Did God make Atheists?

idiom

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Interesting article from a while back....

Our study data do not strongly support the idea that scientists simply drop their religious identities upon professional training, due to an inherent conflict between science and faith, or to institutional pressure to conform,

It appears that those from non-religious backgrounds disproportionately self-select into scientific professions. This may reflect the fact that there is tension between the religious tenets of some groups and the theories and methods of particular sciences and it contributes to the large number of non-religious scientists.

I think this reflects a pretty modern trend where the Church has turned its back on science out of some sort of fear of what it will find, when for the last millenia or so it has been the keeper of knowledge and at the cutting edge of science.

Churches should be handing out scholarships in Biology and such not hiding from the world. Most of the best universities in the world were founded by christians back in the dark foggy past.
 
Churches should be handing out scholarships in Biology and such not hiding from the world. Most of the best universities in the world were founded by christians back in the dark foggy past.

Yea it's too bad. If they believe God created everything, they should be even more interested in studying this stuff. Of course, there is the Institute for Creation Research, but those guys hardly qualify as scientists. I think Ken Ham only has a Bachelors.
 
Atheist.jpg
 
Rabid religionists create athiests -

They create the impression that you have to be insane to believe in God.
 
God Doesn't Believe in Atheists

Atheists do not exist. All "atheists" presuppose God to argue against God's existence. In effect, they have to borrow from the Christian worldview in order to make sense of their own. They do this in a number of ways. One example of this is in the natural sciences. In natural sciences, "atheists" use induction to make predictions about the nature of the universe and living organism. Induction is based on the idea that nature is uniform, and therefore, what happens in the future will be like the past. That is how predictability is ascertained to establish scientific laws.

However, in an "atheist" universe, there is no rational basis for them to assume induction, since in an "atheist" universe, nature is random and impersonal. For example, it can be equally possible in a given experiment that if you drop a ball that it can either go up or down in every trial, since nature is constantly changing without a standard interval.

Yet, "atheists" presume that nature is uniform, and therefore, they reason from past experiences that future ones (such as dropping a ball a hundred times to establish the law of gravity) will be the same in a given interval. They use induction. However, when they do so, they are no longer operating on "atheistic" assumptions about nature. In fact, they are acting like Christians, because in the Christian worldview, induction makes sense, since God has created the universe in a uniform and predictable pattern, governed by His laws imposed on what He created.

Romans 1:19-22 tells us,
Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them, for God hath showed it unto them. For the invisible things of Him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse. Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful, but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools... [Emphasis mine]
The "atheist" knows God, but he suppresses the truth about Him in his heart. He would rather hold the truth in unrighteousness, as Verse 18 in that same passage tells us, than bow down to the obvious and worship his Creator.

Yet, his use of induction in natural science, his use of deduction in logical analysis, and his appeals to morality all evidence that the "atheist" is really a theist, because the "atheist" worldview cannot account for such things in a consistent and objective manner. As I said before, the "atheist" must borrow those concepts from a Christian understanding of the universe. That is why God does not believe in atheists, and He has made Himself abundantly clear to all men, so that no man is without excuse.

So, does God create atheists? The answer is an emphatic no. The "atheist" naturally rejects God by his own volition, and he does so with the knowledge of God in his heart, however suppressed it may be. That is why "atheists" such as Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens always come across as people with these two basic but contradictory expressions in their thinking and writings:
  • "There is no God," and
  • "I hate Him."
 
Yawn, Here we go again. I foolishly clicked on to this thread. I hate myself when I do this.
 
Atheists do not exist.

Yes, we do, buddy. Our numbers are growing while yours are shrinking.

[url]http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2009-03-09-ARIS-faith-survey_N.htm[/URL]

However, in an "atheist" universe, there is no rational basis for them to assume induction, since in an "atheist" universe, nature is random and impersonal. For example, it can be equally possible in a given experiment that if you drop a ball that it can either go up or down in every trial, since nature is constantly changing without a standard interval.

Yet, "atheists" presume that nature is uniform, and therefore, they reason from past experiences that future ones (such as dropping a ball a hundred times to establish the law of gravity) will be the same in a given interval. They use induction. However, when they do so, they are no longer operating on "atheistic" assumptions about nature. In fact, they are acting like Christians, because in the Christian worldview, induction makes sense, since God has created the universe in a uniform and predictable pattern, governed by His laws imposed on what He created.

