Daily Kos: I Endorse Ron Paul & Why Progressives Should Support Him

yep... i only ask b/c he's a spiteful racist... and for this reason i do not understand why
the dems. would support him.
 
constituent said:
yep... i only ask b/c he's a spiteful racist... and for this reason i do not understand why
the dems. would support him.
Click to expand...

stefans was quoting someone else. The post illustrated that at least some of these people recognize the threat that Paul poses to the elections.
 
RichardC said:
Is their purpose to elect only Democrats? Or could their purpose be to elect honest public servants that truly serve the people?
Click to expand...

But that's just it, Richard. This was what finally did it for me. They openly state that the reason they don't allow any talk on Ron Paul is because their purpose is solely to get Democrats elected. Apparently this alone is reason enough for them to spew lies and hatred towards Ron Paul.

So long as the person has a "D" next to their name they're OK, but anyone with an "R" is inherently evil in their minds. Ironically, this simplistic view of good vs. evil is precisely what they condemn Bush for. Like I said, they've become what they hate.
 
yeah their only goal is to get democrats elected.
markos is a democratic strategist and has said himself that he isn't that interested in specific policy positions.
it seems to me the only reason they get involved in changing policies inside the democratic party is to make them more electable. or what they think is more electable.

I understand that this is quite a nice job for markos and there's a place for that in every party, but I don't understand why a site built around polling data and politics has such a huge following.
 
"Progressive" is a highly subjective term, let's not forget that horrible anti-statist who left his mark on the term Progressive a century ago...Fighting Bob LaFollette.
 
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why not spend your time on REAL VOTERS in your local area? or phone banking?

The less time I spend at the other sites, the more productive I am spreading the message!
 
RichardC said:
I basically agree with what you're saying, I've been in the same boat. I'd read some Kos and a little more Crooks and Liars, and I still read some C&L. But I've given up on the Kos website as anything more than a curiousity. They're imploding, and I don't think they see it. They are stuck in standard boxes of Right vs Left arguments, and RP has I think transcended that. He's shown us its possible to have a 3rd viewpoint, and I think a more valid one. His momentum is undeniable.

I still wouldn't push so hard back on Kos, and I'm trying to give them the benefit of the doubt. I see some of their members struggling with purpose, and this post on their site in support of RP, as misguided as the reasoning is, shows that they aren't yet done with this issue. Is their purpose to elect only Democrats? Or could their purpose be to elect honest public servants that truly serve the people?

On some issues, Kos could still prove to be an ally. Why drive them away? Politically, I'm not sure where I belong. I don't fit the nice little structures of these sites... if I were to post at Kos I'd get derided. When I post at C&L if I say anything even hinting at RP support, even when he's clearly right, I get labelled as a neocon shill. I think RP ought to have a very big tent because Constitutional issues cross party lines, and I think there could be more people like me floating around sites like Kos who just need to be shown the way.

I'm worried about partisanship and I don't think its a solution to anything. Kos drove to get the Democrats into congress in 2006 and for good reason, the Republican congress had proven unreliable. This is where we almost agree with a site like Kos- the dems were supposed to end the war and restore fiscal responsibility. That latter one sounds silly now, but just a year ago the Republicans were the party of "spend and spend" and the Democrats were viewed as the answer to their mad spending. They were also the candidates to restore honor and integrity to politics, with all the gay/underage/porn/prostitution scandals going on with the Repubs.

And a year later, things haven't really changed. The people at Kos, I think, are still trying to figure out what the hell happened. They put all this effort into the '06 Democrat resurgence, and they were backstabbed. The Dems haven't restored fiscal responsibility, if anything, they proved as bad or worse than the Repubs. They've done nothing to end the war, if anything escalate it. I actually think on the war issue, if you look at how Dems vote, they're very split on this. Too many of their own are falling into the neocon trap. I can only imagine how frustrating that failure must be (a microcosm of this Democrat identity crisis can be seen in the threats made by Sheehan to run against Pelosi).

