Genetic Modification Gone Wild: 10 Signs That Our World May Be Destined To Resemble A Real

[John F Kennedy III]

Your choice of words is REALLY telling...

Definition for Manipulation:
Web definitions: exerting shrewd or devious influence especially for one's own advantage; "his manipulation of his friends was scandalous".

Transgress - trans·gress/transˈgres/
Verb:

Infringe or go beyond the bounds of (a moral principle or other established standard of behavior).

You got that right, it will allow the 1% running the show to transgress upon others.

You know in a perfect world I would agree with you about advancements in science, but since we do not live in a perfect world, people have a right to know those whom are manipulating and transgressing upon other sentient beings.

This.

 

[american.swan]

This is all predictable to me. Personally, I believe the "super humans" before the flood created the dinosaurs. That's why they weren't on the ark. A mouse that tweets like a bird? I heard a rumor one scientist wants to recreate the dinosaurs from scratch. These articles in this thread plus the global economy all point to Christ's soon return.

 

[LawnWake]

I am sure that is just a coincidence. The government would NEVER harm it's citizens--Oh nooooooo. Hegelian Dialectic--Problem, reaction, solution! Problem: resurrect the 1918 Pandemic. Reaction: Some people die of mysterious disease that resembles that of the 1918 Spanish Influenza. Solution: Government will have antidote.

When did I say that the government should be involved? If you're going to play the 'I'm more libertarian than you game', go ahead I realy don't care about any of that, but you know.. I don't even believe government should exist so.. why would.. I think that. the government should spend tax money on anything, including genetic modification?

Nature is sentient. The more we screw with it, the more it will screw with us.

Actually, that's the thing. 'Screwing with' is a human concept, not a natural one. If humans didn't exist, there would be no one to judge what's 'good' or 'bad' for nature. So to say that we're 'screwing with nature' is completely illogical. We're not. We're surviving. Just because we're surviving in a way that is unlike previous organisms doesn't mean it's bad. It's like saying that the first animal with eyes is 'screwing with nature' because it too is putting new evolutionary pressures on its environment.

We're changing nature, sure and you know, every thing that has ever lived has changed nature. We're something new, new isn't necessarily bad, just different. So what if there's suddenly cows with 2 heads walking around? Just because we're used to 1 headed cows doesn't mean there's something inherently wrong with 2 headed ones.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Really? Is that all we have to do? Kind of like the government resurrecting and generically engineering the 1918 Spanish Flu (which had be eradicated), from a body of a frozen corpse who died of it.

That ^^^

Having the pleasure of knowing I was right is poor compensation when billions of people are choking chunks of their lungs up and dying of hemorrhagic pneumonia, or when whole species of plant foods are rendered infertile because of GMO cross contamination.

 

[donnay]

When did I say that the government should be involved? If you're going to play the 'I'm more libertarian than you game', go ahead I realy don't care about any of that, but you know.. I don't even believe government should exist so.. why would.. I think that. the government should spend tax money on anything, including genetic modification?

The example I presented is indeed the government who is behind these type genetic modifications--bio-warfare. Government is also allowing corporations and universities to do this genetic engineering. This isn't a pissing contest, this is mere dialog that I am presenting to say if you are all for the genetic modification, then you better be careful what you wish for!

I am all for limited government and transparency. The way our government was intended.

 

[Mach]

Just another day......

 

[ryanmkeisling]

When did I say that the government should be involved? If you're going to play the 'I'm more libertarian than you game', go ahead I realy don't care about any of that, but you know.. I don't even believe government should exist so.. why would.. I think that. the government should spend tax money on anything, including genetic modification?



Actually, that's the thing. 'Screwing with' is a human concept, not a natural one. If humans didn't exist, there would be no one to judge what's 'good' or 'bad' for nature. So to say that we're 'screwing with nature' is completely illogical. We're not. We're surviving. Just because we're surviving in a way that is unlike previous organisms doesn't mean it's bad. It's like saying that the first animal with eyes is 'screwing with nature' because it too is putting new evolutionary pressures on its environment.

We're changing nature, sure and you know, every thing that has ever lived has changed nature. We're something new, new isn't necessarily bad, just different. So what if there's suddenly cows with 2 heads walking around? Just because we're used to 1 headed cows doesn't mean there's something inherently wrong with 2 headed ones.

