Is Ted Cruz undermining Rand Paul?

[twomp]

It's conceivable that Cruz is laying the groundwork for a presidential run in order to position himself in case Rand does not run for whatever reason (family issues, health issues, whatever), or to position himself for being a potential VP pick. I'm not really going to be too critical of Cruz unless/until he actually declares he is running or unless/until he starts portraying Rand negatively.

Well I hope it isn't your son or daughter that a President Cruz sends to Iran in order to defend Israel then.

 

[serenityrick]

Well I hope it isn't your son or daughter that a President Cruz sends to Iran in order to defend Israel then.

As long as Israel remains an ally of the United States they'll always be supported by the United States.

As for sending troops there to defend against attacks that's very doubtful.. Israel can defend themselves quite easily.

With that said, what does that statement have anything to do with what that poster was talking about?

 

[libertygold]

As long as Israel remains an ally of the United States they'll always be supported by the United States.

As for sending troops there to defend against attacks that's very doubtful.. Israel can defend themselves quite easily.

With that said, what does that statement have anything to do with what that poster was talking about?

Cannot have a liberty agenda at home with such an interventionist foreign policy. It is ok to have allies- Britain, EU, Israel, Japan, etc.- but we cannot be the one who has to defend them.

 

[Christian Liberty]

Foreign policy affects what happens here at home. If a candidate is an interventionist, I have no use for him/her.

How many "constitutionalists" call on the President to disregard the 10th amendment and arrest the smokers in Colorado who defied the federal government.

If all you care about is domestic issues, almost any Republican will tell you what you want to hear. Just know that for every war that our government engages in, they use that war as an excuse to choke out our civil liberties. It's for our safety after all.

Yep... this...

Honestly, Ted probably has his uses as a senator. I'd still rather him hang from a pole, though. (After being tried and convicted for the people he's supported killing while in office, of course.)

 

[twomp]

As long as Israel remains an ally of the United States they'll always be supported by the United States.

As for sending troops there to defend against attacks that's very doubtful.. Israel can defend themselves quite easily.

With that said, what does that statement have anything to do with what that poster was talking about?

I guess you missed the part where Ted Cruz said this:

A "responsible president," the Texas Republican told a conference on Iran's grab for a nuclear weapon, "would stand up and say unequivocally, in terms that allow no confusion, 'Under no circumstances will the nation of Iran be allowed to acquire nuclear weapon capability, and they will either halt now or we will use every step necessary including direct military force to stop them.'"

Sounds like Ted Cruz would rather our men and women fight and die rather than let Israel get their own hands dirty. As for this:

With that said, what does that statement have anything to do with what that poster was talking about?

You see Ted Cruz has people on these forums thinking that he's a "liberty" candidate when he really just a neo-con in liberty clothing. THAT is how he is undermining Rand Paul. He has the sheep fooled into thinking he's a liberty candidate like Rand Paul but what he is doing is stealing our message and using it to promote himself. How many other "constitutional conservatives" advocate for the President to ignore the 10th Amendment?

 

[libertygold]

I guess you missed the part where Ted Cruz said this:



Sounds like Ted Cruz would rather our men and women fight and die rather than let Israel get their own hands dirty. As for this:



You see Ted Cruz has people on these forums thinking that he's a "liberty" candidate when he really just a neo-con in liberty clothing. THAT is how he is undermining Rand Paul. He has the sheep fooled into thinking he's a liberty candidate like Rand Paul but what he is doing is stealing our message and using it to promote himself. How many other "constitutional conservatives" advocate for the President to ignore the 10th Amendment?

Yep. That is what bothered me into starting the thread in the first place. I was realizing Cruz was trying to steal Rand's thunder and speak the language of the liberty movement and try to copy Rand's successful filibuster (even though what he did was not a filibuster) but really isn't a part of the liberty movement, and that this would only divide the movement and make Rand weaker. I wanted to see if others had that same thought. As I have been shown, I am not alone by any stretch in thinking this.

