Favorite Study of Open Borders Advocates Debunked: Immigration Reduces Wages

[AmericanSpartan]

The GAO figures were biased and inaccurate? Yes- that was my point. From their PDF:



Large volume referring to all arrests- not just immigrant arrests- they would have had to look at if they examined all cases individually. Again noting that being arrested does not necessarily mean being guilty.



They could not say for sure so they had to just guess.



30% is a huge margin of error.

So how many act of terrorism/murder and liberties lost due to knee jerk reactions are enough for you and your side?

 

[The Free Hornet]

5. Mandate E-verify for all jobs
6. Punish all business who hires illegal labor

Why 5 & 6, unless you're some kind of fascist piece of shit? [Which is actually implied by BOTH 5 AND 6, but I digress ....]

Businesses like where I work DO E-verify and don't want the responsibility of simultaniously being an arm of the police state and not getting dinged for discrimination (either 'country of origin', race/ethnicity, language (when/if non applicable to job)).

Unlike racists like yourself, I can't discriminate based on skin color, country of origin (or whether somebody's parents were first world or third world) or what language people speak (unless it were to prevent safe operation - I think ... not too sure on the last point).

Do you know the distinction between wealth and wages? All you had to do is oppose the welfare state and the end your fucking post. Instead you post a laundry list of contradictory, fascist bullshit and threaten the people that pay for all your nonsense.

Businesses are focused on wealth creation - mainly their own - not your culture wars. We're not your bitches however much it seems that way with all the taxes we pay.

 

[The Free Hornet]

No, we give cops the power to ask for ID, pass national E vitrify, and maybe a nation SB1070 law, making it illegal to rent to illegals, they will leave and said laws will be repealed.

So you unambiguously want to grant more power to the police state and require landlords (of which I am one - lilly white tennants fwiw) to wear your jackboots in addition to us employers as well???

You are naive enough to think "said laws will be repealed"? How can anybody on this forum be that stupid? By chance, are you a third worlder???:

When you take a large volume of people from the 3rd world, what do you think you will get? We have more then enough dumb people in America, why do we need to import more of them?

It's hopeful when I encounter foreigners online who understand the value and meaning of the constitution. People like yourself that would piss it all away on the culture wars are the inexplicably "dumb" ones.

And no, attacking fucking stupidity is not an endorsement of "open borders" or any other imaginary strawmen you're likely to reply with.

 

[The Free Hornet]

Richer, more resources for all, more over we have automation on the near future for us, we will of tens of million people out of work, we need to plan for that.

Not sure ...

The housing market would crash so if you inherit a house (from a relative that off themself) it is likely to be under water, financially. The debt doesn't just disappear but suddenly businesses have half as many customers with double the necessary productive capacity (automated or not).

Obviously constuction will just tank. Whether low oil is a problem or not, the glut gets glutier. We may have more resources but by what standard are you or I resource restrained? Arguably, it is productivity that drives wealth and it is unclear how offing the population (without selecting which half) is going to increase productivity.

Suggesting "we need to plan" for millions out of work is code for you being a mincome-style socialist. That's the implication I'm reading because there is no reason to otherwise (centrally) plan for such. If productivity and return on capital explodes, that is great for the capitalists. The only reason to "plan" on unemployment would be if your intentions are to be a non-capitalist unemployed loafer (but not a third worlder).

 

[AmericanSpartan]

Why 5 & 6, unless you're some kind of fascist piece of shit? [Which is actually implied by BOTH 5 AND 6, but I digress ....]

Businesses like where I work DO E-verify and don't want the responsibility of simultaniously being an arm of the police state and not getting dinged for discrimination (either 'country of origin', race/ethnicity, language (when/if non applicable to job)).

Unlike racists like yourself, I can't discriminate based on skin color, country of origin (or whether somebody's parents were first world or third world) or what language people speak (unless it were to prevent safe operation - I think ... not too sure on the last point).