We aren't surviving well at this point. I don't think you can argue that as it would just make you look illogical, or better yet idiotic.

How do you explain the exponential rise in disease and chronic disorders? How do you explain the fact that most people start their day with a hand full of supplements?

How do you explain the fact that the more soil scientists we get the less healthy, arable soil we have to work with? Every year we lose more to desertification. There is no evidence you can point to that society at large is thriving.

If you do not think nature is sentient you clearly haven't spent much time out in it. How does a morel mushroom "know" how to look like 50 different things surrounding it on the forest floor to produce successful camouflage? How does a venus fly trap "know" how to feed on insects and develop the means to do so?

Its funny you bring up cows with two heads, I was just talking to one of the elderly ranchers here in the valley where I live the other day and he mentioned that when they were spraying agent orange here in the 70's he had several years where his breedings produced just that, cows with two heads and they were essentially worthless as they had to be put down. He lost a lot of cattle to this sort of land abuse forcing him to give up dairying and switch to reliance on the beef commodity industry and his business never did rebound as regulation came in to deal the final death blow to his dairy farm. He has been almost poverty stricken since. The spraying of those chemicals also led to mass desertification. This valley has been used by humans for 10,000 years and europeans have only been here for 150. When the first europeans came and settled here during gold rush times in 1864, the native grass grew to 8 feet tall, today its mostly desert scrub and where there is still grass, it is lucky to get 2 feet! This year was the first year it was legal for them to plant the GMO alfalfa, and already the cows being fed on that stuff are having reproductive problems and still births just like has been happening to the animals fed on GMO corn and grains for the past decade. There is also less genetic diversity now so where will they breed a new cow from that can live and reproduce healthily on these grasses? A lab? That doesn't work they have already tried and those cows could not survive, in fact even regular cows could not survive being reproduced and fed in captivity. They have to do it in nature on healthy pasture and as time moves on there is less and less of that to work with here in the US, especially as the GMO alfalfa cross contaminates the native strains.

These things promised to feed the world but many in the world are starving miserably, so that was an absolute failure and as you would see if you opened your eyes a little bit, farmers around the world are rejecting this stuff because it is worthless and only makes them dependent on the companies selling the seed to them, the same companies that make the fertilizers, insecticides, and herbicides that are tailored to it. I could quote some more from my "sensationalist" book. I won't because I have no desire to argue with people like you and you will find out soon enough how bad it will get if we continue on this scientific path with no personal responsibility in how far it is taken. I suppose you would be content to eat your meals via pill form? Most people already do, just look at the amount of supplements are used, food itself used to provide all of that. That is where we are headed and people are not more healthy because of it. This stuff is only benefiting corporations not human beings and that cannot be refuted the evidence is widespread.

You are lucky there are farmers like me who don't buy the shit and do it the way it was done 100 years ago, bio-remeidiating the already destroyed once productive land. And producing food that makes people healthy rather than dependent on pharmaceuticals to stay alive. I am very surprised that you support Ron Paul as your rhetoric on this makes you seem like you support Obama as he is a corporate GMO guy all the way.

Look around you the world is not getting to be a better place, we are ready to self destruct, I think everybody here would agree with that.

 

[Endgame]

For fucks sake, this thread is like saying we shouldn't have airplanes because Boeing is run by assholes. Ridiculous technophobia.

 

[ryanmkeisling]

For fucks sake, this thread is like saying we shouldn't have airplanes because Boeing is run by assholes. Ridiculous technophobia.

Do you really think technology has made the world a better place? For fucks sake, I get your point...maybe in some cases but the balance has been unhinged. Boeing has caused more war and destruction than the ease of moving around in less time, over long distances and at greater ease. The automobile is a perfect example...

In your opinion is the world is flourishing because it gets easier and easier to destroy? Animals and plants naturally control their populations, we don't.

 

[Endgame]

Do you really think technology has made the world a better place? For fucks sake, I get your point...maybe in some cases but the balance has been unhinged. Boeing has caused more war and destruction than the ease of moving around in less time and at ease. The automobile is a perfect example...

I think large corporations, politicians, bureaucrats, pig cops, voters, and sadomasochists of all types have made the world a shitty place.

