France orders illegal Roma immigrants expelled: Sounds like the US..

constituent said:
Hey, you're the one who wants to dismiss the constitution.

And I'll answer your question once you've answered mine. ;)
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Im not dismissing the Constitution. In fact, its clear that controlling immigration is one of the functions of it. I would certainly amend it to get rid of that anchor baby shit though.

The question is what happens when the Federal government purposesly refuses to do it's job, and instead chooses to do what it is NOT empowered to do... Should the states then just refuse to act in the best interest of their own citizens?

The truth is that I have had so many SNs that I dont even know... and I was only temp banned once for telling a mod off. You are making me remember why I keep leaving though...

I swear you freaking ancaps are the bane of the liberty movement.
 
How a about we defend are borders and protect the rights of the citizens. Illegal immigrations is illegal just like someone setting up shop in your house is illegal.

There is no difference especially when illegals can pick the pockets of anyone of us using the coerced welfare state.

Anyone who calls this racist is an intellectual moron really...
 
Paleo said:
Big L libertarians do suck on the immigration issue. Pure Ancap-ism is no more reasonable or rational than socialist anarchism.

without a defineable national identity and culture that embraces individual liberty for OURSELVES, and protects it zealously from all comers, we are dead before we even start.

RP isn't infallible.
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No, there is no national culture. Cultures vary based on the people in an area. New England will always have a different culture than the Bible Belt. If you think you can force your cultural bullshit down the throats of everyone else, you're a statist tool.

Paleoconservativism is no more reasonable than neoconservatism. It's the same fascist crap.
 
Live_Free_Or_Die said:
Thank goodness for those consistent libertarians who are real Champions of the Constitution that don't flip flop on immigration when it's politically convenient.
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Madison and Jefferson would run the other way if they ran into you guys. :D
 
Live_Free_Or_Die said:
Thank goodness for those consistent libertarians who are real Champions of the Constitution that don't flip flop on immigration when it's politically convenient.
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More like consistently suicidal. That is why I don't consider myself a libertarian. Libertarians are not pragmatic and are not consequentialists. They are ideologically rigid to their own detriment and are willing to sacrifice their desired ends in order to prove their ideological "purity" in the short term. Massive Long Term Third World Immigration will just enlarge the welfare state, and third worlders disproportionately vote for welfarist candidates and pro-establishment candidates. They are being imported solely for cheap labor and for the votes, while in the mean time Americans are being driven to unemployment and the welfare rolls, only making or fiscal and economic problems worse.
 
Make all the laws you want. Nobody gives a fuck. Libertarians, conservatives, liberals... -- almost everyone active in politics never seems to realize this.

You can't stop illegal immigration, just burden taxpayers trying to. Same with drugs, violence, fraud... - so fuck it -- I am encouraged when restrictive laws are passed. Those loyal enough to the USG to pay taxes are the people being punished with immigration laws.
 
I think it's fine to oppose overzealous enforcement.

If a state or city does it on their own, that's fine too.
 
Kludge said:
Make all the laws you want. Nobody gives a fuck. Libertarians, conservatives, liberals... -- almost everyone active in politics never seems to realize this.

You can't stop illegal immigration, just burden taxpayers trying to. Same with drugs, violence, fraud... - so fuck it -- I am encouraged when restrictive laws are passed. Those loyal enough to the USG to pay taxes are the people being punished with immigration laws.
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You can definitely reduce, maybe not stop all together, but certainly reduce illegal immigration through law enforcement and the passage of new laws. It is a matter of fact that 100,000 illegal immigrants have left Arizona since the passage of SB 1070, Romas are also being rounded up and/or self deporting in France. I don't feel like I am being punished, and in the long run, enforcement of immigration laws costs less than allowing illegals to drain public services and the social costs are less as they don't drag down the communities they squat in.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/05/03/eveningnews/main6457212.shtml
 
I would suggest placing the borders under the responsibility of various margraves, with command of their own armies, to solve the issue of unauthorized immigration.
 
Paleo said:
without a defineable national identity and culture that embraces individual liberty for OURSELVES, and protects it zealously from all comers, we are dead before we even start.
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That.

I will say one thing about gypsies: they are their own worst enemy in many ways. They are culturally inclined to thievery and violence. I know this first hand having spent a lot of time in place like Hungary watching them. It is the way they choose to live and interact with others, which is the reason they are despised. Accountability cuts all ways and one cannot reasonably assert that the dislike of gypsies is purely based in "racism". It is demonstrably false.

