Jeffrey Tucker: Has Donald Trump Unleashed the Neo-Nazis?

[thoughtomator]

What Trump revealed is that the great masses of authoritarian/religious faux-conservatives already are Neo-Nazis.

 

[r3volution 3.0]

I've disagreed with Tucker's "thick libertarianism" in the past, but his observations here aren't just a reflection of his own leftward cultural alignment. The Trump phenomenon is indeed a proto-fascist movement. It takes the anti-capitalism of the Democrats and adds the racism/chauvinism/xenophobia of the Republicans. Of course, the GOP was already moving in this direction; it was already a kind of proto-fascist party (as the Dems were/are a proto-bolshevik party), but all the worst ingredients of this witches' brew have been distilled by Trump. I don't think Trump can win the nomination, let alone the general, but if he did, and actually carried out his planned trade war and mass deportations (another impossibility IMO, given the make-up of Congress), the resulting economic devastation and social chaos (you thought Ferguson was bad? Wait till you see what happens when you try deporting 30 million people) could well catapult this proto-fascist movement into a true fascist movement. Again, I think this is highly unlikely, but it portends ill for the future. Someone more subtle than Trump could come along later, rekindle this fire, and actually win.

But, one does not have to be a member of those groups to want the invasion of our nation by illegal aliens to stop.

Correct, one doesn't *have* to be a racist/chauvinist/xenophobe to oppose immigration (there are other reasons, equally false, but nonetheless). But the fact is (from my own observations anyway, there's no scientific polling AFAIK) that a majority of Trump's supporters do oppose immigration for racist/chauvinist/xenophobic reasons. Take a closer look at the sort of people who sit on your side of the aisle on this issue (i.e. from among the general public, outside the liberty movement), I don't think you'll like what you see.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

It’s time libertarians get serious about realizing that there exists such a thing as Brown-shirted socialism. ... It is unapologetically authoritarian.
...
This is because we, as libertarians, are well-schooled to fear the socialist left but have little preparation to understand the threat from the other side.

Which "libertarians" are not aware of the dangers of authoritarianism?

 

[hells_unicorn]

Which "libertarians" are not aware of the dangers of authoritarianism?

Probably the ones that are thinking about voting for Trump.

 

[erowe1]

He released the dumbasses who had fortunately stayed out of politics previously.

It is yet to be seen whether or not they will continue to stay out of politics.

 

[Origanalist]

You're right "terrorists" attacked us on 9/11 so we should have a war on terror, and guns kill more people than anything else so we should ban guns. You can use a knife to stab someone in the heart so we should completely get rid of all knives.

That's one hell of a lot of jumping you just did there.

 

[erowe1]

The point being that Ron made it clear that he would not change his principles depending upon who supported him or who donated to him.

That's a good point. This is completely different than Trump who has no real principles.

 

[HankRicther12]

Do any neo-nazis really exist? I mean, just like the Arab Muslim boogeyman I'm told they are everywhere and at any moment they are going to crawl out of their hiding places and kill us all, yet in the past 10yrs how many people in America have been killed by Arab Muslims or Neo-Nazis?

What of it?

I don't recall ever letting any of the stormfront trolls who showed up here off the leash. I also remember Ron Paul repudiating them sharply and quickly, not saying he would '...if it will make you feel better.'

And I don't recall any of the white nationalists hanging around long after we made it clear that we in no way supported denying certain American citizens the right to travel and settle where they will.

You trying to say you remember it differently? By all means, revise history. You've done it before.

Really? You have proof of this assume? Who here is from Stormfront? I mean, I'm not saying I know for sure no one here is, I don't know everyone here or all their posts, but who are they?

White Nationalist and Neo-Nazi are not the same thing, not even close. That's like saying libertarians are Republicans. No one is denying any American the right to travel or settle where they will, WTF are you talking about? Securing the border against people illegally entering from other countries is not denying an American anything - they are not Americans.

