I’m gay. And I want my kid to be gay, too.

I guess you have a gift for that...then.

Well yeah, hasn't everyone met a few guys who were very effeminate even in grade school? They hung out with the girls, were "fashionable" and liked the same things that girls liked. I'd call them "born that way."
 
Well yeah, hasn't everyone met a few guys who were very effeminate even in grade school? They hung out with the girls, were "fashionable" and liked the same things that girls liked. I'd call them "born that way."

Wow, if I hang out with girls, it means I'm a homosexual?! :eek:
 
Pretty much hits it right on the head...

http://youtu.be/5Zw4PIcjVNg?t=12s

win!

I'd call them "born that way."

or "blighted that way" perhaps

predisposed in the womb perhaps by momma's long habit of birth control pills
or fatherless
junked out on estrogen mimicking, endocrine disrupting chemicals in the box store shit we intergenerationally swim in
emasculated by whacked metrosexual societal conventions fostered by other xenoandrogenites
psyche meds or recreational drugs at an early age
emotional incest syndrome
generally lacking the up bringing to forge moral character in order to avoid fetishism
sexually or emotionally abused as a child
atheistic childhood
public school and main stream media indoctrination of the normalcy of such lifestyle
gayisms in every sitcom on the boob tube
encouraged by run away nouveau political correctness with regard to gender identity and associated entitlement



put another way...

repeatedly reinforced choices and adverse external circumstances occurring at critical phases of development have long since blighted the germs of otherwise normal heterosexual tendencies


Nonetheless; its tough to fix a blighted potato.

...this post subject to rep burn
 
Don't let people tell you you can't change your sexual orientation. That's about as true as saying you can't change your alcohol habit. Human habits are very malleable and there's no chemical conspiracy in your brain that forces you to be attracted to one kind of person or another. Believe it or not, there are gay people who want to change, and we shouldn't be telling them they can't.

I don't condemn gay people, but what I do have a problem with is how I'm no longer allowed to say it's wrong without being accused of being responsible for their oppression somehow or being called a hatemonger. I don't hate anyone, I just have moral standards and I would treat a gay person the same way I treat an alcoholic, with respect, dignity, and love. That doesn't mean I have to accept what they do and say everything is just fine. I'm not evil if I encourage someone who wants to change their sexuality to go ahead and do it.

I'm tired of being treated like the enemy for my personal beliefs that really don't affect you, and I think we all know what I'm talking about when I say the "tolerant" are not exactly what they claim to be.
 
I'm straight. Completely. And I know there are men who are just as gay. Men who have problems enough without me adding to them. I'm not attracted to them at all. And they aren't attracted to the people who make my sticker peck out either. And I don't have a problem with that.

And there are a far greater number of people who can (and more than a few who do) swing both ways. Now, if you want to try to convince this majority to swing only the 'right' way, suit yourself. But the libs are right about one thing. There are people who aren't a part of this group, and those individuals deserve not to be persecuted for being who they are.
 
I'm straight. Completely. And I know there are men who are just as gay. Men who have problems enough without me adding to them. I'm not attracted to them at all. And they aren't attracted to the people who make my sticker peck out either. And I don't have a problem with that.

And there are a far greater number of people who can (and more than a few who do) swing both ways. Now, if you want to try to convince this majority to swing only the 'right' way, suit yourself. But the libs are right about one thing. There are people who aren't a part of this group, and those individuals deserve not to be persecuted for being who they are.

What does the Bible say about homosexuality?
 
What does the Bible say about homosexuality?

That there is such a thing.

Doesn't make some stranger's bedroom my business. And I think the woman quoted in the OP is beyond sick to make her prepubescent child's yet-to-be-determined sexuality the world's business.
 
I'm straight. Completely. And I know there are men who are just as gay. Men who have problems enough without me adding to them. I'm not attracted to them at all. And they aren't attracted to the people who make my sticker peck out either. And I don't have a problem with that.

And there are a far greater number of people who can (and more than a few who do) swing both ways. Now, if you want to try to convince this majority to swing only the 'right' way, suit yourself. But the libs are right about one thing. There are people who aren't a part of this group, and those individuals deserve not to be persecuted for being who they are.

Who's being persecuted?
 
Well... its not exactly like there are "thou shall kill" parades to thump.

At first I thought that was a good point, but then I think of all of this war propaganda and realize that there may be more kill parades than homosexual parades. This country is doomed because a false, state-subservient, pseudo-christianity is now the mainstream.
 
Bible condemns a lot of stuff, but for some reason gays seem to get the brunt of the collective bible thumping

Probably because it's a ridiculously easy and worthy target. Hey, guys, this thing you do that spreads disease and causes other medical and social problems and has zero practical benefit? Don't do that thing, thanks.
 
