

Also, don't worry about Sovereign Trust Funds. You need not worry about foreign entities owning your country. They'll always put your best interest first.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Krugerrand again.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Yeah, the one we rebuilt was a 64 1/2. We rebuilt it for my older brothers birthday. Thing had a puny little straight-6 engine. It musta taken 15seconds to get up to 60mph. LOL. Perfect for a 16yr old. I learned to drive on it. Unfortunately I didn't get it as a handme down as he sold it to afford to go to college. Still the memories of working on the engine, sanding, bondo'ing, painting and tracking down little ornaments and such with my dad will last forever.

I'll bet that little 1V - 170 cid six banger was good for probably 35 mpg.

 

[Anti Federalist]

You must spread some reputation around...

I think it makes perfect sense to buy apple juice from China. If our local orchards can't compete, too bad.

Think of how much our lifestyles will improve when 85% of the capital previously spent on apple juice is in China and 15% is saved to be invested in other things here in the US.

Don't worry for the slightest moment when those inefficient orchards are torn out and replaced with surplus housing. The dollar will never collapse. Chinese apple juice will always be cheaper (or even at least affordable). A time will never come when you cannot afford to buy apple juice from China and will need to grow apple trees for juice. And, fear not, if that unthinkable, impossible scenario did happen, you can trust that apple trees can produce juice in about two weeks after planting. (Fortunately, you can always count on that surplus housing to increase in value so that you can magically buy that Chinese apple juice.)

Also, don't worry about Sovereign Trust Funds. You need not worry about foreign entities owning your country. They'll always put your best interest first.

 

[specsaregood]

I'll bet that little 1V - 170 cid six banger was good for probably 35 mpg.

I might have been, even in that heavy steel vehicle. Of course gas was so cheap back then, who paid attention to such things.

It wasn't fast though, in fact my bro got out of a speeding ticket by going to court and contesting it with mathematical proof that it would have been impossible for him to get the car up to the speed the cop claimed he was going at the point they claimed. He even offered to take the judge for a snail ride in it if he didn't believe him.

 

[Anti Federalist]

I might have been, even in that heavy steel vehicle. Of course gas was so cheap back then, who paid attention to such things.

It wasn't fast though, in fact my bro got out of a speeding ticket by going to court and contesting it with mathematical proof that it would have been impossible for him to get the car up to the speed the cop claimed he was going at the point they claimed. He even offered to take the judge for a snail ride in it if he didn't believe him.

LoL that is epic.

We fought a ticket Mrs. AF got a few years ago in a big old conversion van the same way.

Won.

 

[MelissaWV]

MURFREESBORO, Tenn. (AP) – An estimated 5,000 people waited in line in Murfreesboro Wednesday, hoping to get one of 1,600 jobs at Nissan as the automaker ramps up hiring for a new battery plant at its Smyrna complex.

Yates Services, a maintenance contractor at the plant, held a job fair Wednesday for part-sorting, production line and forklift jobs and the response was the largest turnout for any Tennessee Department of Labor and Workforce job fair.

Damned foreign companies taking our... giving our... employing our...

...
...
...
...oh.

 

[heavenlyboy34]

And you're entitled to your opinion. I think you are wrong about Stossel and Stossel is wrong about "buy American". First it's a marketing slogan, not a mandate. So it can't hurt the economy the way he claims. If a consumer finds value in buying designer versus generic the consumer finds value. Similarly if the consumer finds value in buying American versus buying Chinese the consumer finds value. Second the economy doesn't operate in the free market utopia that he is imagining. Much of the money currently in the economy is fake, created by out of thin air by the government. I'm not just talking the Federal reserve, although that's a big part of it. I'm talking about the entire private/corporate welfare system. That helps keep wages artificially high so that things that might be made in America naturally are artificially overpriced. Anyhow, you're free to have your opinion, I have mine. And this isn't the first time I've felt Stossel was out to lunch.

Edit: And back to my original point. Please find me one example where Ron Paul attacked the idea of Americans encouraging (as opposed to mandating) other Americans to buy American. Because that's why I was saying Stossel's position isn't Ron's.

That's a reasonable opinion. I don't know of an instance in which Ron Paul attacked the idea of Americans encouraging (as opposed to mandating) other Americans to buy American. It probably doesn't exist. You're right about Stossel. He's hit-or-miss. Block's take on the issue (quoted earlier in the thread) is better reasoned.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Damned foreign companies taking our... giving our... employing our...

...
...
...
...oh.

The only reason Nissan is even bothering to do it here is because there is a tariff on imported cars wholly assembled outside the US.

Pretty telling too, that 5000 people show up to fill 1600 jobs.