I know its horrible, ever since their invasion we have a 24/7 nacho shop on every corner. I swear they are trying to kill us all with diabetes. They have completely ruined taco bell for me, and I will never forgive them for that. I can't get a single job picking fruit or cleaning peoples toilets, even pick and shovel jobs are all gone. I am sure factory jobs are gone because of them too, even though they don't seem to have factory jobs either. I even turned on the tv the other day and there was someone speaking Spanish on it, it was horrible I didn't understand one word they were saying. Everything is changing and I know it is for the worse because I can't understand it.

Oh gee, I guess that was supposed to be funny huh? Do you have an illegal family living with you? Do you live in any of these towns with Latin Counts, MS-13? Do you even bother to read any data on crime stats? Oh, and BTW, no one said illegals are taking factory jobs, that's outsourcing, illegals do take jobs in landscaping, farming, hotels, etc. Funny how the open borders crowd can never once give a verifiable fact to back up their positions.

You're right "terrorists" attacked us on 9/11 so we should have a war on terror, and guns kill more people than anything else so we should ban guns. You can use a knife to stab someone in the heart so we should completely get rid of all knives.

You honestly feel that is a valid comparison? If not for our joke of a border 9/11 would not have happened, and yes, there are terrorists and we should keep them out of our country.

Guns and Knives are inanimate objects, an illegal alien who willfully commits murder, rape, theft, abuses social programs and depresses wages is not. A gun or knife can be used for something destructive, but they also have useful purposes, what useful purpose do illegals give to the American people? Guns are a right guaranteed in the Constitution, open borders and mass 3rd world immigration are not. You got anything besides 3rd grade straw men?

 

[Brian4Liberty]

Correct, one doesn't *have* to be a racist/chauvinist/xenophobe to oppose immigration (there are other reasons, equally false, but nonetheless). But the fact is (from my own observations anyway, there's no scientific polling AFAIK) that a majority of Trump's supporters do oppose immigration for racist/chauvinist/xenophobic reasons. Take a closer look at the sort of people who sit on your side of the aisle on this issue (i.e. from among the general public, outside the liberty movement), I don't think you'll like what you see.

Throwing out racism is the nuclear option. It's not about winning a debate, it's about annihilating those who don't agree with you. The leftists and globalists have been doing that for a long time.

As far as the majority of Trump supporters being racist, I haven't seen it out in the real world. I know Hispanic and black Trump supporters, so their motivation is not racism. Their opposition to more immigration is about jobs, wages and overcrowding.

 

[heavenlyboy34]

Do any neo-nazis really exist? I mean, just like the Arab Muslim boogeyman I'm told they are everywhere and at any moment they are going to crawl out of their hiding places and kill us all, yet in the past 10yrs how many people in America have been killed by Arab Muslims or Neo-Nazis?

Haven't you seen American History X? Everyone knows that it has to be true if it happens in a Hollywood flick.
NSFW

 

[nikcers]

That's one hell of a lot of jumping you just did there.

 

[r3volution 3.0]

Throwing out racism is the nuclear option. It's not about winning a debate, it's about annihilating those who don't agree with you.

What debate?

Trump people are fundamentally irrational. They don't care about facts, reason, or issues. It's nothing but racism/chauvinism/xenophobia + a personality cult.

There's no possibility of debate with such people. They must be be verbally annihilated, to discourage the uncommitted from joining them.

As far as the majority of Trump supporters being racist, I haven't seen it out in the real world. I know Hispanic and black Trump supporters, so their motivation is not racism. Their opposition to more immigration is about jobs, wages and overcrowding.

That's why I said racism/chauvinism/xenophobia.

The common thread is scapegoating some outgroup for one's problem. How the outgroup's defined varies; it might be race, country of birth, language spoken, etc.

 

[klamath]

Do any neo-nazis really exist? I mean, just like the Arab Muslim boogeyman I'm told they are everywhere and at any moment they are going to crawl out of their hiding places and kill us all, yet in the past 10yrs how many people in America have been killed by Arab Muslims or Neo-Nazis?




Really? You have proof of this assume? Who are these people? What are the names of their organizations? You have video of any of this? Or any proof that they are "racist neofacist"?