Technology, as far as I'm concerned, is wonderful without these people. I want a bioluminescent houseplant. I want robots mowing my lawn. I want to be able to change anything about my physical appearance with a cheap surgical operation. I want to stay 30 and healthy till the day something violent kills me. I want prosthetic eyes that can see in infrared, take photos, put nametags above all the people who's names I forget, put a big flashing arrow above my car in the parking lot, and send video games and porn directly into my brain.

 

[donnay]

For fucks sake, this thread is like saying we shouldn't have airplanes because Boeing is run by assholes. Ridiculous technophobia.

Boeing shouldn't be the only monopoly making planes...I think you ought to look at it from that point of view.

Our society is being controlled my technocrats. Technology, in of itself, is a good thing, but when it gets in the wrong hands, and a few hands, tyranny almost always seems to follow.

"None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free."

 

[Endgame]

Boeing shouldn't be the only monopoly making planes...I think you ought to look at it from that point of view.

Our society is being controlled my technocrats. Technology, in of itself, is a good thing, but when it gets in the wrong hands, and a few hands, tyranny almost always seems to follow.

"None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free."

Which is more or less exactly what I said at the end of page 13.

 

[donnay]

Which is more or less exactly what I said at the end of page 13.

I dunno your comment sounds very jaded. You made the comment before that, which I commented on, about having technophobia. I explained that our society is being controlled by technocrats--that's not technophobia. Just trying to clarify my position.

 

[PaulConventionWV]

I'm actually just saying that if you don't agree with it, don't financially endorse it and that the assumption that scientists aren't regular people with as much common sense as anybody else and are out to destroy the world reeks of fear of the unknown. I've said myself that there are some legitemate concerns before, but people blow it out of proportions and start fear mongering as if it's the end of the world. 'Unforeseeable consequences' are just that, you can't foresee them and existence itself is full of them, so why single out genetic modifcation?

First society scares us with global cooling, then global warming and pig flu and who knows what else and now it's genetically modified food.

The scientists are supplying a demand and they're only responsible for their products. It's farmers who are responsible for their crops and consumers who are responsible for their groceries. It's funny how no one seems to blame any farmer for using it and hell, PaulConvention doesn't even blame himself (the consumer) for buying it (because it's cheaper and he believes that the government should make his prefered product cheaper) and everyone's raging on those scientists who play God. Share a little responsibility here.



Uh yeah, that wasn't the argument. He was saying that genetic modification can have bad unforeseen consequences; everything can. Period. So why suddenly draw a magic line because 'they can alter our DNA'? You know that sunlight can alter your DNA as well, right? In your lifetime?



Property rights are the problem here, or a lack thereof. Not genetically modified food.



Do your research? If it's so important to you, you would spend the extra few bucks on it. There's a reason it's more expensive and it's up to you, the consumer, to ultimately decide what the product's worth and if you want to comply with the price. If you want the government to control the market because you don't want to spend more money on certain products or do your own research, that's fine. I don't want that.

The reason it's expensive is because it's become scarce in the market. If we truly had a free market, it would be the norm, not the exception. The whole reason we have to spend more money on it is because the government has favorites and it's not on the side of organic products.

 

[PaulConventionWV]

Animals and plants naturally control their populations, we don't.

How do you know this? Can you provide documentation?

 

[ryanmkeisling]

I think large corporations, politicians, bureaucrats, pig cops, voters, and sadomasochists of all types have made the world a shitty place.

Technology, as far as I'm concerned, is wonderful without these people. I want a bioluminescent houseplant. I want robots mowing my lawn. I want to be able to change anything about my physical appearance with a cheap surgical operation. I want to stay 30 and healthy till the day something violent kills me. I want prosthetic eyes that can see in infrared, take photos, put nametags above all the people who's names I forget, put a big flashing arrow above my car in the parking lot, and send video games and porn directly into my brain.

So your idea of freedom is lazy, slovenly, self entitled, and will end up in just the situation your forum name implies. You are essentially a destructionist. You are also not ready or responsible enough for the society you seek. How did you find your way here? You are just the type of American that has put our country in its current predicament. You sound like a spoiled teenager, who could use a good old country ass kicking.

