Does Rand need to change for the next go around (2020) or was this just not his time?

The problem is the candidate. Rand should stick to the Senate from here on out, he's obviously not the right guy to run for President. Not enough killer instinct to compete successfully at that level.
 
Most people vote based on emotion. Rand didn't illicit much, if any.

Agreed.

I liked Rand's message, but poor delivery and personality.

He always sounded so monotone at the debates, and uninspiring. No emotion, no raising of his voice, or even yelling. Just overall bland.
 
The problem is the candidate. Rand should stick to the Senate from here on out, he's obviously not the right guy to run for President. Not enough killer instinct to compete successfully at that level.

Yeah, we need to run someone from the liberty movement who can go on national TV and say with a straight face he wants to make the sand glow, shoot down Russian planes and send more people to Gitmo so we can enhanced interrogate them.
 
Yeah, we need to run someone from the liberty movement who can go on national TV and say with a straight face he wants to make the sand glow, shoot down Russian planes and send more people to Gitmo so we can enhanced interrogate them.

Well, that's the best way to win. It's what the people crave. It's got electrolytes.
 
Secure the border, stop involving ourselves in the corrupt politics of the Middle East, and respond with overwhelming force against anyone who dares to attack the United States. Pretty simple message, and very popular. Foreign policy is not a weakness of the Liberty Movement unless a candidate allows it to be.

Pretty much what Ron said in 2008 and 2012! :eek:
 
I don't think Rand should run again at least not in 2020, too much ambition this this time around. Focus on becoming on being a senator who votes with his heart not what you think might play in a general election, build a record and maybe the time will come again to run.
 
I don't think Rand should run again at least not in 2020, too much ambition this this time around. Focus on becoming on being a senator who votes with his heart not what you think might play in a general election, build a record and maybe the time will come again to run.

I agree. Rand is not that great of a Presidential candidate. He needs to cook his jets for a while.
 
I don't think Rand should run again at least not in 2020, too much ambition this this time around. Focus on becoming on being a senator who votes with his heart not what you think might play in a general election, build a record and maybe the time will come again to run.

He has a voting record equal or better, from my perspective, to Ron Paul's. What vote do you object to? He is tops on every liberty scorecard. What vote could you be thinking of that he made to play to a general election?
 
Yes Rand needs to change. Not his views but in his deliverance of the issues.

Don't believe me? Watch a Judge NAP speech.
 
Rand can't control the circumstances (Trump, Bernie, ISIS), which undoubtedly hurt him.

But he can control his communication/messaging. Unless he accepts communication coaching, he shouldn't bother running again. To wit:

1) He doesn't drive home his points so that the sheeple understand how his policies would be to their benefit:

a. He expresses noninterventionism militarily, so the sheeple perceive him as weak; he needs to close the sale by explaining that wars are expensive, and if we change course we can eliminate the income tax/IRS, while actually being safer from absence of blowback. Those things
are left unsaid by Rand.

b. He expresses opposition to the NSA surveilance, so the sheeple perceive him as weak; he needs to close the sale by explaining that the NSA is expensive, and if we abolish it we can eliminate the income tax/IRS, while regaining our privacy from a government we cannot trust. Those things are left unsaid by Rand.

c. He expresses concern for a national debt of 19 million, but the sheeple can't count so their eyes glaze; he needs to close the sale by explaining that debt is expensive, and if we change course we can eliminate the income tax/IRS. That is left unsaid by Rand.

d. He says end the drug war, so the sheeple perceive him as soft on crime; he needs to close the sale by explaining that the drug war is expensive, and if we change course we can eliminate the income tax/IRS, while actually being more humane. Those things are left unsaid by Rand.

e. Insert dozens of other examples.

2) He must lose the uninspiring 'Read the bills', 'we need a party that looks like America', etc....it's just a waste of breath and comes off as pandering. He can complain that politicians don't read the bills, and that he's been to Detroit, in a stump speech, but he has to stop leading with it in interviews and on a debate stage.

3) He has to remember that he's running in a Republican primary, not a Democrat primary. A main reason he didn't do better is that people wonder why he's not running as a Democrat. He needs to lead with the red meat - smaller government, elimination of the Income Tax/IRS, government corruption/cronyism - and save much of the rest for the general election.
 
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Every cycle's different, different field, different top issues, etc, so in that sense of course Rand 2020 would have to be different from Rand 2016.

But the problem this time was basically outside Rand's control: ISIS and immigration were made into top issues, and they don't play to his strengths.

To win in 2020, we need that cycle to be more like 2012/2008 - focused on economic issues, shrinking government, and w/ a healthy dose of war weariness. The odds of that are good, IMO, as it looks like we're heading into another severe recession/crisis, and 4 more years of failure in the ME should turn the foreign policy pendulum back in our direction once again.
 
Rand cannot run in 2020 if a Republican wins this year.

Never say never.

If things go totally FUBAR in the next few years, economically in particular, there might be an opening: esp. if Trump's the incumbent.
 
I have great admiration for everything Rand tried to do and it was a fantastic effort, but he was playing a part that can't succeed. Here's the archetypes one can win with in modern presidential politics:

1. No-holds-barred, "can't be bought," advocate-for-extreme-change, fiery truth tellers (Ron Paul, Bernie Sanders)

2. Entertaining personalities (Trump)

3. Dependable, dry, "safe" establishment choices

Rand will never be #3. He is not #2. Therefore he needs to be #1 or stay on the sidelines.

That's reality, in a nutshell.
 
Rand can't control the circumstances (Trump, Bernie, ISIS), which undoubtedly hurt him.

But he can control his communication/messaging. Unless he accepts communication coaching, he shouldn't bother running again. To wit:

Your examples show another way Rand can finesse communicating the issues (by leaving most of his beliefs unsaid). The problem, though, is that we've already been through a campaign where Rand finessed communicating the issues. We found out that doesn't work, in terms of building a winning coalition. And the candidates who did do better talked mainly about issues other than taxes and fiscal restraint of government---they spoke about immigration, protecting the national interest from trade to refugee policy, and cultural issues.

Our next liberty candidate needs to talk about the issues the voters actually want to talk about (not the stereotypical ones we think they want to talk about), BUT to talk straightforwardly to them with pro-liberty answers, NOT finesse them. If they want to talk about jobs, talk about liberty approach to job creation and a growth economy. If they want to talk about health care, talk about the liberty approach to health care and health freedom. And so on---talk plainly about what issue comes up, and when it does, things are not to be left unsaid.
 
I think the root problem is people were just voting wrong this election. I think with some coaching & advice they can vote better in 2020
 
I don't see Rand ever winning the Presidency.

Hope he concentrates 100% on being the best Senator he can be & truly becomes a legend in that position.
 
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