Back in the 80s or early 90s, Hungary went all PC and built huge housing complexes for gypsies. They destroyed those places in short order and were nuisances as they have always been. Most refused to use the toilets and would go down to the bushes and crap there. When hundreds are doing the same in a relatively confined space, not only is it disgusting, it is hazardous. On the whole, gypsies really do behave in very vile ways - notably more so than most other ethnic groups with which I have become familiar.

It may not be right to kick them out of a nation, but their behaviors are not right either, on the whole. Were it just that they were "different", I'd understand the complaint. They are criminals mostly and they are therefore accountable for such behavior. Because of the ingrained criminality of their culture, it is no wonder most everyone wants them gone. I sure as hell would not want to live amongst them.
 
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osan said:
That.

I will say one thing about gypsies: they are theor own worst enemy in many ways. They are culturally incliend to thievery and violence. I know this first hand having spent a lot of time in place like Hungary watching them. It is the way they choose to live and interact with others, which is the reason they are despised. Accountability cuts all ways and one cannot reasonably assert that the dislike of gypsies is purely based in "racism". It is demonstrably false.

Back in the 80s or early 90s, Hungary wen't all PC and built huge housing complexes for gypsies. They destroyed those places in short order and were nuissances as they have always been. Most refused to use the toilets and would god down to the bushes and crap there. When hundreds are doing the same in a relatively confined space, not only is it disgusting, it is hazardous. On the whole, gypsies really do behave in very vile ways - notably more so than most other ethnic groups with which I have become familiar.

It may not be right to kick them out of a nation, but their behaviors are not right either, on the whole. Were it just that they were "different", I'd understand the complaint. They are criminals mostly and they are therefore accountable for such behavior. Because of the ingrained criminality of their culture, it is no wonder most everyone wants them gone. I sure as hell would not want to live amongst them.
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This shit is fucking racist. God forbid you focus on the individual criminals instead of lumping everyone in the "them" category. What if you were a law abiding gypsy, how would you feel if you were lumped in with all the criminals? Way to be anti liberty and individual freedom.
 
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osan said:
That.

I will say one thing about gypsies: they are theor own worst enemy in many ways. They are culturally incliend to thievery and violence. I know this first hand having spent a lot of time in place like Hungary watching them. It is the way they choose to live and interact with others, which is the reason they are despised. Accountability cuts all ways and one cannot reasonably assert that the dislike of gypsies is purely based in "racism". It is demonstrably false.

Back in the 80s or early 90s, Hungary wen't all PC and built huge housing complexes for gypsies. They destroyed those places in short order and were nuissances as they have always been. Most refused to use the toilets and would god down to the bushes and crap there. When hundreds are doing the same in a relatively confined space, not only is it disgusting, it is hazardous. On the whole, gypsies really do behave in very vile ways - notably more so than most other ethnic groups with which I have become familiar.

It may not be right to kick them out of a nation, but their behaviors are not right either, on the whole. Were it just that they were "different", I'd understand the complaint. They are criminals mostly and they are therefore accountable for such behavior. Because of the ingrained criminality of their culture, it is no wonder most everyone wants them gone. I sure as hell would not want to live amongst them.
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How collectivist of you.
 
Another Zombie thread rises from the grave...

Crime is crime. No reason to single out a particular group.
 
crazyfacedjenkins said:
This shit is fucking racist. God forbid you focus on the individual criminals instead of lumping everyone in the "them" category. What if you were a law abiding gypsy, how would you feel if you were lumped in with all the criminals? Way to be anti liberty and individual freedom.
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Spew all the emotionalist nonsense you please. I've been there and experienced these people first hand. It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with behavior. I will also point out your problems in reading comprehension. Nowhere did I say they were all the same. I wrote that on the whole the behavior is criminal - meaning mainly. Go to Hungary and you will find not many people who care much for gypsies not because they are gypsies but because of the ways most behave. I have spent day after day watching them for hours on end as they would mug and beat people in broad daylight, for example, on Market Street in Debrecen. I have observed this activity all seasons of the year, year in and year out. That is not racism. It is simply observed fact.

Make whatever charge of "racism" you please. It does not impress me much. My opinions are based on first hand observation, not second hand hearsay.
 
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