Do churches have the right to refuse to perform a marriage?

[BW2112]

I'm asking because I don't know. Someone is saying that if churches don't want to perform gay marriages, then they need to give up their tax exempt status. I'm for gay marriage, but it's wrong to force anti-gay churches to perform them. So before this ruling today, did churches reserve the right to not perform a marriage for straight couples for whatever reason?

 

[Suzanimal]

I'm asking because I don't know. Someone is saying that if churches don't want to perform gay marriages, then they need to give up their tax exempt status. I'm for gay marriage, but it's wrong to force anti-gay churches to perform them. So before this ruling today, did churches reserve the right to not perform a marriage for straight couples for whatever reason?

I know some priests are picky about who they will marry.

 

[Sonny Tufts]

I'm asking because I don't know. Someone is saying that if churches don't want to perform gay marriages, then they need to give up their tax exempt status. I'm for gay marriage, but it's wrong to force anti-gay churches to perform them. So before this ruling today, did churches reserve the right to not perform a marriage for straight couples for whatever reason?

You raise an interesting point. There is precedent for revoking tax-exempt status if an institution operates in a manner that contravenes public policy. For example, in Bob Jones University v. United States, 461 U.S. 574 (1983), the Supreme Court upheld the revocation of the tax exemption of a private university that engaged in racially discriminatory practices.

On the other hand, to my knowledge no church has ever lost its exemption for refusing to perform a marriage, even an interracial one. After all, if the Catholic Church and orthodox Jewish congregations can practice sexual discrimination and keep their exempt status, there seems to be little to fear if a church refuses to sanction a gay marriage.

 

[westkyle]

Is a person married when they get a certificate from the state or is it a religious institution, a holy bind between a man. woman, and God? If people can get married by getting a piece of paper from the state, then what does it matter what marriage ritual a man and woman, man and man, or woman and woman use? Why don't homo-sexuals start their own version of Christianity or whatever religion that allows homo-sexual marriage? I just don't get the way people think, maybe it's these crazy libertarian ideas messing with my logic and mind.

 

[RJB]

Rights? What rights?

 

[euphemia]

Just to be on the safe side, a lot of churches are putting clauses in their by-laws to prevent being forced by the State to do same-sex marriages. States are also being proactive about introducing legislation to prevent force being brought to bear on religious groups with closely held marriage teaching.

See, here's the thing about rights: If the court gives a right to something, it means someone has to provide that thing. I think if the government wants to make this law, then the government should be forced to provide the service, and let the voters decide how they want to handle it.

 

[William Tell]

Do churches have the right to refuse to perform a marriage?

Of course. They are churches, not post offices. They don't owe you anything, what tehy do is of their own generosity. Some pastors are part time anyway, they can't all be at your beck and call 24/7.

 

[specsaregood]

I know some priests are picky about who they will marry.

If the courts can force/fine you for not baking a cake for a wedding or refusing to be their paid photographer I fail to see why they can't do the same to priests/ministers/churches.

 

[Theocrat]

The Calm Before the Storm

It is my strong belief that after today's Supreme Court ruling, there will be many from the homosexual community who will demand that churches marry them so that they will get those churches to lose their tax-exempt status and face legal issues from the federal government. It's the same tactic that many homosexuals have used in getting state governments to force Christian bakers to either make wedding cakes for them or suffer severe fines/penalties for not complying, under the guise of "hate crime" violations.

 

[William Tell]

It is my strong belief that after today's Supreme Court ruling, there will be many from the homosexual community who will demand that churches marry them so that they will get those churches to lose their tax-exempt status and face legal issues from the federal government. It's the same tactic that many homosexuals have used in getting state governments to force Christian bakers to either make wedding cakes for them or suffer severe fines/penalties for not complying, under the guise of "hate crime" violations.

I agree, this will backfire on those who try that though.

 

[Theocrat]

The Trojan Horse May Reside in the Gates

I agree, this will backfire on those who try that though.

