Gary Johnson Gary Johnson just announced that he is running for President

[BamaFanNKy]

Already answered that here why what you're saying is not true.

Maybe some symbols will help you:

word-by-word quote with full context =\= the rants of some moron

You only changed your statement when I pressed you. Also, in this thread people informed you that Gary Johnson called it a misquote. So, go ahead. Retract a second statement tonight and save some more face.

 

[low preference guy]

You only changed your statement when I pressed you.

That's also proven to be false in the same link you're quoting.

 

[BamaFanNKy]

That's also proven to be false in the same link you're quoting.

Spin spin spin. Stick to your story. Just like Raimondo you both talk out your ass then walk your statements back later.

 

[libertybrewcity]

I don't think Ron and Gary will necessarily pull from the same pool of voters. In other words, I think the GJ target audience is different than the RP target audience.

There wouldn't be this much "uproar" about it if there wasn't supporter overlap. I know some people that supported RP in 2008 that are now vehemently opposed to him (mainly because of his supporters) but now support Johnson. You know them too because I've seen some of your comments on other people's fb status' about it. I just don't see where this whole other group of supporters will come from. The Libertarian base in the Republican Party and outside for that matter is small to begin with, and converting democrats is a terrible, failed strategy.

 

[BamaFanNKy]

I know some people that supported RP in 2008 that are now vehemently opposed to him (mainly because of his supporters) but now support Johnson.

Oddly, I will vote Ron probably over Gary but, this above is something that concerns me. If Ron got the bid, could he win despite his followers.

Imagine how successful Jesus would of been if during the "Sermon on the Mount" Matthew, Luke and John kept yelling "JESUS CHRIST" and "RAISE THE DEAD."

 

[libertybrewcity]

Oddly, I will vote Ron probably over Gary but, this above is something that concerns me. If Ron got the bid, could he win despite his followers.

Imagine how successful Jesus would of been if during the "Sermon on the Mount" Matthew, Luke and John kept yelling "JESUS CHRIST" and "RAISE THE DEAD."

You have a good point. It would take a crap load of work, that is for sure. And Americans don't usually go for "extreme" candidates, or extreme from their perspective. Look at Goldwater's complete failure. As for supporter's behavior, I think supporters play a large role in campaigns. But, if RP did go on to win the nomination the supporters wouldn't be that big of news. There wouldn't really be an opportunity to yell "JESUS CHRIST". How many times did hear about supporters doing good or bad things in 08 for Obama other than just "there was a lot of youth support". Unless a supporter stomps on someone's head, news agencies are going to pay more attention to the candidate, polling, the horserace, and the issues (at least the controversial ones) with regards to flip flopping, debates, etc.

 

[sailingaway]

You have a good point. It would take a crap load of work, that is for sure. And Americans don't usually go for "extreme" candidates, or extreme from their perspective. Look at Goldwater's complete failure. As for supporter's behavior, I think supporters play a large role in campaigns. But, if RP did go on to win the nomination the supporters wouldn't be that big of news. There wouldn't really be an opportunity to yell "JESUS CHRIST". How many times did hear about supporters doing good or bad things in 08 for Obama other than just "there was a lot of youth support". Unless a supporter stomps on someone's head, news agencies are going to pay more attention to the candidate, polling, the horserace, and the issues (at least the controversial ones) with regards to flip flopping, debates, etc.

Supporters are used against Ron because we are all the handle they have. The man is near spotless. I wish we didn't give them such abundant ammunition.

We might want to start to spread the word that in GOP events where 'outsiders' are, or other candidates, it might be a good idea not to yell 'End the Fed' because outsiders view it as turrets syndrome.

 

[Imperial]

Yes, the Fed is a problem, and it is one of the biggest. But one doesn't have to talk about the Fed day and night to be a libertarian-minded individual. Michael Badnarik for example doesn't discuss the Fed very much. Maybe it's just not in Gary's platform? Rand didn't discuss the Fed very much either, and still doesn't.

Agreed. I went to CPAC with a bunch of College Republicans, and a lot of Paul supporters rubbed them the wrong way because they constantly interrupted speeches with yells of "End the Fed"- when the context just didn't fit. The Federal Reserve is important, but we cannot drop to the level of seeming to obsessive on a tiny handful of causes celebre (much like the LaRouchies do).

 

[Chowder]

Yes I was starting to feel the same way years back when at one time I thought the movement was a bunch of kooks yelling and screaming their heads off. (Of course I was younger and still ignorant and brainwashed with neo-con ideology.) But yes the Ron Paul supporters need to keep calm and just cheer instead of hollering like a cult. If they can do that, we could even go the to Tea-Parties and calmly educate the misinformed masses without getting to emotional about it. The grassroots should spread the word during rallies and get the supporters to behave like supporters and not the kook fringe.

 

[MRoCkEd]

I understand the problem of splitting the support that comes from both of them running, and I was one of the people encouraging Gary to go for Senate.

But it annoys me how people are harping on areas where Gary isn't "pure" as if he's some sort of big government guy. In my view, Gary Johnson is a true defender of freedom and I would definitely vote for him if Ron wasn't running.

With that being said, this is the Ron Paul forums, so the mod staff will probably have to come up with some approach to this Ron v. Gary clusterf#$%, which I figured was coming soon.