Do you know the distinction between wealth and wages? All you had to do is oppose the welfare state and the end your fucking post. Instead you post a laundry list of contradictory, fascist bullshit and threaten the people that pay for all your nonsense.

Businesses are focused on wealth creation - mainly their own - not your culture wars. We're not your bitches however much it seems that way with all the taxes we pay.

Once again, do not care about your name calling, we want our wages protected, our tax burden lesser, our laws enforce, our demographics in control and insure we are not replaced inside our our nation and out voted by imported 3rd worlders.

 

[AmericanSpartan]

Not sure ...

The housing market would crash so if you inherit a house (from a relative that off themself) it is likely to be under water, financially. The debt doesn't just disappear but suddenly businesses have half as many customers with double the necessary productive capacity (automated or not).

Still tax burden is less and the leftist voter base is gone, still a win win. Also markets crash, bubbles pop do not be a sheep.

Obviously constuction will just tank. Whether low oil is a problem or not, the glut gets glutier. We may have more resources but by what standard are you or I resource restrained? Arguably, it is productivity that drives wealth and it is unclear how offing the population (without selecting which half) is going to increase productivity.

production is related to demand.

Suggesting "we need to plan" for millions out of work is code for you being a mincome-style socialist. That's the implication I'm reading because there is no reason to otherwise (centrally) plan for such. If productivity and return on capital explodes, that is great for the capitalists. The only reason to "plan" on unemployment would be if your intentions are to be a non-capitalist unemployed loafer (but not a third worlder).

Have you seen how they vote?

 

[PierzStyx]

Why 5 & 6, unless you're some kind of fascist piece of shit? [Which is actually implied by BOTH 5 AND 6, but I digress ....]

Businesses like where I work DO E-verify and don't want the responsibility of simultaniously being an arm of the police state and not getting dinged for discrimination (either 'country of origin', race/ethnicity, language (when/if non applicable to job)).

Unlike racists like yourself, I can't discriminate based on skin color, country of origin (or whether somebody's parents were first world or third world) or what language people speak (unless it were to prevent safe operation - I think ... not too sure on the last point).

Do you know the distinction between wealth and wages? All you had to do is oppose the welfare state and the end your fucking post. Instead you post a laundry list of contradictory, fascist bullshit and threaten the people that pay for all your nonsense.

Businesses are focused on wealth creation - mainly their own - not your culture wars. We're not your bitches however much it seems that way with all the taxes we pay.

That would be because AmericanSpartan is a good old fashioned National Socialist, that special brand of fascism obsessed with race, through and through.

 

[William R]

http://www.realclearpolicy.com/blog/2016/01/05/the_new_debate_over_the_mariel_boatlift_1510.html

What do you know? Its almost like basic logic and reasoning has disproved a total myth!

Never been rocket science.

 

[William R]

or it increases profits for corporations and their sharebolders. But it also can be offset with increasing welfare and taxes to support. Do we need immigrants? What bad would happen if we severely limited immigration

From 1925 to 1965 we severely limited immigrationm we assimilated newcomers and the middle class become rock solid with a growing standard of living. In the past 30 years with mass immigration wages for the bottom 80 percent have stagnated and aren't keeping up with inflation. Rich guys like me have done great, but for the vast majority of Americans things aren't going so well. We need to enforce immigration laws and only let skilled self sufficient people become citizens. We need to stop importing poverty!!

 

[r3volution 3.0]

Richer, more resources for all...

Is labor a resource?

Does less labor mean less production?

 

[AmericanSpartan]

From 1925 to 1965 we severely limited immigrationm we assimilated newcomers and the middle class become rock solid with a growing standard of living. In the past 30 years with mass immigration wages for the bottom 80 percent have stagnated and aren't keeping up with inflation. Rich guys like me have done great, but for the vast majority of Americans things aren't going so well. We need to enforce immigration laws and only let skilled self sufficient people become citizens. We need to stop importing poverty!!

I know its almost like they want to replace the American people and culture with serfdom, its almost like their trying to elect a new people.