This is such bullshit. The belief that atheists believe the universe is "random" is widespread among ignorant religious zealots.

Physical laws are also not formulated in this matter. They are based on calculus and advanced mathematics, which are of course, applied logic. Put bluntly, your statements are clearly illogical.

Your little theorem can easily be applied to Zeus, Thor, Wotan, etc etc. It doesn't even help you, even if I assume that it's true, which I don't, and which it clearly isn't.

Your attempt to continuously apply some rip-off of Hoppe's argumentation ethic to apologize for your superstition is disingenuous and futile. No one but you is this desperate to keep your fairy tale alive.

Romans 1:19-22 tells us,

It doesn't "tell us" anything. It is a passage from a book written by Middle Eastern bigots and charlatans. It's pure bullshit. You might as well quote from Mao's Little Red Book. At least then we'd get some insight into history...

The "atheist" knows God, but he suppresses the truth about Him in his heart. He would rather hold the truth in unrighteousness, as Verse 18 in that same passage tells us, than bow down to the obvious and worship his Creator.

I suppress the truth in my heart?
I don't like to talk about it, but when I was younger I was a devout Christian much like yourself, and I can tell you I did much more "suppressing of truth" back then than I've ever done since.

On that note, it is in no way "obvious" that an invisible man lives in the sky, and knows everything, controls everything, and creates everything, yet somehow leaves not a strand of empirical evidence. I'd sooner become a Sun worshiper than a Christian. At least I can see the sun. (and yes, I stole that from Carlin)

As I said before, the "atheist" must borrow those concepts from a Christian understanding of the universe.

So scientists must borrow concepts from superstition in order to arrive at scientific results?

Once again, you almost make me weep with your disregard for truth and reason. You can't write a single post with spouting off blatant contradictions.


So, does God create atheists? The answer is an emphatic no.

Couldn't agree with you more. "God" doesn't create anything. No such being exists.

The "atheist" naturally rejects God by his own volition, and he does so with the knowledge of God in his heart, however suppressed it may be. That is why "atheists" such as Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens always come across as people with these two basic but contradictory expressions in their thinking and writings:
  • "There is no God," and
  • "I hate Him."

Atheists cannot hate god. We don't believe it exists! How can we hate it? That makes absolutely no sense.

Also, stop speaking of Dawkins and Hitchens. You refuse to read Rothbard or Hoppe, let alone Dawkins or Hitchens. You're farrrrrrrrrrr too close-minded and lost to superstition to ever even consider reading The God Delusion, or a similar work. Do not speak about that which you are totally ignorant of.
 
Atheists do not exist. All "atheists" presuppose God to argue against God's existence. In effect, they have to borrow from the Christian worldview in order to make sense of their own.

This makes no sense. Why would you have to assume something is true in or argue that it is not true? I don't believe in leprechauns. Do I have to "presuppose" leprechauns to argue against their existence?

However, in an "atheist" universe, there is no rational basis for them to assume induction, since in an "atheist" universe, nature is random and impersonal. For example, it can be equally possible in a given experiment that if you drop a ball that it can either go up or down in every trial, since nature is constantly changing without a standard interval.

You have it completely backwards! Physicists have studied and measured the laws of the universe. The constant of gravity is not changing. However, in a universe where god exists and miracles happen, anything is possible.

They use induction. However, when they do so, they are no longer operating on "atheistic" assumptions about nature. In fact, they are acting like Christians, because in the Christian worldview, induction makes sense, since God has created the universe in a uniform and predictable pattern, governed by His laws imposed on what He created.

Using inductive reasoning does not mean one is acting like a Christian. Just because you believe in the laws of nature (such as gravity) doesn't mean you have to believe god put them in place.

You must read a lot of Christian apologist books.
 
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Atheists do not exist. All "atheists" presuppose God to argue against God's existence.



The arguments that can be used to defend Presuppositional, can also be used to more readily defend Naturalism.

I reject outright the metaphysical; or rather, anything that fails most basic foundations of empiricism.

Since god does not exist, it did not "make" anybody.
 
