is tax fraud immoral?

[Toureg89]

i have a friend who is both a ron paul supporter, and philosophically sympathetic to agorism (he would not mind living in an agorist/anarchist society, but thinks its less possible to maintain than american constitutional government).

being so freedom minded, and what i assume to be a believer in Natural Law/Natural Rights, he somehow still came to the conclusion that tax fraud is immoral.

i myself can't see how defrauding an violent organization of thieves out of property it took or threatens to take from you is immoral, and either i have failed in being able to communicate this (less likely) or he just refuses to recognize sound logic when he sees it (more likely).

is there a better way of explaining this to a person who should already get it?

 

[Working Poor]

the immoral part is if you get caught your ass will be thrown jail. It is best to go ahead and pay unless you don't mind making a statement that would land you in jail.

 

[Christian Liberty]

I don't think doing that would be a good idea for pragmatic reasons, but the government has no right to anything.

 

[oyarde]

If the tax itself is immoral , avoidance is Patriotic If you can get by with it , otherwise you pay it and scheme on them as they scheme on you .Federal tax , outside of Article One , Section Eight is immoral.I declare it so .How is that Toureg ?

 

[Seraphim]

It's not immoral to hide your assets from a thief.

 

[jkr]

the REAL question is, in my mind, who is "liable" for taxes and WHY?

 

[Barrex]

If you are not using any services or goods that those taxes pay for then it is not immoral. If you use them and dont pay them (via taxes) then yes it is immoral. You are using goods and services that other people payed for.

 

[Toureg89]

If you are not using any services or goods that those taxes pay for then it is not immoral. If you use them and dont pay them (via taxes) then yes it is immoral. You are using goods and services that other people payed for.

idk if that logic holds up: if a person puts a gun to my head and says: "give me 10,000$ for this toyota corolla", sure, i obtained a good and/or service in exchange for the money given to the guy, but the guy still USED FORCE AGAINST ME in order to fulfill the transaction.

if the government FORCES me to use a service, such as national defense, against my will, i still dont see how im culpable for the taxes for the war.

if the government doesnt give you a choice NOT to use a good/service, how can one be culpable for paying the government's taxes?

most of the programs federal funding goes towards (DoD, Medicare, Social Security) are programs the government FORCES us to use. so how can we be culpable for their costs???

 

[jj-]

Of course not, tax fraud is heroic.

How can avoiding sending money to a criminal gang be considered immoral?

 

[otherone]

idk if that logic holds up: if a person puts a gun to my head and says: "give me 10,000$ for this toyota corolla", sure, i obtained a good and/or service in exchange for the money given to the guy, but the guy still USED FORCE AGAINST ME in order to fulfill the transaction.

More appropriately, "Give me 10k or I'll through you in jail". The service provided is NOT throwing you in jail. Sounds fair, right?

 

[TheTexan]

If a robber points a gun at you and asks for your money, is it immoral to tell him that you have none?

 

[osan]

i have a friend who is both a ron paul supporter, and philosophically sympathetic to agorism (he would not mind living in an agorist/anarchist society, but thinks its less possible to maintain than american constitutional government).

being so freedom minded, and what i assume to be a believer in Natural Law/Natural Rights, he somehow still came to the conclusion that tax fraud is immoral.

i myself can't see how defrauding an violent organization of thieves out of property it took or threatens to take from you is immoral, and either i have failed in being able to communicate this (less likely) or he just refuses to recognize sound logic when he sees it (more likely).

is there a better way of explaining this to a person who should already get it?

Any resistance to the crimes of tyrants is morally praiseworthy and require no justification. Such acts of defiance are by definition non-criminal.

 

[erowe1]

If a thief threatened you with a gun to give them all your money, and you emptied your pockets and gave them what was in them, but neglected to mention some additional money that you had hidden in your sock, would that be immoral? Your friend either must say that it is, or else your friend is more of a statist than you think.

However, looking at it as part of a larger picture, rather than just the act in itself, it could be immoral to take on the risk of getting caught and having to undergo the punishment that would follow, especially if you have dependents. If that's all your friend meant, then I don't think there's anything to convince him to change his mind about.

 

[samforpaul]

My opinion: It would be very difficult to commit tax fraud esp. in light of having to sign that statement at the bottom that says something to the effect that everything I've filed is honest and accurate.

 

[mrsat_98]

Tax Fraud is absolutely immoral. And every frigging dime they collect from the people is fraudulent. Gov employees and Officers of Corporation are not included in the term people.

 

[Reason]

Recent events have implemented a "chilling effect" when it comes to publicly discussing topics such as this.