Oh wait I thought you weren't going to respond to me trumpster. Why bother because you said you haven't been around to see you aren't being the least bit original, and repeating the same lines a dozen other trumpster have said before you, that a lot of us used to engage and try and reason with.
A strong emotional response to anti Trump postings followed but criticism of Rand is a dead give away. Care to explain why you are holding Rands feet to the fire for flip flops when trump has an entire history of flip flops on almost every issue??? Let's see you post a good series of anti Trump posts and I might start to believe otherwise. I have seen a bunch of negative posts about Rand however none about Trump.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

What debate?

You ask "what debate" and then go on to talk about immigration. The debate here is about immigration. If Trump said we need to throw open the borders, the roles would probably be reversed in many cases, with the adamant Trump supporters opposing him, and the current Trump haters supporting him.

Trump people are fundamentally irrational. They don't care about facts, reason, or issues. It's nothing but racism/chauvinism/xenophobia + a personality cult.

There's no possibility of debate with such people. They must be be verbally annihilated, to discourage the uncommitted from joining.

LOL. Fight fire with fire, eh? Irrational supporters require irrational annihilation?

 

[HankRicther12]

Haven't you seen American History X? Everyone knows that it has to be true if it happens in a Hollywood flick.
NSFW

Lol, oh yeah, how could I forget, Hollywood is the most accurate source of info. Men of course are all bumbling idiots who just drink beer and watch football, leaving us all to wonder why that pretty, smart, perfect wife of his ever married him, well, cuz women are just that awesome they are willing to put up with us.

 

[HankRicther12]

Oh wait I thought you weren't going to respond to me trumpster. Why bother because you said you haven't been around to see you aren't being the least bit original, and repeating the same lines a dozen other trumpster have said before you, that a lot of us used to engage and try and reason with.
A strong emotional response to anti Trump postings followed but criticism of Rand is a dead give away. Care to explain why you are holding Rands feet to the fire for flip flops when trump has an entire history of flip flops on almost every issue??? Let's see you post a good series of anti Trump posts and I might start to believe otherwise. I have seen a bunch of negative posts about Rand however none about Trump.

Yeah, didn't notice it was you at first, it's been edited, sorry you wrote all babble for nothing.

 

[klamath]

Yeah, didn't notice it was you at first, it's been edited, sorry you wrote all babble for nothing.

sucker.

 

[r3volution 3.0]

You ask "what debate" and then go on to talk about immigration. The debate here is about immigration. If Trump said we need to throw open the borders, the roles would probably be reversed in many cases, with the adamant Trump supporters opposing him, and the current Trump haters supporting him.

You seem to think that the average Trump supporter has a well reasoned argument against immigration (as some here at RPF do) - he doesn't.

He has no reasoning at all, just a racism/chauvinism/xenophobia.

There's nothing to debate.

Go read a comments section on an immigration-related article at Breitbart sometime.

You'll find a marked difference between the Trumpster's "arguments" there and what we see in immigration debates here at RPF.

LOL. Fight fire with fire, eh? Irrational supporters require irrational annihilation?

You don't argue with a rabid dog, you put it down.

 

[thoughtomator]

Upon further consideration, the real question is who is left in politics that isn't a full-blown imperial-authoritarian. The Left, the Right, and the centrists all agree on certain basic principles:

- supremacy of the Federal government in all things (the Right may deny it but their actions say otherwise)
- the US is entitled to interfere in the affairs of any other nation it pleases, on any basis it can conjure
- the individual has no rights that can't be abridged by government
- the fast-approaching fiscal cataclysm is not important enough to spend any significant amount of time addressing
- Iran and Russia must be enemies no matter how little sense that makes

 

[HankRicther12]

You seem to think that the average Trump supporter has a well reasoned argument against immigration (as some here at RPF do) - he doesn't.

He has no reasoning at all, just a racism/chauvinism/xenophobia.

There's nothing to debate.

Go read a comments section on an immigration-related article at Breitbart sometime.

You'll find a marked difference between the Trumpster's "arguments" there and what we see in immigration debates here at RPF.


You don't argue with a rabid dog, you put it down.

There may be some truth to that, but I think it's unfair to paint them all that way, or even most. Many people are impacted by it everyday in their towns, even if their arguments aren't the most articulate and they aren't the sharpest knife in the drawer it doesn't mean they are "just racism/chauvinism/xenophobia."