 

[libertygold]

Good or bad for Rand Paul and the liberty movement? - http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/198482-cruz-to-get-heros-welcome-in-iowa-and-new-hampshire

 

[NorfolkPCSolutions]

All I know is the conservative radio hosts can't get enough of talking about Ted.

May I add to this?

They'd rather talk about anyone, or anything, than a Senator with the last name Paul. That includes Ted Cruz, kitty litter, or frozen pizza. Anything but a Paul. I think it has something to do with the perpetual erection conservative radio hosts get from being good 'Murricans, authoritarianism, and being stroked by the GOP establishment.

Rand has the potential to appeal in a way similar to Reagan - only insofar as his ability to be supported by Grandma and Grandpa, Mom and Dad, college students, and newly minted 18 year olds...at least in the sense that there are a lot of folks that are beginning to smell the police state cooking.

 

[NorfolkPCSolutions]

This is becoming The Undead Thread of Rand Paul Forum. Why does it keep getting bumped up when it's dead and buried?

Whoops, should we ask the mods to close the thread? Seems like such a lively discussion...

 

[compromise]

3 ways Cruz helps Rand:

1) He makes Rand look less extreme by comparison as a conservative, helping Rand with moderates
2) He makes Rand look more extreme by comparison as a libertarian, helping Rand with purist libertarians (notice how all the former Rand haters on here now support Rand and hate on Cruz instead? Cruz changed the paradigm, it's no longer Rand vs. Ron, it's Rand vs. Cruz)
3) When he doesn't run in 2016, his support goes to Rand

 

[NIU Students for Liberty]

3 ways Cruz helps Rand:

1) He makes Rand look less extreme by comparison as a conservative, helping Rand with moderates
2) He makes Rand look more extreme by comparison as a libertarian, helping Rand with purist libertarians (notice how all the former Rand haters on here now support Rand and hate on Cruz instead? Cruz changed the paradigm, it's no longer Rand vs. Ron, it's Rand vs. Cruz)
3) When he doesn't run in 2016, his support goes to Rand

Except those first two points only help Rand in the general election, not a Republican primary.

 

[libertygold]

Except those first two points only help Rand in the general election, not a Republican primary.

Exactly. He doesn't help him in a primary because he will be competing for the same resources. Anyone who follows politics realizes this. Did Obama help Hillary in the 2008 primary by making her look less socialist?

 

[Warlord]

Ted Cruz is a neocon Iran war monger. Rand Paul is not.

 

[serenityrick]

Ted Cruz is a neocon Iran war monger. Rand Paul is not.

based on what? (legitimately asking)

To be honest, I've never even heard him talk about foreign policy. He must have said something pretty heinous considering how many people here absolutely despise him

 

[Warlord]

based on what? (legitimately asking)

To be honest, I've never even heard him talk about foreign policy. He must have said something pretty heinous considering how many people here absolutely despise him

His foreign policy is neocon and Iran fear mongering

 

[RandallFan]

Ted Cruz is quite open to aerial bombing parts of Iran.

The Libertarians Rand gains from not bombing will be dwarfed by the people who loses depending on what happens on immigration.

 

[luke78]

Paul and Cruz have shown that they have differences in style, even if they don't disagree much on policy.

 

[RonPaulGeorge&Ringo]

Cruz is backing the Soros mob in Ukraine, no surprise there:

http://blog.heritage.org/2014/02/19/ted-cruz-ukraine-free-world-stands/

 

[philipped]

I say we just shut this thread down because in some regard this thread could've been made and continued to be brought to 10 pages by the opps (opposition).

 

[serenityrick]

Cruz is backing the Soros mob in Ukraine, no surprise there:

http://blog.heritage.org/2014/02/19/ted-cruz-ukraine-free-world-stands/

Knowing history, I don't see how anyone could NOT support the opposition in this case. The USSR killed over 8 million people in the Ukraine.. hard to blame them for not wanting their government to be beholden to Russia.

With that said, I can support the opposition without supporting American intervention... Not convinced Ted feels the same way.