The people at Kos have a great, honest candidate they could help propel into the front if they really believed in the courage of their convictions: Dennis Kucinich. But for whatever reason, they can't seem to make it happen. There's no real momentum, no real grassroots behind him, and they know it. It must be maddening. He's their only real anti-war candidate, the only true liberal, the only one calling for impeachment, and he's one of the few who actually reads and supports the constitution. His interpretation is populist and socialist, but at least he has an interpretation of it. So as flawed as this is, its still far ahead of the neocon agenda.

I still see potential for common ground here. Remember what they wanted was an end to the war and an end to crazy spending. Well, RP offers that. Everyone has to compromise a little, but I think RP ultimately appeals to rational people who aren't so partisan. And who wants to be partisan really. If you dig into their goals a little bit, you can usually discern the key issues that make them believe what it is they think they believe, and then you can begin to help them out of this insane partisan quagmire they've gotten themselves into.
Click to expand...

Great post man - certainly feel free to post more often

;)
 
Daily Kos is losing converts as we speak, and he's worried. Why do you think he's stepping up the hit pieces?

Many Dems are beginning to see the light.

I'm sure there are a lot of Ron Paul supporters who previously voted for Bush and Co.

Wasn't everyone a little crazy before they found out about Ron Paul?
 
Ozwest said:
Daily Kos is losing converts as we speak, and he's worried. Why do you think he's stepping up the hit pieces?

Many Dems are beginning to see the light.

I'm sure there are a lot of Ron Paul supporters who previously voted for Bush and Co.

Wasn't everyone a little crazy before they found out about Ron Paul?
Click to expand...
From the comments there on this post, which wasn't even pro-RP, it looks like they absolutely hate RP and his message of freedom. They appear to be the socialist fringe of the Democratic party.

I do agree that many Dems can be convinced to vote for RP, but can we say the same for DailyKos posters?
 
RichardC said:
I basically agree with what you're saying, I've been in the same boat. I'd read some Kos and a little more Crooks and Liars, and I still read some C&L. But I've given up on the Kos website as anything more than a curiousity. They're imploding, and I don't think they see it. They are stuck in standard boxes of Right vs Left arguments, and RP has I think transcended that. He's shown us its possible to have a 3rd viewpoint, and I think a more valid one. His momentum is undeniable.

I still wouldn't push so hard back on Kos, and I'm trying to give them the benefit of the doubt. I see some of their members struggling with purpose, and this post on their site in support of RP, as misguided as the reasoning is, shows that they aren't yet done with this issue. Is their purpose to elect only Democrats? Or could their purpose be to elect honest public servants that truly serve the people?

On some issues, Kos could still prove to be an ally. Why drive them away? Politically, I'm not sure where I belong. I don't fit the nice little structures of these sites... if I were to post at Kos I'd get derided. When I post at C&L if I say anything even hinting at RP support, even when he's clearly right, I get labelled as a neocon shill. I think RP ought to have a very big tent because Constitutional issues cross party lines, and I think there could be more people like me floating around sites like Kos who just need to be shown the way.

I'm worried about partisanship and I don't think its a solution to anything. Kos drove to get the Democrats into congress in 2006 and for good reason, the Republican congress had proven unreliable. This is where we almost agree with a site like Kos- the dems were supposed to end the war and restore fiscal responsibility. That latter one sounds silly now, but just a year ago the Republicans were the party of "spend and spend" and the Democrats were viewed as the answer to their mad spending. They were also the candidates to restore honor and integrity to politics, with all the gay/underage/porn/prostitution scandals going on with the Repubs.

And a year later, things haven't really changed. The people at Kos, I think, are still trying to figure out what the hell happened. They put all this effort into the '06 Democrat resurgence, and they were backstabbed. The Dems haven't restored fiscal responsibility, if anything, they proved as bad or worse than the Repubs. They've done nothing to end the war, if anything escalate it. I actually think on the war issue, if you look at how Dems vote, they're very split on this. Too many of their own are falling into the neocon trap. I can only imagine how frustrating that failure must be (a microcosm of this Democrat identity crisis can be seen in the threats made by Sheehan to run against Pelosi).

The people at Kos have a great, honest candidate they could help propel into the front if they really believed in the courage of their convictions: Dennis Kucinich. But for whatever reason, they can't seem to make it happen. There's no real momentum, no real grassroots behind him, and they know it. It must be maddening. He's their only real anti-war candidate, the only true liberal, the only one calling for impeachment, and he's one of the few who actually reads and supports the constitution. His interpretation is populist and socialist, but at least he has an interpretation of it. So as flawed as this is, its still far ahead of the neocon agenda.