 

[sailingaway]

Yes I was starting to feel the same way years back when at one time I thought the movement was a bunch of kooks yelling and screaming their heads off. (Of course I was younger and still ignorant and brainwashed with neo-con ideology.) But yes the Ron Paul supporters need to keep calm and just cheer instead of hollering like a cult. If they can do that, we could even go the to Tea-Parties and calmly educate the misinformed masses without getting to emotional about it. The grassroots should spread the word during rallies and get the supporters to behave like supporters and not the kook fringe.

Most of us do behave calmly, but those who shout end the fed inappropriately kinda stand out.

 

[Matt Collins]

There wouldn't be this much "uproar" about it if there wasn't supporter overlap. I know some people that supported RP in 2008 that are now vehemently opposed to him (mainly because of his supporters) but now support Johnson. You know them too because I've seen some of your comments on other people's fb status' about it. I just don't see where this whole other group of supporters will come from. The Libertarian base in the Republican Party and outside for that matter is small to begin with, and converting democrats is a terrible, failed strategy.

Show me some polling data.

 

[libertybrewcity]

Show me some polling data.

Show you polling data of what? That converting democrats is a failed strategy? Or that GJ and RP supporters come from the same base.
The answer to the later question really comes from the lack of polling data favoring GJ. He has probably polled 1% in one poll that I've seen, and hasn't really been included in any other polls.

I don't think you need polling data to conclude that GJ and RP supporters come from the same base. Just from this site you have a lot of people that say they would vote for Johnson if RP drops out. You are defending Johnson yourself. Why? I'm guessing because he is a friend of liberty.

Now, I think that RP has the potential to and is making in roads with other groups of voters like Christians and culturally conservative voters. Johnson probably doesn't have the message to attract many of these voters, so therefore he is trying out other groups.

Do you have polling data that proves the base of GJ and RP don't overlap?

 

[Nathan Hale]

You wson't be able to prove voter overlap or lack thereof because it's just too early. That's the reason Gary's at 1% - because nobody knows who he is or has heard his message (sound familiar, fans of 2007). Once the debate season kicks off we'll get a legitimate picture of the primary field, but right now all of these random polls are essentially meaningless. As are random assertations about voting overlap - Gary and Ron are taking profoundly different soundbite approaches, which means they'll likely attract different segments when the debates allow them speaking time. Gary, if anything, is going to market closer to the center because his angle of "run government like a business" is going to play to the pragmatists.

 

[doodle]

Gary Johnson's domestic governance policy and generally libertarian ideas sound good, I'm interested in knowing about his views on foreign wars and justifiable rationale for taking America to war, military alliances and war spending, and relationship beteween foreign wars and domestic liberties. Governor Bush was also a small government guy until he got thurst into war campaigns and Republican party became posterboy (or is it postergirl) of big government spending taking America into $4 Trillion and counting wars. Bush's convictions came more from his personal religious outlook rather than his belief in the Constitution of the US and were easily swayed by surrounding forces.
So far Ron Paul is the only politician in Washignton I know whose articulation of policies on pretty much all key issues, domestic as well as foreign, exhibits a clear and strong belief in the US Constitution.

Repost from discussion on Justin Riamondo article on him:
From that article:

LINK

Furthermore, he went on to say that our military alliances is general are also "key" in fighting the "war on terrorism" that he believes we must continue to wage, albeit not in Afghanistan and Iraq. The vagueness of all this is disconcerting, especially when one senses the echo of Obama-ism in this "libertarian" version of multilateralism.

The problem with Johnson’s benign view of military alliances is that they are a tripwire for US intervention: after all, what does a military alliance mean if not joint defense – or offense – against a common enemy? Johnson emphasizes our alliance with Israel, and yet what does this alliance mean other than a guarantee that the US will come to Israel’s assistance in case of war — and that is not to say who will start the war.

But Johnson says reducing America’s foreign military deployments won’t mean an end to U.S. military alliances.

“I’m opposed to foreign aid, because we’re borrowing 43 cents out of every dollar to pay for foreign aid,” Johnson said. “When it comes to military alliances, Israel is a key military ally, and will remain so.”

But Johnson questions the current U.S. policy of defending an independent Taiwan from Communist China.

“I think Taiwan is an absolutely unique situation. It is part of China, and I think that ultimately we do not want to get involved in a world war over Taiwan,” Johnson said. “It is a military alliance. It is something we should maintain.”

I'd like him to declare his stance on wars waged under such military alliances and is alliance with Taiwan the only alliance not worth taking America to world war? If he believes in one way alliance with Israel where US military needs to defend Israel even though they didn't send a single troop to front lines in Iraq or Afghanistan, that is an illogical and problematic position. Liberatarian philosophy is far more comprehensive way of thinking than just standing for freedom to smoke pot and heroin clinics.
His vagueness on these issues needs to be dissected in depth.

Based on one clip of his friendly interview with Hannity, he did not comes across as big Constitution guy and spent more time promoting himself rather than his ideas about America other than drug laws. Will check out his other vews to see what his convictions are and what are they rooted in.

 

[Matt Collins]

I don't think you need polling data to conclude that GJ and RP supporters come from the same base.

Really? You might be surprised, especially if Ron and GJ package themselves differently than we both expect.

 

[libertybrewcity]

Really? You might be surprised, especially if Ron and GJ package themselves differently than we both expect.

I do know their differences, or at least what they will focus on. We'll see what happens.