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You could also consider argument of reason... or a variant of the argument from non-belief and the atheist's wager...




* God's hiddenness is necessary on this account, since his presence would inspire people to behave as if good out of fear or selfish interests, not out of courage or compassion or a sense of personal integrity.

* A false, evil image of God in the bible is necessary in order to test whether the reader will place morality or faith first, so this tests moral courage in the face of assertions, threats and promises of reward. It also tests cognitive trustworthiness, since it is wrong to trust what someone merely wrote, over scientifically established truths and the direct evidence of reason and the senses.

* Natural evils and unchecked human evils are also necessary on this account, since only in such a way can a god "demonstrate" that no moral power is behind the universe, that there is no custodian, and by that means lead a rational, compassionate observer to conclude there is no god. If the universe were well-ordered, with inherent moral enforcement and the containment or restriction of evils, observers would conclude there is a god and thus, again, might act as if good out of fear or hope of reward.
 
You could also consider argument of reason... or a variant of the argument from non-belief and the atheist's wager...




* God's hiddenness is necessary on this account, since his presence would inspire people to behave as if good out of fear or selfish interests, not out of courage or compassion or a sense of personal integrity.

* A false, evil image of God in the bible is necessary in order to test whether the reader will place morality or faith first, so this tests moral courage in the face of assertions, threats and promises of reward. It also tests cognitive trustworthiness, since it is wrong to trust what someone merely wrote, over scientifically established truths and the direct evidence of reason and the senses.

* Natural evils and unchecked human evils are also necessary on this account, since only in such a way can a god "demonstrate" that no moral power is behind the universe, that there is no custodian, and by that means lead a rational, compassionate observer to conclude there is no god. If the universe were well-ordered, with inherent moral enforcement and the containment or restriction of evils, observers would conclude there is a god and thus, again, might act as if good out of fear or hope of reward.

You could also throw in the deist rational-

Like a watchmaker- God created the watch(universe) with all the mechanisms (laws of physics) wound it up (first motion), but then lets it run its course without intervention. all morality- good and evil- are the consequences of the matter that becomes animated and then makes choices.
 
You could also throw in the deist rational-

Like a watchmaker- God created the watch(universe) with all the mechanisms (laws of physics) wound it up (first motion), but then lets it run its course without intervention. all morality- good and evil- are the consequences of the matter that becomes animated and then makes choices.

That violates the second and third rule....
 
Yes, God gave you free will and you decided to be an atheist and not believe in God. It's your choice.

But if you don't believe in him don't expect him to believe in you either.

Oh and I love how atheists cling to mathematics....where do you think math came from? If God doesn't exist what USE is emotion? Love, hate, BEAUTY, the things that separate us from animals.

If God didnt exist we'd be just like animals instead of creating art and having the ability to appreciate beauty.
 
Yes, God gave you free will and you decided to be an atheist and not believe in God. It's your choice.

But if you don't believe in him don't expect him to believe in you either.

Oh and I love how atheists cling to mathematics....where do you think math came from? If God doesn't exist what USE is emotion? Love, hate, BEAUTY, the things that separate us from animals.

If God didnt exist we'd be just like animals instead of creating art and having the ability to appreciate beauty.

You strike me as someone who has never before heard an argument against your position, or having systematically chosen the darker side of unadulterated ignorance.
 
Morality exists more perfectly, more absolutely, when one acts morally without the knowledge that they are benefiting from the act.

Atheism has a stronger moral defense.

morality is subjective. so to KNOW you are moral is only to admit that you are holding your own standards.
Ayn Rand believes you can know morality using a system of values. Maybe she is right, but still, value is subjective.
People value things differently.
 
However, in an "atheist" universe, there is no rational basis for them to assume induction, since in an "atheist" universe, nature is random and impersonal. For example, it can be equally possible in a given experiment that if you drop a ball that it can either go up or down in every trial, since nature is constantly changing without a standard interval.

wtf?
 
Love, hate, BEAUTY, the things that separate us from animals.

Yes, we have complicated emotions such as love and hatred that animals do not have. There is no need for god to exist for this to be true.

If God didnt exist we'd be just like animals instead of creating art and having the ability to appreciate beauty.

Why? God does not have to exist for people to create art and appreciate beauty.
 
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