I still see potential for common ground here. Remember what they wanted was an end to the war and an end to crazy spending. Well, RP offers that. Everyone has to compromise a little, but I think RP ultimately appeals to rational people who aren't so partisan. And who wants to be partisan really. If you dig into their goals a little bit, you can usually discern the key issues that make them believe what it is they think they believe, and then you can begin to help them out of this insane partisan quagmire they've gotten themselves into.
Click to expand...

I do respect Kucinich, he is certainly a decent, honest man, I have to admit it would be nice to see him get a foothold in the democractic party just for the possibility of having a real debate of philosophy and interchange of ideas between him and Paul. I swear if those two went around the country putting on a barnstorming debate tour they would raise the collective IQ of this country. We could have our first real honest election in over a century...aww idealism. :rolleyes: There would be no attack ads, no venom back and forth, just a real exchange of ideas. And you know what at the end of the day, they would probably find a place for each other in their administration. In fact Kucinich has said he would like Ron Paul as a running mate here in this video. Thanks for the kind words about our guy Dennis. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=py8cXlLyX18
 
Eric21ND said:
I do respect Kucinich, he is certainly a decent, honest man, I have to admit it would be nice to see him get a foothold in the democractic party just for the possibility of having a real debate of philosophy and interchange of ideas between him and Paul. I swear if those two went around the country putting on a barnstorming debate tour they would raise the collective IQ of this country. We could have our first real honest election in over a century...aww idealism. :rolleyes: There would be no attack ads, no venom back and forth, just a real exchange of ideas. And you know what at the end of the day, they would probably find a place for each other in their administration. In fact Kucinich has said he would like Ron Paul as a running mate here in this video. Thanks for the kind words about our guy Dennis. :)
Click to expand...

I agree with this 100%. I'm supporting RP beyond a doubt, but I also think a Paul vs Kucinich candidacy would have the real added benefit of educating people and would raise our collective IQ quite a bit. It's my dream debate. We would see real issues discussed for the first time in a long time.

I think kucinich proves there is room to interpret the constitution with a liberal/populist slant. He takes the document very seriously and is definitely not just paying it lip service.

Obama is my 2nd choice in this regard. He was a civil rights lawyer and has taught constitutional law coming from a harvard background. Despite what some people would tell you, he's no slouch when it comes to the teachings of the Constitution. I have no doubt that in a fair RP vs Obama debate on the Constitution, Obama would get schooled =) But it would be a healthy debate and a debate on issues. It would just help expose the weaknesses of a liberal/welfarism interpretation of our federal government, and I have no doubt that open minded and thinking progressives would come to the RP camp in droves.

I think right now we stand a decent chance of getting a RP vs Obama election, provided the Dems can get their act together and support a semi-honest candidate.
 
We are fucking killing them!!

Left and right! they are gettign all sorts of fucked up and they know it. They are doing everything they can to discourage us. The left wants to tell us its their turn now, because the republicans got 8 years, and the rigth just want to keep their war.

This is so funny, they say he can't win, but they are scared.... they are very afraid.
 
I live in Brazil, welcome to my world. I'm surrounded by the same kind of political stupidity you guys see on DailyKos.com. Socialism and statism is almost the norm, libertarian thinking is mostly extinct. You find this in universities, where you would expect people to have some intelligence.

It's why I love the Ron Paul Revolution so much, they're slowly bringing back libertarianism to the spotlight. Maybe, just maybe, when America prospers with President Ron Paul, we'll learn by example.
 
gtjwkq said:
I live in Brazil, welcome to my world. I'm surrounded by the same kind of political stupidity you guys see on DailyKos.com. Socialism and statism is almost the norm, libertarian thinking is mostly extinct. You find this in universities, where you would expect people to have some intelligence.

It's why I love the Ron Paul Revolution so much, they're slowly bringing back libertarianism to the spotlight. Maybe, just maybe, when America prospers with President Ron Paul, we'll learn by example.
Click to expand...
Let's hope so! It's been great to hear from freedom lovers all over the world during this campaign.
 
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