 

[PaulConventionWV]

I think large corporations, politicians, bureaucrats, pig cops, voters, and sadomasochists of all types have made the world a shitty place.

Technology, as far as I'm concerned, is wonderful without these people. I want a bioluminescent houseplant. I want robots mowing my lawn. I want to be able to change anything about my physical appearance with a cheap surgical operation. I want to stay 30 and healthy till the day something violent kills me. I want prosthetic eyes that can see in infrared, take photos, put nametags above all the people who's names I forget, put a big flashing arrow above my car in the parking lot, and send video games and porn directly into my brain.

Then you are one sick fuck. Technology like that is just another tool to control people. It's always the next new thing to keep people distracted from what's really important in life, which is NOT making yourself more comfortable and making your life less meaningful because you spend your days coddled in a tech box with all your little creature comforts. It's sickening how people embrace things like this instead of being wary of technology. After all, did nature not bring us to what we are? I don't care what you believe, nature is a wondeful thing, and I think it brings testament to God's great works. But if you believe we should sacrifice the natural part of our lives in order to wrap our selves in our technology and lose the simplicity that nature offers, then we are in real trouble and life has become ultimately meaningless, except to chase the next human invention that makes your life a little less eventful and more easy to just glide through.

 

[Cutlerzzz]

So your idea of freedom is lazy, slovenly, self entitled, and will end up in just the situation your forum name implies. You are essentially a destructionist. You are also not ready or responsible enough for the society you seek. How did you find your way here? You are just the type of American that has put our country in its current predicament. You sound like a spoiled teenager, who could use a good old country ass kicking.

Quite the tough guy, eh?

 

[ryanmkeisling]

How do you know this? Can you provide documentation?

Sure its called a predator prey relationship and survival of the fittest. We have no predators beyond ourselves, and through all of this scientific imbalance we are preying on ourselves and we have government programs to take care of those of us who aren't fit to survive, at the expense of those who can. In nature, balance always happens because nature doesn't care, just go into a forest, there is a thing called the food chain. When forests or wild place get over managed by human intervention things fall out of balance, there are plenty of examples.

When I farm I mimic nature, create healthy soils teaming with microbic life and the plants live within symbiotic relationships (legumes like peas and beans are nitrogen fixing, they pull nitrogen right from the atmosphere where it is free and abundant and they feed the soils microflora (which can also fix nitrogen from the atmosphere and minerals through chelation) which in turn feeds many other species of plants which cannot perform this function) and do not get overcome by weeds or require fertilizers, pesticides or herbicides, the animals do not require medication because they have healthy diets rich in minerals and micronutrients from the plants and the soil which their waste products feed (it is one big system) and are not overpopulated and I have abundance, so much so that I make a healthy living from it, in many cases I cannot meet demand for the products I produce. It is almost a self sustaining system(s.) Biodynamics and permaculture are worth studying but there is no profit in them other than they are sustainable and therefore the greedy could care less. I also make money teaching this stuff to other farmers and gardeners, but they could learn it themselves just by observing nature it is free knowledge all around us, if we weren't distracted by entertainment and technology.

And all people have to do is come to the farm and see this at work, rather than trust the government or someone else to verify it for them.

In turn all of the products of the farm support healthy human life and I am making more money every year as people wake up to these facts. I have not had even a cold in the past 5 years (since I started farming these systems) and I have had type 1 insulin dependent diabetes for 21 years, since the age of 13. I am gradually reducing the amount of insulin I require, slowly but surly, simply by living this way and my doctor cannot figure out why since the rest of his patients have horrible complications, and continue to require more and more insulin to survive.

I used to be a professional chef and hardcore drug addict living in Boston and NYC and had horrible complications myself, autonomic and peripheral neuropathy, brittle diabetic control, nerve damage the doctors told me I would never heal from, I am now more healthy than most 34 year olds walking around. So I just don't believe in this stuff I know, for a fact it is true and it is the way to healthy living. I do not just come on here and run my mouth about things I know nothing about, I live this life, for real.

 

[ryanmkeisling]

Quite the tough guy, eh?

Not really, I have lived a tough life, tough enough to know when I see overindulgence and a poor, spoiled, entitled attitude part of the reason America is now in the position it is in.. You don't think that post sounds like a spoiled teenager?