Unfortunately, it may not backfire on them, given the fact that many churches disagree about whether homosexuality is sin or not. And you can rest assured that the mainstream media networks will showcase opinions from those Christians who agree with the SCOTUS' ruling in order to manipulate public opinion against those churches who would refuse marrying homosexuals.

 

[phill4paul]

Are your churches registered as a business. Do they hold a 501c status? Then yes. You are a government institution and they will tell you what you can and cannot do.

Time and again I have told Christians on these forums to divest themselves of government. Time and again most have thrown their backing to politicians that would preserve their sanctity of marriage. I'm just laughing my ass of now.

 

[Theocrat]

We Are Not 501(c)3

Are your churches registered as a business. Do they hold a 501c status? Then yes. You are a government institution and they will tell you what you can and cannot do.

Time and again I have told Christians on these forums to divest themselves of government. Time and again most have thrown their backing to politicians that would preserve their sanctity of marriage. I'm just laughing my ass of now.

My local church is not incorporated. We have a Biblical view of both church and state governments.

 

[fr33]

The catholic church refused to marry my brother and his wife because she was divorced. They didn't try to sue or anything. They just got married in their back yard. It's just another reason why the catholic church numbers are dwindling. Priests raping little kids? They'll cover it. Divorced adults? Fuck you! What a joke. And they claim to be worried about morals.

 

[heavenlyboy34]

The catholic church refused to marry my brother and his wife because she was divorced. They didn't try to sue or anything. They just got married in their back yard. It's just another reason why the catholic church numbers are dwindling. Priests raping little kids? They'll cover it. Divorced adults? Fuck you! What a joke. And they claim to be worried about morals.

I don't see a "joke" there. The RCC holds that divorced people can't remarry. It's not a big secret or anything. If you don't want to deal with that, either wait till you're mature enough to pick a lifelong spouse or join another religion. If you dig enough, you can probably find something you disagree with in every religion and in atheism.

 

[phill4paul]

My local church is not incorporated. We have a Biblical view of both church and state governments.

Very good. Then blessings be upon you to conduct your services as you wish.

Edit: I'm serious, not snark, in case I'm misconstrued.

 

[fr33]

I don't see a "joke" there. The RCC holds that divorced people can't remarry. It's not a big secret or anything. If you don't want to deal with that, either wait till you're mature enough to pick a lifelong spouse or join another religion. If you dig enough, you can probably find something you disagree with in every religion and in atheism.

It's a joke because that's how some people deal with a ridiculous organization. A woman who made a bad choice and married a man who beat her is required to stay with him for the rest of her life. That is Catholic rules and I say FUCK. CATHOLIC. RULES. because of that. I have no respect for an organization that preaches forgiveness even in this life but holds nobody accountable in this life. Priests rape boys and husbands beat wives. Their answer is to stick with them.

 

[Paulbot99]

It's a joke because that's how some people deal with a ridiculous organization. A woman who made a bad choice and married a man who beat her is required to stay with him for the rest of her life. That is Catholic rules and I say FUCK. CATHOLIC. RULES. because of that. I have no respect for an organization that preaches forgiveness even in this life but holds nobody accountable in this life. Priests rape boys and husbands beat wives. Their answer is to stick with them.

My mom got an anullment from her ex husband because he was a drunk. You officially do not know what you are talking about.

 

[fr33]

My mom got an anullment from her ex husband because he was a drunk. You officially do not know what you are talking about.

Luckily her ex husband agreed to the annulment. You obviously do not have any idea of how that works.

 

[heavenlyboy34]

It's a joke because that's how some people deal with a ridiculous organization. A woman who made a bad choice and married a man who beat her is required to stay with him for the rest of her life. That is Catholic rules and I say FUCK. CATHOLIC. RULES. because of that. I have no respect for an organization that preaches forgiveness even in this life but holds nobody accountable in this life. Priests rape boys and husbands beat wives. Their answer is to stick with them.