I here what you are saying. However, there are a lot of behaviors that are unacceptable to large swaths of society that fit into the "Most people don't wake up one morning and decide they want to do/be X" category. I won't list such behaviors for the sake of not offending. Yet, it's odd that this one particular family of behaviors is singled out by the left for praise and protection as much as it is singled out by the right for scorn. I've said it before, but I will say it again. Anybody who said he was a white person trapped in a black person's body and wanted to be surgically altered would be scorned by the white and the black community. Take Michael Jackson. Maybe he did have the disease that caused him to turn white and so he took the treatment to accelerate the process. Of course that says nothing about his nose or lips or other features that he changed. Well...it's his business. If he just decided he "chose" to look white, he had a right to do that and spend his money to do it. Or if it was all "genetic" or some other natural occurrence (maybe he wanted the nose and lips to match the complexion), that would have been his business as well. But why should the rest of the world be forced to have an opinion that conformed to his on that?

Here is the biggest problem with the "anti therapy" argument. All of a sudden people are injecting themselves into other people's business in the opposite way. Again with Michael Jackson. If he had decided he really wanted dark skin again and full lips and larger nose, why should someone be barred from offering him those services, even if those services only have a remote chance at working? I hear what you are saying about "fluid orientation." Here's one thing that is true about physical fluids. While you can't force water into a particular shape, you can guide it in a particular direction. If someone wants help being guided one way or another there is nothing wrong with that. The problem comes in with force.

To be fair, I think the newer research is showing that some indeterminate (yet possibly significant) percentage of people have fluid sexualities, which implies a lack of a static sexual orientation, but also implies that outside attempts to change this orientation are fruitless (therefore continuing to reject the notion of "therapeutic" changes of sexual orientation). The insistence that gay people couldn't change their orientation specifically developed from resistance to the idea that sexual attraction could be changed or fully repressed. I'm thinking it's more of a historical artifact and the first "line of defense" against conversion therapy crusaders, as most people, for some odd reason, don't find sexuality theory as fascinating as some of us. Even the presence of fluid sexuality doesn't necessarily imply that sexual orientation can be purposefully changed. People who report a fluid orientation don't suddenly wake up and say "Well, I think I'll be attracted to (insert gender here) for the rest of my life" - it literally is comparable to a fluid that has no fixed shape, but does have a fixed volume and consistency. I'd best describe it as a shifting of poles that happens pretty randomly; just because a person prefers men/women now doesn't always mean they will prefer that gender for the rest of their life, or even for the rest of any given length of time.

As a consequence of this, trying to convince people to pick a side usually doesn't work out. You're entirely right that the "nobody chooses..." argument was done out of political expediency, but it wasn't done because they knew deep down that the "conversioners" (for lack of a better term) were correct. They were choosing to (over)simplify areas of sexuality that weren't well-understood and remain that way to this day. Thankfully the conversation is starting to change as people grow more open to discussing this sort of thing.
 
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Well yeah, hasn't everyone met a few guys who were very effeminate even in grade school? They hung out with the girls, were "fashionable" and liked the same things that girls liked. I'd call them "born that way."

I've known effeminate boys to grow up completely attracted to girls and macho boys to end up gay so I'm not sure what "born that way" is supposed of even mean in this context.
 
From my own observations, I think that some people are genetically gay, and some make the choice--especially women. At the end of the day, I just really don't care much what choice people make, or how they are oriented sexually, so long as they give me the same consideration.

I do think it's in human nature to want to build a community of people like yourself though--and that's probably a component of racism/sexism/whateverism. Being accepted for who you are goes a long way.

And your observations may be right. They may be wrong. Neither of us have anyway to prove that. And I'm glad that you appear to also give other the same consideration in having a different opinion from you on whether or not sexual orientation is ever or always genetic or predetermined in some form or fashion. Some people, on this very forum, are not so considerate. It's the political agenda of the discussion that bothers me more than anything else. It's like man made global warming. I had a near argument with a friend who admittedly knows less about the subject than I do. (She really didn't know until I told her some months ago that CO2 was the main supposed greenhouse gas.) Oh but she was hoping my new girlfriend could "convince me" about global warming, even though she didn't know what this new girlfriend's beliefs on that were since we hadn't even talked about that. Why can't everybody just drop political crap when talking about questions of science?
 
Wow, if I hang out with girls, it means I'm a homosexual?! :eek:

LOL. This. On the one hand boys are told not to accept fixed gender roles because that's sexist and on the next they're dropping fixed gender roles is proof they were born gay. Guys can't catch a break.
 
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