For every new job created between 2000 and 2014, the U.S. added two new immigrants to it’s population. 89% of these immigrants were of working-age when they arrived.
The Center for Immigration Studies found that all net new jobs went to immigrants from November 2007 to November 2015 (Since 2000: 9.3 million new jobs, 18 million new immigrants)
Median weekly earnings of foreign-born in 2014 were $155 less than for native-born ($664 vs.$820). This creates a downward pressure on wages for all workers.
Wages for native workers in a particular occupation decline when immigrants enter that occupation in large numbers. Immigration reduces earnings for U.S. workers and increases profits for U.S.employers of immigrants. Native workers lose $402 billion overall in reduced wages per year due to immigration
Congress: Middle class incomes drop as immigration surges, But when immigration expanded, the incomes of the bottom 90 percent of Americans went flat and then dropped beginning in 2000.
Immigration and the American Worker


Think it’s only Blue collar jobs on the line?
Wrong! Thanks to HB-1 visas now its once great paying careers in the STEM field.
CIS: NEARLY 8 MILLION STEM DEGREE HOLDERS IN U.S. NOT WORKING IN STEM FIELDS
America Has More Trained STEM Graduates than STEM Job Openings, So Why Import Foreign High-Tech Workers?
If there was a Shortage of STEM workers why are the wages falling in the STEM fields?
National Data: STEM Wages’ Shocking Stagnation Destroys Case For Increased Immigration
Because it’s a lie, spread by Tech firms import to import cheap workers. Working for pennies on a dollar is not a “skill” nor is it a benefit to the American worker, student, or taxpayer.
It was not always like this. During the low-immigration period from 1948-1973, real median compensation for U.S. workers increased more than 90 percent.


Great news Americas show Massive Support for Immigration reduction!
More over many Americans of all colors, age groups, and sides support reducing immigration.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/171962/decrease-immigration-increase.aspx
https://www.numbersusa.com/news/pol...er-immigration-enforcement-oppose-pres-obamas
https://www.numbersusa.com/content/...americans-prefer-lower-immigration-numbe.html
http://dailycaller.com/2015/04/22/media-ignores-evidence-americans-want-to-reduce-legal-immigration/

More Americans said they had a favorable opinion of North Korea (11 percent) than wanted to than wanted to increase immigration (7 percent). The poll data are overwhelming; politicians will disregard public opinion on this issue at their peril: Remember RINO Eric Cantor and how he lost the primary to David Brat? (Cantor was denying the border was being overrun as the media was showing human waves over taking it during the two weeks before the election)

* Gallup (1/29/15): By a more than 5-to-1 margin (39% vs. 7%), Americans who are dissatisfied with current immigration levels want less rather than more

* Pew (2012): 69% say we should “restrict and control people coming to live in our country more than we do now” (including 59% of Hispanics)

* Reuters (8/7/14): By a nearly 3-to-1 margin (45% vs. 17%), Americans think immigration rates should be reduced, not increased

* Princeton Survey Research Associates (6/23/13): 61% say that there “should be restrictions” on the number of STEM-related foreign workers allowed to enter the U.S.

* Gallup (6/8/14): By a 2-to-1 margin (41% vs. 22%), Americans think immigration should be decreased rather than increased

* The Polling Company (8/14/14): By a staggering 10-to-1 margin (75% vs. 8%), Americans believe that a business seeking workers should raise wages and improve working conditions before hiring new labor from abroad

* Paragon Insights (9/2014): By an almost 5-to-1 margin (74% vs. 15%), likely voters said they would be more likely to vote for a Republican who said “the American people are right to be concerned about their jobs and wages, and elected officials should put the needs of American workers first.” 70% said they would be more likely (vs. just 18% who would be less likely) to vote for a Republican who said that “the first goal of immigration policy needs to be getting unemployed Americans back to work – not importing more low-wage workers to replace them.”




Any wonder why Trump is leading in the polls as does any Immigration Patriot

Is labor a resource?

Does less labor mean less production?

Some kinds? Yes.

No, we have automation with reduces costs and burdens.